FM3 Firmware Version 5.00 beta 1

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On the virtual capo issue…here’s my 10 pence worth. Have never used one or missed one. Possibly because the bands I play in are all large multi instrument ensembles where the guitar will not be the only instrument holding the harmony and they all play originals and it’s up to me to work out my guitar parts…I just use the whole neck. The reality that my fm3 (which I love) does not have as good a virtual capo makes no practical difference to me. It’s does give me a little bit of GAS however and when the FM9 makes it to the uk I will definitely buy one…and not use the virtual capo on that either🤪. However I do think it’s a bit ‘un fractal like’ to have a lower level of functionality and quality of effect on one of their units. What I mean by this is that it makes total sense for the fm3 to have only one amp block (not two amp blocks done badly)….the VC sounds like it’s in the ‘two blocks done badly’ category. It’s not a cut down function, it’s a same function done not as well. The FM3 doesn’t have the capability to do full res irs…it doesn’t try and do them at a lower level, it just doesn’t do them. On the other hand it does do the reverb up to full quality…even though the processor load means you will have to sacrifice some other stuff. There is the option to lower quality, but if you want it at top quality it’s there. I suppose what I am trying to say is what I love about fractal is when they do something they do it right. This feels like a slight deviation from this philosophy. Not that I care really…would never use a virtual capo, will buy an FM9 and not use a virtual capo…and will definitely keep my fm3. Looking forward to updating when the full release comes out. Gigging all the time so don’t want to risk the beta. Love Fractal.
This is an interesting sentiment, and I agree with your logic. I think the difference may be that the virtual cap existed in another form before being optimized for the FM9 and AX3. Because of that fact, they did all used to be at the same level, if I'm not mistaken. The only solution to that would be to remove a feature for the FM3 that was already present. I don't personally use the VC, so that wouldn't matter to me, but I don't see the point in removing a feature unless it is necessary.
 
Just did the update, getting ready to fire it up now. I notice that the new editor take a while with the "Reading block strings..." message (or something like that. Seems ok afterwards though.
 
Seems like you put a volume block or something like that in parallel with the pitch block and use envelope as a level modifier to fade between the un-pitched volume block and the pitch block such that the volume block got the initial attack with no latency and the pitch block picked up after that- basically covering up the latency on attack as I understand it.

I completely forgot about this work around. It was a trick I used often on the AxeFX2 to in order to deal with latency.

It works by letting the untouched pick attack through the path, allowing the pitched note to take over.

The trick was setting up an ADSR triggered by the appropriate threshold on the volume block just to let the first few milliseconds of the note pick through.

Worth trying…👍
 
[…] it makes total sense for the fm3 to have only one amp block (not two amp blocks done badly)….[…] The FM3 doesn’t have the capability to do full res irs…it doesn’t try and do them at a lower level, it just doesn’t do them. […] what I am trying to say is what I love about fractal is when they do something they do it right. This feels like a slight deviation from this philosophy. […]
Which philosophy is it you want them to follow? One amp, not two done badly? Don't even offer something like Full-Res IR if it won't fit? Or, like reverb, allow better with extremely reduced layouts, OK with a couple more blocks or economical and still a few more blocks? Currently it's basically the first, they crammed what they could in and future developments might allow improvement.

Fractal is all about the quality of the sound. Even the Economy reverb is very good and in a band setting in a normal venue is indistinguishable from Normal. The single amp block is to allow the expected amp modeling quality, while leaving room over for the reverb modeling because they run in the same chip. There's not enough CPU available for two amps and the days of allowing two but with reduced quality are gone; They've been there and done that. And, Full-Res IRs require more CPU and memory than the Ultra-Res, on a device that's already constrained, so that was a non-starter; That they managed to get the FX3 Mk I to handle them was a real chore and great surprise to the community, and it has about 4x the CPU power and twice the user cab slots of the FM3.

Fractal has done a great job positioning the three units, and they're not frivolously picking and choosing features. They fit in what they can given the hardware's capabilities, and then start optimizing to make even more fit in.
 
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Just did the update, getting ready to fire it up now. I notice that the new editor take a while with the "Reading block strings..." message (or something like that. Seems ok afterwards though.
Yes, it's reading every block and learning the parameters. It takes just over 90 seconds on an iMac Pro and occurs when a new firmware version is sensed. And, you can force it to occur if it seems like the editor should be picking something up but doesn't display it correctly.
 
Wow my Deluxe Reverb preset went from pretty good to GREAT! The Maxoff 808 is finally the go-to drive that I have been looking for in this unit. The compressors, something I have been less than impressed with sound nice and juicy now. I am a compressor junky so THANK YOU! And the reverbs, I can now use Normal instead of economy and I'm still under 80% with comp>drive>chorus>amp>cab(Ultra-stereo)>PanTrem>Delay>Reverb. Very nice! Thank you FAS! :)
 
Honestly i was also expecting an updated VC, but the feature set of updates is really a lot of improvement of an already top notch unit. I have owned a FXII & MC101, than an AX-8, sold that for the FM3 with no regrets. So that the FM3 might not get an further improved virtual capo in future, might then result for myself in buying an aditional guitar, maybe a Baritone or a fixed Bridge Axe with longer scale and adjust settings for low tunings.... only 1st world problems of course, but those can be solved. I am happy with the FM3 and I don't need more features as the unit currently has already onboard. I understand all of you who use drop pedals now and gig heavily that they don’t want to carry additional gear with them on the road that they desperate have been hoping for the vc improvement. If the cpu in the fm3 is lacking of processing power to fulfill the effect in a „usable“ way then either we have to upgrade fractal gear or we have a good excuse for GAS…
 
Which philosophy is it you want them to follow? One amp, not two done badly? Don't even offer something like Full-Res IR if it won't fit? Or, like reverb, allow better with extremely reduced layouts, OK with a couple more blocks or economical and still a few more blocks? Currently it's basically the first, they crammed what they could in and future developments might allow improvement.

Fractal is all about the quality of the sound. Even the Economy reverb is very good and in a band setting in a normal venue is indistinguishable from Normal. The single amp block is to allow the expected amp modeling quality, while leaving room over for the reverb modeling because they run in the same chip. There's not enough CPU available for two amps and the days of allowing two but with reduced quality are gone; They've been there and done that. And, Full-Res IRs require more CPU and memory than the Ultra-Res, on a device that's already constrained, so that was a non-starter; That they managed to get the FX3 Mk I to handle them was a real chore and great surprise to the community, and it has about 4x the CPU power and twice the user cab slots of the FM3.

Fractal has done a great job positioning the three units, and they're not frivolously picking and choosing features. They fit in what they can given the hardware's capabilities, and then start optimizing to make even more fit in.
For me it would always be same quality….differing functionality between the units. I totally agree that fractal do a really good job at this, also those two categories above are somewhat arbitrary, open to differing opinion and definitely overlap. It would appear that this is basically fractals philosophy as well. The VC however is now same functionality at differing quality. I agree with the comment on this thread that this is probably just a result of the history of the development of the pitch block and probably not a change in philosophy. It would be pointless to remove it, and only change or reduce its functionality if that frees up space and power to make the pitch block do ‘less’ at lower quality. You can probably tell from my posting that I am no software engineer! That last sentence might just betray my ignorance of how this stuff works🤪
 
I’m disappointed that they couldn't make the virtual capo work, but really pleased at all the goodies in the update. In the grand scheme of things, it is more important to have as much sound/patch compatibility as possible across the product line.

Perhaps there will eventually be a way to make a FM3 virtual capo that is less flexible that the Ax3/FM9 version, but higher quality than the current FM3 version. I think the most important use cases are to go up or down a half step or a whole step. Perhaps it will be possible to optimize the code for those cases and get it to work on the FM3.
 
There’s an odd sense of entitlement that has been a rather unfortunate offshoot of having a company that delivers so much. Nothing is ever promised to us and as a result, everything is over-delivered with these updates but it seems to have created this idea that everything is possible on all three units when the only thing stated up front was that the FM3/FM9 will not be able to compete with the CPU power of the III.

Couple that entitlement with some stunted emotional development and you have this grave
sense of being wounded by what a firmware update doesn't include.

Decline of Western Civilization Much??? :)
 
LOL. Oh, I don't deny it! And if they had stopped improving the amps, and gave us an excellent Virtual Capo and a UI screen I can see with my bad eyesight, I would be all for it.
And of course, my comment was not meant to say "don't improve anything." But I think it is legitimate to favor improving something that might not be usable in a live situation for many right now vs. other minor sound enhancements.
It's at least a debatable point, right?

But what if you and your wish/needs put you in the clear minourity?

You are stating your needs regarding an improved VC over other updates
and seeming to assume that everyone else wants the same trade-off simply
because you do.

Pretty sure that's not even close to being the case, though. :)
 
You make several good points. But can you imagine going into a Mercedes dealer and finding that their C-class doesn't have air-conditioning?
It all comes down to how important the Virtual Capo is to your performance. To some it is far more important than other features that continually get updated.

Again. :) The VC improvements are super CPU intensive, otherwise they would have happened
by now. The improvements you don't seem to want, but which happen anyways, are less CPU
intensive at the current point in time, which is why they happen.
 
You got me. I, without question, am biased toward that particular improvement, along with a couple others. But I could easily counter that those 25 people on the forum are far more than those who were asking for many of the improvements we HAVE seen go into the FM3. Look down that list of improvements and ask yourself how many of them were called for by more than 25 people. A couple, maybe? So there is more than one way to look at those statistics. And VC improvements were one of the most repeated wishes for the AXE3 prior to it happening, too.
I do find it fascinating to see how many people want to invalidate those 25 or so members of the community, however.

You are totally ignorant of the CPU requirements to make ANY update possible, and yet you
want to harp on repeatedly about how some updates should be sacrificed for the one you want

You are simply NOT smarter about any of this than Fractal is. Sorry. :)

And on one is invalidating anyone else here. That is the kind of emotional argument that gets tossed
around on forums like this when people are basically trying to get someone to accept what reality currently
is. None of this is personal---unless we take it like that. We each have to find a way to deal with our expectations
when reality doesn't match them. No one here, or anywhere else, gets a pass on that. :)
 
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Call me ignorant, but what is wrong with the VC? Latency? Tracking of single notes or polyphonic tracking?
are there drop pedals that are “perfect”?
why not bring one extra guitar to the gig or one of those pedals. Frankly, is anything as good as a tuned guitar anyway?
 
Couple that entitlement with some stunted emotional development and you have this grave
sense of being wounded by what a firmware update doesn't include.

Decline of Western Civilization Much??? :)
I don't feel entitled to get my wishes at all. I own both an AXE3 and an FM3 and enjoy them both. I will continue to advocate for the improvements I'd like to see, and hope you do the same. And I hope that when you ask for an improvement, you get it. I'll be happy for you.
As for the decline of Western Civilization, I feel terrible that I am responsible for that, or that my desire to have an FM3 feature is indicative of such a decline. Please apologize to Western Civilization for me. I'll try to do better.
By the way, I recommend watching "The Decline of Western Civilization." Cool documentary about the 80s LA punk scene.
 
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anyone else notice the headphone out not working? I am getting sound from the unit just not through headphones directly from the unit, and yes it was working before the update
 
Old school marking the test paper.
98% for clearly moving an already awesome device forward, showing your work and clearly audible exemplary achievements!
-2% for VC.
My guess, extrapolating from Admins post, that we'll see some VC improvements.
So maybe 99% getting partial Ax3 VC refinements.
It is what it is, if I really needed the best VC available I could upgrade.
Theres so many new options just added to fill my limited brain to keep me occupied.
Sounds like some updates yet still to come.
I’m enjoying what we have now in the FM3, we are so fortunate.
gracias to the Fractal FM3 team!
 
Bravo on the new looper feature. Switch activated loop decay (fade out) next?

I sense that this is Looper version 1.01. First, limit the loop to 120 seconds and then add features in future releases.
 
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