Factory Preset 12 (USA Mk IV) copy sounds different when unit is booted

J

johnmarc

Member
Please check me out on this, to see if I'm doing something wrong.

I copied factory preset 12 (USA Mk IV) to use Scene 1 as the basis for a clean tone. I needed to turn the Axe-FX off to do something, and left the active preset as the copy of preset 12.

When I turned the Axe-FX on later, the preset had higher treble content than I remembered. I switched to another preset, and back to the copy of preset 12, and it sounded as I remembered, as well as like the original preset 12. The same behavior happened after I made some simple edits to the copy of preset 12.

Doing the same power cycling on the original preset 12 doesn't cause the tone of that preset to change.

Any ideas? Anyone willing to try to reproduce this on their Axe-FX? The only reason I'm concerned is that if I use preset 12 as my basis for a custom preset, when I'd have to be aware not to turn the Axe-FX on while that preset is selected.

Many thanks, John
 
If you saved in a different state than the original, this would happen. Or your MIDI controller is turning off/on something not there before.
 
Amp resolution, it did that to me when I loaded up a second amp block... deleted second amp block and high end clarity came back. Hit or miss if you can recreate it though
 
electronpirate said:
If you saved in a different state than the original, this would happen. Or your MIDI controller is turning off/on something not there before.
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Thanks. I copied/pasted using Axe Manage in Axe Edit. I've got an FC 12 hooked up. But no changes or "save" command were done.
 
I noticed this as well... I wasn't really convinced, but since you are experiencing it too... we can't be both crazy right?

There is some kind of difference between booting to a preset vs switching to a preset.

If you are able to reproduce the issue consistently between 2 presets, I'd recommend posting the presets that way someone else can confirm.
 
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Surjikal said:
I noticed this as well... I wasn't really convinced, but since you are experiencing it too... we can't be both crazy right?

There is some kind of difference between booting to a preset vs switching to a preset.

If you are able to reproduce the issue consistently between 2 presets, I'd recommend posting the presets that way someone else can confirm.
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Good idea. I just tried the same copy/paste using Factory Preset 18 (Shiver)...pasted to preset slot 450, and left preset 450 selected when powering down the Axe-Fx. Upon booting up, I had the same enhanced treble. Once I changed to preset slot 451, and back to preset slot 450 to the copied/pasted Shiver preset, it sounded normal, like the original Preset 18. This doesn't happen when booting to Preset 18 iniially, only once the preset is copied/pasted, if booting up to the pasted preset. Same behavior as with Factory Preset 12 noted in the first post.

Since these are factory presets, I won't post them! :)
 
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Do the presets have Controllers assigned? Perhaps a Wah block that is expecting an expression pedal attached, and you don't have one?
 
unix-guy said:
Do the presets have Controllers assigned? Perhaps a Wah block that is expecting an expression pedal attached, and you don't have one?
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Good question. These are unaltered copies of the factory presets 12 and 18, and there may be some controllers assigned. I do have an expression pedal attached to the FC12.

But it's puzzling to me why the treble is enhanced when booting to an unaltered copy of factory presets, then switching from that copy and back to it removes the enhanced treble, restoring the tone of the original factory preset. Also, booting to a different preset, then switching to the aforementioned copy, sounds like the original factory preset.

Anyway, if anyone is able to do what I've mentioned above and not have the enhanced treble, I'd like to know, so I can learn what I'm doing wrong. Thanks!
 
johnmarc said:
Good question. These are unaltered copies of the factory presets 12 and 18, and there may be some controllers assigned. I do have an expression pedal attached to the FC12.

But it's puzzling to me why the treble is enhanced when booting to an unaltered copy of factory presets, then switching from that copy and back to it removes the enhanced treble, restoring the tone of the original factory preset. Also, booting to a different preset, then switching to the aforementioned copy, sounds like the original factory preset.

Anyway, if anyone is able to do what I've mentioned above and not have the enhanced treble, I'd like to know, so I can learn what I'm doing wrong. Thanks!
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Boot on the preset and see if the Wah is engaged... Also, the same thing should happen if you boot on the factory preset.

Some of the presets expect External 1 to exist. With the FC you can use the pedals as FC pedal #x or you can map that to External x. So depending on which port you used and how you have it setup it may still not be what is expected.

If the Wah IS engaged, try removing the modifier or change it to use your expression pedal. The problem should go away.
 
I agree that it could be something with the controllers that don't get copied over. I would actually try to delete everything (or even just the wah), but keep the amp and cab, then do the copy and see if you still get the same problem.
 
unix-guy said:
Boot on the preset and see if the Wah is engaged... Also, the same thing should happen if you boot on the factory preset.

Some of the presets expect External 1 to exist. With the FC you can use the pedals as FC pedal #x or you can map that to External x. So depending on which port you used and how you have it setup it may still not be what is expected.

If the Wah IS engaged, try removing the modifier or change it to use your expression pedal. The problem should go away.
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This enhanced treble behavior doesn't happen when booting to the original factory presets that I've looked at, and the wah is still bypassed in the copy of the presets.

I'll check the actual pedal map and report back.
 
Surjikal said:
I agree that it could be something with the controllers that don't get copied over. I would actually try to delete everything (or even just the wah), but keep the amp and cab, then do the copy and see if you still get the same problem.
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I'll give that a try. I'll delete all but the amp and cab in preset 12, copy and paste it to a new slot, and boot to the copy and report back.
 
Tried it here with preset 12 ( saved to new location rebooted) no change here.
 
Surjikal said:
I agree that it could be something with the controllers that don't get copied over. I would actually try to delete everything (or even just the wah), but keep the amp and cab, then do the copy and see if you still get the same problem.
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I was not saying anything about controllers not get copied. I am referring to a specific problem that has been previously reported with factory presets that "expect" an external controller to be connected.

If you copy and save a preset with no other changes, all the modifiers will be identical.

OP - the best advice if this is NOT the issue is to upload the copied preset. Someone can check it out.
 
unix-guy said:
I was not saying anything about controllers not get copied. I am referring to a specific problem that has been previously reported with factory presets that "expect" an external controller to be connected.

If you copy and save a preset with no other changes, all the modifiers will be identical.

OP - the best advice if this is NOT the issue is to upload the copied preset. Someone can check it out.
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OK, I've found the issue. First, my reply to @unix-guy in post #11 was incorrect; that will teach me to do things from memory...sorry.

Here's the scoop. Both of the presets I checked (12 and 18) have a bypassed wah block. The wah block has the autoengage feature enabled, and the pedal is External 1. If I boot to the original or the copy with the FC-12 connected, I can watch the wah block engage on Axe Edit, with or without a pedal attached. If I boot to the original or the copy with the FC-12 disconnected, the wah block remains bypassed.

So, the enhanced treble was indeed due to the wah block being engaged (as @unix-guy suspected), but this only happens when the FC-12 is connected (with or without a pedal attached). Also, if the autoengage function is disabled in the wah block, the wah block doesn't engage with the FC-12 connected (obviously).

All my experience with the factory presets had been prior to getting the FC-12, or not booting to a factory preset once the FC-12 was connected. Why its presence (with or without a pedal attached) causes the autoengage to occur is a separate situation that may or may not warrant attention. Also, why the wah block autoengages when booting to the preset, and then doesn't autoengage when switching from the preset and back to it is puzzling to me, but then again, a lot of the world puzzles me...

So, the solution for me is to disable the autoengage function on the wah block, or remove the wah block entirely.

Thanks for all the suggestions and your patience! John
 
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johnmarc said:
OK, I've found the issue. First, my reply to @unix-guy in post #11 was incorrect; that will teach me to do things from memory...sorry.

Here's the scoop. Both of the presets I checked (12 and 18) have a bypassed wah block. The wah block has the autoengage feature enabled, and the pedal is External 1. If I boot to the original or the copy with the FC-12 connected, I can watch the wah block engage on Axe Edit, with or without a pedal attached. If I boot to the original or the copy with the FC-12 disconnected, the wah block remains bypassed.

So, the enhanced treble was indeed due to the wah block being engaged (as @unix-guy suspected), but this only happens when the FC-12 is connected (with or without a pedal attached). Also, if the autoengage function is disabled in the wah block, the wah block doesn't engage with the FC-12 connected (obviously).

All my experience with the factory presets had been prior to getting the FC-12, or not booting to a factory preset once the FC-12 was connected. Why its presence (with or without a pedal attached) causes the autoengage to occur is a separate situation that may or may not warrant attention. Also, why the wah block autoengages when booting to the preset, and then doesn't autoengage when switching from the preset and back to it is puzzling to me, but then again, a lot of the world puzzles me...

So, the solution for me is to disable the autoengage function on the wah block, or remove the wah block entirely.

Thanks for all the suggestions and your patience! John
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The reason is doesn't happen when you change to the preset is because PC Reset is ON and the preset is saved with the effect off.

When you attach a controller pedal, the modifier initial state is what is triggering it during boot. I don't remember the exact reason... But there is an explanation.
 
shatteredsquare said:
Amp resolution, it did that to me when I loaded up a second amp block... deleted second amp block and high end clarity came back. Hit or miss if you can recreate it though
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I have heard no mention of Amp resolution being reduced on Axe Fx III when a 2nd amp block is added.

That is an Axe Fx II thing as far as I know.
 
unix-guy said:
The reason is doesn't happen when you change to the preset is because PC Reset is ON and the preset is saved with the effect off.

When you attach a controller pedal, the modifier initial state is what is triggering it during boot. I don't remember the exact reason... But there is an explanation.
Click to expand...

I checked the modifier settings for the wah block for the 2 presets in question, and PC Reset is Off. But...with or without a pedal attached, the control is at maximum. So, given that the modifier initial state is triggered during boot with the FC-12 attached, I guess that explains what I encountered. Certainly an easy fix (disable the auto engage), and I thank you for your help!
 
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