Dyna Cabs...why don't I get it?

I think one of the difficulties people have with digital modelers generally, and the Axe stuff specifically, is because there are so many options, you feel like you need to use every one, or update every setting/parameter to the latest and greatest most-flexible version. The reality is, if you found your tone and you really dig it, making changes may be moving you in the wrong direction.
That said, I'm really looking forward to trying Dyna-cabs once it's out of beta - the theory sounds amazing, will be fun to see how it plays out in practice.
 
Well Dynacabs are IR's, and it will certainly be easier to dial in the tone i want as opposed to 1,000 separate IR's in a folder, in which i have no idea how they sound and I certainly wont go through a whole bunch thats for sure
that being said I'm sure for some that have already found IR's that work for them i can see that they would find DC a somewhat non essential feature
I hope most keep in mind that the Fractal is designed for everyone, I for one Am very happy that they implemented this feature
Great for some and not so much for others
 
AZG said:
I would love to see some classic mic mixes added to the dynacab block. Something users can quickly flip through and see if one is a good starting point.
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That's what we already have with static IRs. Ideal placement of mics to a cab with an easy way to audition different ones.

If folks can't find what something they like by moving mics around, then dyna maybe wasn't useful for some in the first place. The joy of dyna is exactly that, a new kind of variety. There's 100% nothing wrong with that or just sticking to trusty IRs. Dyna is just another way to get "there", it's not better or worse.

I think an unconscious framing of new = better is an issue here.
People trying to make something work to solve for a challenge they didn't have is rarely going to be fun!

You aren't missing out if you don't use dyna. Dyna is for people that like moving mics around, which isn't everyone, nor should it be.
Most folks here are players, not producers.
 
I'm looking forward to seeing a few good DC presets shared. I have dialed in a few good tones with the DC, however with my every day live and studio presets I can't get anything as good as the IRs I am using. So far, at least.
 
WelshLukather said:
I've tried (and I'm used to micing proper cabs)but I just can't get on with the concept, or even understand why they are there..its just more option overload and an even bigger Rabbit Hole than the IR one..

Struggled all weekend with Dyna Cabs, tried everything I can think of and switching back to a Legacy/Regular IR resulted in instant gratification and just blew DC's out of the water - OK, familiarity and all that comes into play I appreciate that, but I just don't get it..

Anyone else feel the same or am I missing something?

Popcorn available...:laughing:
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Dynacabs are not magic that will make your tone better. They're still IR's. It doesn't present more options, it just presents a better way to explore your options.

In other words, if you're already happy with your tone, you're not likely to find Dynacabs give you something you don't already have. However, if you're in search of a tone, dragging a mic around is generally considered a better way to explore IR's than stepping through a tedious list of thousands of choices.
 
GlennO said:
Dynacabs are not magic that will make your tone better. They're still IR's. It doesn't present more options, it just presents a better way to explore your options.

In other words, if you're already happy with your tone, you're not likely to find Dynacabs give you something you don't already have. However, if you're in search of a tone, dragging a mic around is generally considered a better way to explore IR's than stepping through a tedious list of thousands of choices.
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4+ years with my Fractal products, still haven't experienced, or expected, magic. Still, when you stumble on a really good IR you have what feels like a great starting point. A few factory presets that use DCs might offer that starting point for some of us.
 
WelshLukather said:
I've tried (and I'm used to micing proper cabs)but I just can't get on with the concept, or even understand why they are there..its just more option overload and an even bigger Rabbit Hole than the IR one..

Struggled all weekend with Dyna Cabs, tried everything I can think of and switching back to a Legacy/Regular IR resulted in instant gratification and just blew DC's out of the water - OK, familiarity and all that comes into play I appreciate that, but I just don't get it..

Anyone else feel the same or am I missing something?

Popcorn available...:laughing:
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Dyna cabs are just IRs so maybe if I were building tones from scratch I would use them or try them to hone in on what I'm after. For the presets that I have already created with the Fractal former or 3rd party IRs, I won't be touching them. Like I said, Dyna cabs are just IRs and I wouldn't go back to my main presets that I already like to simply swap them all out because it's the new thing. The legacy MRBW #37 is still one of my go to IRs and that was grandfathered from the AX8. lol. Other than that OWN, York and ML have been making terrific IRs for years.
 
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WelshLukather said:
I've tried (and I'm used to micing proper cabs)but I just can't get on with the concept, or even understand why they are there..its just more option overload and an even bigger Rabbit Hole than the IR one..

Struggled all weekend with Dyna Cabs, tried everything I can think of and switching back to a Legacy/Regular IR resulted in instant gratification and just blew DC's out of the water - OK, familiarity and all that comes into play I appreciate that, but I just don't get it..

Anyone else feel the same or am I missing something?

Popcorn available...:laughing:
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Same feeling.
 
WelshLukather said:
I've tried (and I'm used to micing proper cabs)but I just can't get on with the concept, or even understand why they are there..its just more option overload and an even bigger Rabbit Hole than the IR one..

Struggled all weekend with Dyna Cabs, tried everything I can think of and switching back to a Legacy/Regular IR resulted in instant gratification and just blew DC's out of the water - OK, familiarity and all that comes into play I appreciate that, but I just don't get it..
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Nobody is being forced into using them. The default choice is the original “Legacy” interface, factory and user cabs, so the system and interface is as it always was.

If the Legacy interface is difficult or confusing then perhaps find a single factory preset that sounds the way that’s desired and save the Cab block to the block library and reuse it. It can’t get simpler than that except by removing undesired blocks and saving the preset as a template and using the template always, or simply using the factory preset only.

WelshLukather said:
Anyone else feel the same or am I missing something?
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Yes. To both.

People feel the same and you are missing something.

Dyna-Cabs came about because the ones who wanted that type of interface repeatedly requested it for years. Cliff listened, thought about what he would do differently beyond the interface, and implemented it. And, it seems that inevitably, people now complain that it exists at all.

Dyna-Cabs exist behind a closed door in the interface, and they don’t remove any functionality, they add to the existing functionality if we choose to use them.

Fractal is the most responsive digital modeling company on the planet. They repeatedly release new features and fix bugs at a rate that no one else even attempts. And yet ….

I have about six presets I use most often, and one in particular I worked on for several years before I thought the Amp sounded right but I wasn’t happy with the Cab/IR sound even though I had untold numbers of third-party IRs to pick from, and I’d tried hundreds. It took about four tries with Dyna-Cabs to absolutely nail the sound I want. Four tries spread over a couple days amounting to about five hours compared to working for days and failing… I’m pretty happy with the difference.

Of the others, two were much better after switching to the Dyna-Cabs. The remaining ones I left on Legacy because I think they sound fine. My takeaway from that is that both cab types are very useful, they’re different, and having the flexibility and choice is great.

If the Dyna-Cabs don’t work for someone, that’s cool, use Legacy. If there are interface bugs, or ways either can be improved then invest in the future of the platform and write up how to reproduce the bug or a proposal for how to improve it. But complaining about something you don’t have to use is like being presented with a feast and complaining that one of the dishes is oysters in the half-shell or Brussel-sprouts, rather than ignoring it and moving on. Nothing has been taken away, you have just been given the opportunity to have more.
 
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IR’s should sound good, especially if it’s a paid offering. The person who made it should take a nice cab, record it properly using some choice mics and then blend those mics for a great sounding IR, basically doing the engineering work for you.

Dynacab isn’t going to sound better or be easier, it’s just going to let you get under the hood easier so to speak
 
Like most new features, you can either use it, or use what works and has worked for you in the past. Many artists and bands still use tube amps and pedals and old guitars to great effect.

I personally love dyna cabs because most of the offerings I've found just get me 90% of the way there, and this gives me that extra bit of control. I've spent countless hours in the studio micing cabinets and for my own personal tones. I approach micing my own tones similar to Scott Henderson, very close to the cap to cut through the mix, but then rolling off the volume or tone knob or darkening the amp to fatten up the sound. (I use a 20-25 ft cable without a treble bleed, so rolling off the volume knob also darkens the tone)

I always had a hard time finding IR cabinets out there that mic'ed this way. I always felt that IR makers mic'ed an cab to sound good with guitars wide open.
 
I think people are frustrated that they are missing the boat, not so much complaining as wanting to jump into the latest Axe tech offering. I think viewing it as a complaint is part of the reactive nature of this forum. So be it, but to say that if it doesn't immediately work for you, punt and use the legacy cabs doesn't seem like the right answer. It's a new technology, and if it is intended to be the wave of the future like some have claimed, it will become more and more acessible as we learn about it, not an advanced feature that only the gurus among us really use effectively.
 
Kelleys Heroes said:
I think people are frustrated that they are missing the boat, not so much complaining as wanting to jump into the latest Axe tech offering. I think viewing it as a complaint is part of the reactive nature of this forum. So be it, but to say that if it doesn't immediately work for you, punt and use the legacy cabs doesn't seem like the right answer. It's a new technology, and if it is intended to be the wave of the future like some have claimed, it will become more and more acessible as we learn about it, not an advanced feature that only the gurus among us really use effectively.
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Agreed! Also I think some fear that legacy cabs will go away, taking that option off the board. That may not happen, but it's already the subject of posts.
 
As most have pointed out, Dyna-Cabs are still 'traditional' IRs, but they have been captured using a different process and gear than previous FAS IRs.

From a post from Cliff in one of the FW 22 Beta threads -
"Dyna-Cabs IRs were captured with a Neve preamp. Legacy IRs were shot with an API. API preamps have more mids. I prefer the sound of Neve."

The different preamp could likely be what's causing the 'not sure if I like it' vibe because they are sonically different than Legacy IRs. Another factor, as has also been addressed, is not all speakers are available in the Dyna-Cab list (yet). I really like how the Dyna-Cabs feel and, for the most part how they sound, but have stuck with a few Legacy IRs for my live presets. It's very likely that I'll be moving to Dyna-Cabs once I get a bit more time with them or new speakers are added because of how good they feel.

Another factor to consider is mic placement in the Dyna-Cab system. There seems to be some push-back when anyone says it, but you really need to use your ears for this. Placing the mic where it's "supposed" to be in order to sound a certain way may not be exactly the same as a real world experience with mics and speakers or other IRs. I found the mic needed to be a bit further away than 'normal' to get the desired results. Also keep in mind that the distance is measured in centimeters, not inches like most IRs, so each inch is roughly the equivalent of 2.5 centimeters.

As more speakers and 3rd party Dyna-Cabs become available, I believe there will be more users switching to them. There will also be those with a different opinion of how they sound and prefer to stick with Legacy IRs. Use what works for you, I don't think Legacy IRs are going away anytime soon. It's not a situation where we must all adapt to a new system regardless of how we feel about it.
 
I have about a dozen presets that I have created. Several Fenders and Marshalls, one Vox, one Trainwreck, one Dumble, and one Supro. I was able to create DynaCab versions that I am very happy with for all of them except one where I'm sticking with my IR.

I didn't try to exactly replicate my favorite IR. I tried to get it in the ballpark and then determine which I liked better or what parts of each I liked version I liked better (low end, high end, attack, decay, etc.) by ear. Then, I tweaked the DynaCab a bit more using mic position, low/high cuts, and dual-mic blends to my preference to make the DynaCab closer to the parts of the Legacy IRs that I preferred. In all cases, except the previously mentioned one Marshall preset, I ended up preferring the DynaCab versions that I was able to come up with.

Where previously, I found myself settling on one type of Marshall IR that I liked across multiple amp models set up the same...with DynaCabs I ended up with different mic positions, types, and/or balances for each of my Marshall presets.
 
Yeah, I must confess I wanted to love Dyna Cabs and they ended up being more or less exactly what I expected them to be. I'm just not dialing anything up that I actually like better than my most recent IR selections. I don't hate them either. I can get usable sounds out of them, they're just not better than what I'm getting from the (legacy) IR realm at the moment. I blame myself - LOL
 
I haven't done a deep dive on the dyna cabs feature yet, but I agree that I generally like what I get with my preferred factory IRs better than what I've come up with so far.

I still think it is a very cool feature and I think it is a big plus for those who don't want to play the IR roulette game. The inclusion of dyna cabs takes the wind out of the sails of those who claimed that L6 and NDSP had a leg up on FAS when it came to speaker simulation / ease of use in the cab section.
 
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