Decided to go back to basics. WIN

B

born2lift

Inspired
I've been playing bass thru my Axe-FX+ for a little over a year now. I've never been 100% satisfied with my tone. I had sold off my Darkglass B7K figuring that I didn't need it anymore. I recently bought the B7K Ultra as well as a Super Semmetry compressor in an effort to improve my tone.

I started thinking about what I could do to improve my tone. As an experiment, I turned off cab modeling, as I've been playing thru an Ampeg SVT Heritage 8 x 10. I also started with just the amp block using SV Bass. As I've always took pics with my iPhone of my setting on my amps and pedals, I went thru the thousands of pics and found the one of the settings from the Ampeg SVT Heritage head that I had at one time. I set the SV Bass in Axe-Fx to as close to the settings from the pic. BINGO! I'm now very satisfied with my sound. I'm a huge AIC fan and have been doing Tone Match of Man In The Box and Would with great success.
 
Nice :). There are a lot of great options buried in there. They're just... buried hah. The fun thing with the SV bass is trying to mimic the 5 position selector (on SVT-CLs, similar for the switches on the older SVTs).

I too haven't found a cab IR that really jived well with my presets. I do need to get around to buying and testing the OwnHammer 4x10 IRs, but I'm in no hurry as my presets sound great without a cab block.

I also agree on the B7K, and it pains me that it is not represented in the FAS products. I've owned a vanilla B7K a few times now to take TMs of it! Luckily, I now have a decent library of settings on it that I can use, so I don't need the pedal. It'd still just be nice to have it modeled. As for the compressor, I love the Super Symmetry, it's an interesting compressor! I have found that I do like the Studio compressor in my Axe-Fx / AX8 just as much, though (after quite a bit of soul searching with that block, that is).
 
When I made the update to Q3 i decided to try developing a bass tone from scratch (recently Ive been using a TM of my Aguilar head with the TLC comp up front of it), and I ended up finding something Im digging way more than my TM patches :) the transformer grind parameter makes dialing the top end way too easy at this point and its a godsend. I was able to set up a punchy clean with the AD200B and then stack a guitar chain in parallel for my dirty tone and it all sound at the very least comparable to what I was using, if not better.
 
I gotta get on Q3.xx soon. I'm wondering if the new tweaks will allow me to dial in G-K amps a tad easier. Right now it's pretty difficult to get the feel of G-Ks at all.
 
selta said:
I gotta get on Q3.xx soon. I'm wondering if the new tweaks will allow me to dial in G-K amps a tad easier. Right now it's pretty difficult to get the feel of G-Ks at all.
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I cant imagine it making the process less easy haha, the sound and feel I've been getting from both my existing and new patches are top notch
 
Selta, I seen your reply in the post about the compressors in the Axe and was wondering how the setting correlate to real work compressors? Specifically the Super Symmetry and the Empress. The Super Symmetry seems to have the controls labeled differently.
 
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Heh, yeah... they don't really have coorrelation. I like the way Fractal implements these, especially the Studio compressor, but the settings I thought I was using on pedals don't work the same with the models. Things as simple as attack/release times I've had to do a lot of tweaking on. I stopped trying to say "Well, I used these settings on X pedal, so let's start there". Now I more think "Well, I found these settings on the Studio compressor, let's see how I need to tweak that". So, if I had to summarize it, I'd say forget what you think you know, and start tweaking. Go from one extreme to the other with the knobs and then find how you want to set them.

Also, on bass, skip the multi-band compressor. I hope that someday FAS revisits that and makes it so we can dial it in better for bass.
 
Has Cliff ever made a statement regarding the bass aspects of the Axe-FX?
I know that he's a guitar player and all, and he wants to only focus on guitar, but I think it would be a wise business move to expand just a little.
It's super easy to get stunning and amazing guitar tones from the Axe. It would be really nice if it was the same for bass. I'm very detail oriented, so I don't give up so easy, but I can see how someone not as patient me get just give on bass thru the Axe.
I honestly think that the Aex-FX is the best thing to happen to music equipment.
 
Not exactly. On their store front they play up how Axe-Fx works great for bass (I forget the exact language used, but something along those lines). Thankfully, if anyone does a little research before buying, they see that while technically true, the effort there is minimal. In software development, we often call this "MVP"... Minimally Viable Product.
 
I have the ax2 mk1. There's no real love for bass on FAS.
But I won't sell my unit. I still spect that some day the company do something more for us bass player.
I like the effects, so I use Fx8 with my ampeg amps.

I was considering buy a Kemper or that line 6 helix.
But still waiting and has passed almost 1 year that I'm waiting hahahahaha :eek:
 
Fractal isn't alone in their putting bass on the back burner for update considerations.

Kemper might pay a little more attention to bassists, as they've added some features that bassists would like, however a very expensive way to go, so it had better hit it out of the park for bass to justify the cost...limited effects, no software editor, etc.

Line 6 Helix offered a basic compliment of bass amps and cabs.

Atomic Amplifire offers no bass amps for bassists, as opposed to bass amps for guitarists (Fender bassman, which every modeler offers).

ZOOM had a huge success with the B3 footpedal, but never upgraded the models, and never came out with a more full-featured version of the B3, which I'd have guessed to be another smash hit for those (like me) who like the B3 but would like more switches, more stomp locations, and an improvement in quality. (I have the new G5n, which has better amp model algorithms comparatively IMO, but again, nothing really for bass. Not bad as a pure stomp multi-fx.)

MarkBass came out with a full-on bass modeler (Bass Multi-amp?) with built-in power amp, but it sort of died on the vine and is now out of production IIRC. I recall looking at its specs and was sort of puzzled by some of the design decisions, and it wasn't cheap. In the end, though, it's all about the quality, and if the market is correct, it probably wasn't a good value, generally.

So, I've resigned myself to the notion that FAS is just following the same trend WRT bassists. The market must not be there, and the rest of the modeler/muti-fx manufacturing community seems to concur with that feeling.

The best offerings for bass seem to be in the dedicated preamp/cab sim realm, of which there are a number of good products available for not too much coin. Then, it's just all about adding effects. Will look closely at the GK Plex pedal when it comes out.
 
Chicken or egg kind of thing, right?
Companies: "There's no market for bass, so we're not going to worry about it."
Bassists: "There's very little available that has what I want and need. I'll stick with my traditional tools."

I will also say though, just from talking to bass players on TalkBass and in my local community, the general feeling towards modelers is an "uncertain but curious" type feeling, at best. Most bass players are bass -> amp -> cab types too, maybe a compressor and drive thrown in for good measure.

Someone should go out on a limb and sink some effort into it. Given the amount of amp and FX modeling out there, I can't believe that it'd take much effort to add in say 6 more bass amps and 6 of the most popular pedals. I have a feeling that, if executed well, this would bring a good sample of bass players around.

The B3 was pretty OK - I remember playing with one for a long time. Then it never got updated and I stopped using it after a time.

I keep eying a Helix. The fact that Line6 threw more bass equipment in there from the get go is nice, but I'm hoping to see them expand on it. I'm also still a little gun shy about Line6 as a whole, so I want the product to bake a bit more before I buy one.
 
Yeah, I was eyeballing the Helix, hoping a local Guitar Center would stock one to audition (not happened as of yet). The thing that turned me off about the Helix is that it's a pretty large pedal, and even though the scribble strips are cool, there is a hard limitation of modifier-controllable features that doesn't allow you to create scenes, or have multiple switches assigned to control the same parameter.

Pedal size aside, I'd have to see a more mature product and more effort given to bassists before I reconsider taking the plunge. Ideally, a mini-Helix would be ideal, but I don't see that coming any time in the future. The B3 is exactly as you say: pretty OK. Amazing that Zoom didn't take advantage of the buzz surrounding the B3 and step it up a notch. Oh well. The make really cool digital cameras, though. LOL.

What always attracted me to Fractal was the quality and versatility. None of that's changed, really. At the time I got my first Ultra, I was covering a ton of stuff that required massive changes to the bass sound with a ton of switch/exp pedal control. These days, not so much so I'm perfectly happy with a good sounding multi-FX that lets me get around a handful of basic tones and special fx.
 
I hear ya there. I'm still content with my Fractal gear. But, if someone else out there comes along with a product that better suits my needs and bass players in general, heck yeah I'll jump on it. I don't see myself dumping my FAS gear at all, but I'm definitely going to keep an eye on everything else that's coming out, too.
 
I do love my Axe. The frequency of updates is astounding, to say the least. I do play guitar as well, so I'm not totally devastated that there isn't more attention to bass. But, if I only played bass, I'd get another Ampeg SVT Heritage head. I am satisfied with my bass tone with the Axe, but it's not 100% of the tone that I could get with a tube head. As far as guitar tones are concerned, I can not tell a difference. And I've always been very picky about my guitar tone, so I was actually quite skeptical when I first ordered the Axe.

I don't really understand the tunnel vision of just guitar. Seems like Cliff could bring someone on that could contribute to the bass aspect. You'd think the fact that Nolly uses an Axe extensively and Geddy Lee owns one that Cliff would at least add some stuff once in a while.
 
my guess is that it doesn't interest Cliff. End of story. Perhaps he could be dragged into more bass gear support with overwhelming interest in it, but this has yet to manifest itself, at least on this forum. I'm disappointed a little, but I guess you can't blame him either.
 
jimfist said:
my guess is that it doesn't interest Cliff. End of story. Perhaps he could be dragged into more bass gear support with overwhelming interest in it, but this has yet to manifest itself, at least on this forum. I'm disappointed a little, but I guess you can't blame him either.
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Heh, yeah. I don't even recall the last time I saw anyone from FAS even post in this section. Makes you wonder if they bother even reading it :D
 
Yes we bass players can be happy with only some bass amps/cabs.
But those that are there could be updated. With more "tube realism" and other bla bla bla... that happens with the those new firmwares....
 
One of my personal desires would be for the SVT Classic to be modeled, with focus given to the Mid Freq selector knob, which is critical to shaping the tones in that amp. Same thing for the Graphic EQ section of the original Acoustic amplifiers. They are signature to the sound, along with their unique cabinet tones. Some will say that you can tone match, or match by ear, these EQ characteristics, but it would be great to have these amp/preamps in a ready-to-go bass amp model.
 
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