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Daydreaming: A possible way to have Axe-fx2 amp sims on the Ultra

Cron

Inspired
I wrote this in another thread and decided to start a dedicated one just to get some responses:


Cliff said (i think) that an amp block in the axefx 2 code would take up 40% of cpu of one tigersharc processor (ultra has 1.... AxefxII has 2) I am a sparse effect user and never use 2 amp sims at the same time on my ultra and would love to see a firmware split for ultra in 2 categories : normal and mini-axefx2. The downsized axefx2 firmware would have the same amp code as the real axe-fx2 but its up to the user if he wants to load this firmware and risk his ultra's cpu reaching its limit more often.

Anything else that needs to be scaled down to accommodate this is fine by me: less patches, amps, cabs, though i am under the impression that cpu power is the primary limiting factor. I wouldnt expect this firmware to be updated with every other firmware release or to be officially supported. I realize that Cliff is probably swamped with work so I wouldnt even expect this special firmware anytime soon... maybe when the dust from the new AxefxII blastoff settles a bit

Im sure someone will come along and tell me its not possible or feasable but i can dream cant i?
 
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AndrewSimon

Power User
So.... you want Cliff to write a brand new firmware for a product that's out of production
and maintain 5 diiferent firmware versions.... hmm probably not going to happen.

But it's a nice dream, I would love to have it too, I'm even willing to pay for it!

;)
 

shasha

Fractal Fanatic
Nothing wrong with dreaming so long as you don't get your feelings hurt if they don't come true.

I have a feeling that the statement made was a very simplified one for us and not meant to be taken the way that you are reading into it.
 

Randalljax

Fractal Fanatic
Think it is more likely you will see that in a scaled down unit if they decide to at some point .One Amp at a time .maybe 25 amps ..and some effects .but no or little updates
 

Cron

Inspired
So.... you want Cliff to write a brand new firmware for a product that's out of production
and maintain 5 diiferent firmware versions.... hmm probably not going to happen.

But it's a nice dream, I would love to have it too, I'm even willing to pay for it!

;)

Like i said it could be a once in a while release, not officially supported (if they charged for it i guess some ppl might be upset if they didnt support it. And yes id also pay for it, even if it wasnt supported) Im sure he wont have to write a whole brand new firmware.... The main code is there already, he'd just have to tie it all together (yes im a programming noob). Im sure it will be some effort but imho it would go a long way as far as appeasing the recent purchasers of ultra's (which im not a part of). It could only be good for Fractal's reputation.

I really dont think its a ludicrous idea... and i dont think it will hurt Axe-fxII sales either..... Because the ultra's are no longer sold (so no one could buy an ultra new and load the mini-2 firmware to save cash) and there is still high demand for new units.

Id like a response from Cliff. Even if its a "hell no!". :)
If its not possible from a hardware perspective id like to know why. If he just doesnt feel like doing it or wont have time then thats his right. Cant argue with that.
 
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randombastage

Experienced
Seems kind of counterproductive from a business standpoint. It's like creating a pirated version of your own new top of the line product...if I was his business manager and he passed that idea by me I'd say Cliff, put down the bong and step away from your business model!'
 

Cron

Inspired
Seems kind of counterproductive from a business standpoint. It's like creating a pirated version of your own new top of the line product...if I was his business manager and he passed that idea by me I'd say Cliff, put down the bong and step away from your business model!'

Yes i know it could seem that way.... But the question is will he sell less axe-fxII's because of it? There is still a vast market of guitarists who dont even know about about the axe-fx.... or have been putting off buying an axefx because they think the modelling isnt quite there yet. With more advertizing and endorsements and clips a lot of hese ppl will switch over to the II. If Fractal continued selling new ultras at quite a reduced price then i agree it would be pretty dumb doing what im suggesting.

Dont forget about how limiting the high cpu usage could be to ppl who use complicated patches. It gives them a chance to demo the axefx2 amp sims on their ultra and make an informed decision about upgrading to the II.

In a sense it would be more like creating a demo version of the new top of the line product.... only available to loyal previous customers.
 
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randombastage

Experienced
Ahhh! So it could be the bait that gets reluctant current owner to switch. I follow that.

Not sure about the other part where you talk of "guitarists who dont even know about about the axe-fx" because the 'real' AxeFxII is no less capable of introducing an un-Axe-aware person to the whole AxeFxII experience as a II-modded-firmware Ultra is. Or maybe you meant distributing that modded firmware now to all the existing AxeFx'ers would be like sending out AxeFxII demos into the world...I get it now, I didn't read it thoroughly at first.
Must...get...coffee...brain...slow...
 

Jack Napalm

Power User
So as long as you're day dreaming why don't you daydream about getting enough money together and just buy the Axe II?
 

Cron

Inspired
So as long as you're day dreaming why don't you daydream about getting enough money together and just buy the Axe II?

Haha funny! Im pretty much broke at the moment.

I wasnt complaining or moaning. I had an idea/suggestion (albeit a far fetched one)
Now did you have a useful contribution to make to this thread?
 

shasha

Fractal Fanatic
Haha funny! Im pretty much broke at the moment.

I wasnt complaining or moaning. I had an idea/suggestion (albeit a far fetched one)
Now did you have a useful contribution to make to this thread?
Seemed pretty useful even if it was kind of blunt and tongue in cheek. :razz

About being broke right now....well that's ok because they don't have any available right now anyway so you'd pretty much be sitting here dreaming about buying one so may as well play with what you got.
 

Cron

Inspired
Seemed pretty useful even if it was kind of blunt and tongue in cheek. :razz

About being broke right now....well that's ok because they don't have any available right now anyway so you'd pretty much be sitting here dreaming about buying one so may as well play with what you got.

Yes i am playing with what i have. In fact ive got 2 shows in the next week. Be nice lol!

Why does it seem like some of you guys are against this?
 

Jack Napalm

Power User
I am not against it but I just don't think it will happen according to Cliff's posts. Just doesn't seem like it would be a reality and would rather get an Axe II if I really want the new modeling.
 

Cron

Inspired
Fair enough. Reality for me is "just getting an axeII" has severe obstacles. Who knows when they will be available in Australia and then to top that off they will probably cost +-$3300 here again. I could probably sell my ultra down the line for about $1800 Aud then it'll cost me $1500 more to upgrade.... Sound good to you?

I cant justify that unless the new amp modelling is worth it. I cant determine whether it is unless i play it with my guitars and gear that i know. I bought the 1st axefx from hearing clips and when i got it i never thought it sounded as good as my real amps....i made my opinion known and got flogged for it.... Now they are saying :seriously, this time its "100%" there. Dont know if ill fall for that one again.

I kept my axefx because i started to rely on it for effects and the promise of a firmware update where the amp modelling goes "100%" was very inticing. Now the firmware and code
is there (possibly), they probably just wont code it for my unit which i paid $2600 for. Its a little sad. (i say this all assuming the new amp modelling could work on an ultra albeit at high cpu levels, and afaik no one has given a convincing reason why it cant, yet)
 
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paulmapp8306

Fractal Fanatic
Not going to happen. i saw the same possibility when cliff stated that, and asked the Q in the Technical thread. The code is different for the 2 units - and why you cant port over existing presets to axe-2. while the TigerSHARC could run this code, the flash isnt big enough to hold the new code. Its not the processor power stopping G2 sims (though as you say it would be very resource hungry) - its the Flash memory thats not big enough.

Shame, but there you are.
 

Cron

Inspired
Thanks for clearing that up. It does seem odd that flash memory would be the 1st limiting factor.... Maybe Cliff never invisioned using as much as is currently needed for G2. What is the flash memory specifically used for in the axefx? Stripping away other things wont remedy this right? (excuse my ignorance in case that was a dumb question)
 

paulmapp8306

Fractal Fanatic
Its what holds the firmware. Hes already said the firmware space is all but maxed on the standard and Ultra - with the little remaining space reserved for future amp models. There just isnt the space for G2 code.

Unfortunately you cant strip away the OS.
 

Never1

Member
Thanks for clearing that up. It does seem odd that flash memory would be the 1st limiting factor.... Maybe Cliff never invisioned using as much as is currently needed for G2. What is the flash memory specifically used for in the axefx? Stripping away other things wont remedy this right? (excuse my ignorance in case that was a dumb question)

This is not verbatim... Just what I got from the post:

IIRC, last summer, Cliff had posted something along the lines of having made big strides with some new modeling technology that could not run on the current version of the Axe-FX. He said he was experimenting with the technology and it was promising.... I guess this is where G2 comes in, and I didn't think we'd be here so quick. I expected another year or two before we saw the next generation.

Obviously, what he'd discovered happened long after the current Axe-FX was in production.
 

paulmapp8306

Fractal Fanatic
Yeh - say that too and had the same thoughts.

He was also asked about multiple processors, and said it gives no benefit with real tim audio - you cant really multi task it.

I guess the new tech (given the AFX2 uses the same processors as the Ultra - only 2 of them), was the method of splitting the work (sims on one DSP and FX on the other) while maintaining the speed required from uniterupted audio.
 
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