Crown XLS 2502 vs Matrix GT1000FX-2U for Axe-Fx III

Sorenspete

Sorenspete

Inspired
I have seen a few threads about both of these amps, but they have been around for awhile and wanted to hear from people in the current day about their experiences, particularly with the former.

I read that Crown power amps impart a particular tonal "flavour" whereas the Matrix amps are very flat and neutral. Really interested to hear from XLS owners.

Right now I'm focused on building a wet/dry/wet setup using the Axe-Fx III Mk II with two Yamaha HS8 studio monitors and a Boogie Mini Recto 1x12 slanted cab, and obviously I require a power amp to power it. Very stoked on how this setup is shaping up for home use but the power amp question has been lingering for some time. I plan to acquire more cabinets in the future - I'd really like to try two 4x12's in stereo or another combination of W/D/W with all speaker cabinets.

Matrix are out of stock of the GT1000FX-2U. I have an 8U rack so figured the 2U would be a nice future-proof quality of life improvement over the 1U. I'm in New Zealand, so for more or less the same price I can purchase the XLS 2502 stateside and not worry about importing the Matrix.

How careful will I need to be using 1000w stereo power amps to power a 1x12 (Vintage30)? I wouldn't be concerned if I ran two 4x12's.

Rig pic for eye candy:

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I have a Crown XLS1000 for my FRFR speaker cab or guitar cabs, 200w per side into 8 ohms. I think it sounds great. Jimmy Herring of Widespread Panic uses these for his wet amp setup. The 2502 should be very similar except for more power. The Matrix I haven’t tried.
 
skolacki said:
I have a Crown XLS1000 for my FRFR speaker cab or guitar cabs, 200w per side into 8 ohms. I think it sounds great. Jimmy Herring of Widespread Panic uses these for his wet amp setup. The 2502 should be very similar except for more power. The Matrix I haven’t tried.
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Thanks for posting up in the thread. I know my other thread in this sub-forum is similar lol. It's looking like I will try the 2502 and if I come into a lot of money (who remembers that Confucius joke about the bank vault?) I'll try the GT1000FX.
 
I’ve got a pair of the 2502’s. It has a crossover feature I used for an old set of altec duplexes. The amps seemed quite accurate.
 
I recently got a Crown XLS 2502. It is to replace an older Carvin DCM 1540L ( a class A/B amp) for no other reason than to get lighter weight and quieter fans.
My belief is if you go with SS amp you need miles of headroom because you don't want to hear SS clipping or even straining.

I'm driving 2 older non-neo passive CLR's and a newer pair of Xitone passive cabs together, two per side.

I experienced no difference on the sound quality from the Carvin to the Crown and I didn't expect any. Just clean, quiet power.

I set the Crown 2502 at about 2 o'clock on knobs in front and this thing just loafs along pushing the hell out of the 4 12's. This amp sits about three feet from me in my studio and I can't hear the fans. (Oh, and it weights 10 lbs.)

So, it's doing what I wanted it to do with no fanfare. Maybe not as sexy as a 100 watt per side Marshall stereo tube amp but it doesn't weigh 100 lbs. either.
 
Just as an aside, but those Crown XLS series amps also work very well in HiFi systems, particularly with inefficient speakers that draw serious current! Maggies for example.
 
Sorenspete said:
How careful will I need to be using 1000w stereo power amps to power a 1x12 (Vintage30)? I wouldn't be concerned if I ran two 4x12's.
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I've run my Axe into more power amps and cabs than I care to mention.
I've run 2k watts into a 1x12 cab (if we're talking extreme). I don't need to crank the master on that power amp....but I can, and control the Axe output to ensure I don't destroy my 1x12 cab.

I just say - use common sense. If you are pushing your 1x12 cab to a volume where the speaker is starting to break up, or just louder than that cab should be able to perform....turn it down. Can you blow it up? - sure. You can do the same with a 100 watt Marshall head.
How do you prevent it? - just be mindful of your volume. If you've used the same speakers/cabs with a tube head, then you likely have an idea of what volume to expect. Just don't go way past that.
 
It's always better to have alot of headroom and push a clean sine wave than it is to try and run underpowered solid state amps into clipping...you just have to dial back the gain on the power amp. Pushing a low powered amp into clipping sends a clipped sine wave through a speaker and will fry the voice coils.
 
BBN said:
I've run my Axe into more power amps and cabs than I care to mention.
I've run 2k watts into a 1x12 cab (if we're talking extreme). I don't need to crank the master on that power amp....but I can, and control the Axe output to ensure I don't destroy my 1x12 cab.

I just say - use common sense. If you are pushing your 1x12 cab to a volume where the speaker is starting to break up, or just louder than that cab should be able to perform....turn it down. Can you blow it up? - sure. You can do the same with a 100 watt Marshall head.
How do you prevent it? - just be mindful of your volume. If you've used the same speakers/cabs with a tube head, then you likely have an idea of what volume to expect. Just don't go way past that.
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Thanks for the info! This is pretty much what I assumed.
 
Justincase said:
It's always better to have alot of headroom and push a clean sine wave than it is to try and run underpowered solid state amps into clipping...you just have to dial back the gain on the power amp. Pushing a low powered amp into clipping sends a clipped sine wave through a speaker and will fry the voice coils.
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Thanks this is helpful. So the 1200w Crown will have more headroom than the 775w Crown at the same volume?
 
Sorenspete said:
Thanks this is helpful. So the 1200w Crown will have more headroom than the 775w Crown at the same volume?
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Yes...but it depends on what your speakers are rated at if you actually need that much more power. The general rule of thumb when matching amp to speakers is 2x the RMS of your speakers. You can run a more powerful amp but you need to adjust the amp gain accordingly. Clean power from a less taxed amp is always better than power from a smaller amp on the verge of clipping. You can't just go by the total power of the amp. You need to figure out what the amp is rated per channel at whatever Ohm load you are driving. If you have no experience doing this your best course of action is to consult a tech at sweetwater and they will help you. Here is a guide that you should read that will help you understand this better.
https://www.sweetwater.com/insync/power-amp-buying-guide/
 
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Justincase said:
Yes...but it depends on what your speakers are rated at if you actually need that much more power. The general rule of thumb when matching amp to speakers is 1.5x the RMS of your speakers. You can run a more powerful amp but you need to adjust the amp gain accordingly. Clean power from a less taxed amp is always better than power from a smaller amp on the verge of clipping. You can't just go by the total power of the amp. You need to figure out what the amp is rated per channel at whatever Ohm load you are driving. If you have no experience doing this your best course of action is to consult a tech at sweetwater and they will help you. Here is a guide that you should read that will help you understand this better.
https://www.sweetwater.com/insync/power-amp-buying-guide/
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I remember as a teen being perplexed as to why my Jensen speakers actually gave me more volume with no distortion, once I added a Kraco power booster. (This was 1980) The head unit wasn't anything special, but it would clip those speakers at about 70% volume. I really never understood it until much later.
 
Also it is better to buy pro equipment from reputable manufacturers such as Crown or QSC because they tend to under rate their equipment. Manufacturers such as Behringer tend to over rate their stuff. For example my behringer amp is rated at 530 watts per channel but will only output around 440 watts before it starts clipping...which is fine for my setup since my speakers are rated 200 watts RMS.
Here is a video where a guy Dynos a cheap crown amp and it actually outperforms it's rating by 300 watts!

 
Justincase said:
Yes...but it depends on what your speakers are rated at if you actually need that much more power. The general rule of thumb when matching amp to speakers is 2x the RMS of your speakers. You can run a more powerful amp but you need to adjust the amp gain accordingly. Clean power from a less taxed amp is always better than power from a smaller amp on the verge of clipping. You can't just go by the total power of the amp. You need to figure out what the amp is rated per channel at whatever Ohm load you are driving. If you have no experience doing this your best course of action is to consult a tech at sweetwater and they will help you. Here is a guide that you should read that will help you understand this better.
https://www.sweetwater.com/insync/power-amp-buying-guide/
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I'm looking at the Crown XLS 2002 or 2502 which would be 375 and 440 watts @ 8ohms respectively into a single 60w Celestion Vintage30.
 
Sorenspete said:
I'm looking at the Crown XLS 2002 or 2502 which would be 375 and 440 watts @ 8ohms respectively into a single 60w Celestion Vintage30.
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Unless you plan on expanding your speaker array in the future you can get a lower powered solid state amp and save some money. I'd contact sweetwater and see what options they recommend.
 
Justincase said:
Unless you plan on expanding your speaker array in the future you can get a lower powered solid state amp and save some money. I'd contact sweetwater and see what options they recommend.
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I'm in New Zealand so a lot of the time Sweetwater can't send certain things to me due to freight restrictions, either that or they don't sell 230v units. I do plan to switch to larger cabs, but I don't know when that will be. For now I'm happy to power my MESA 1x12 and use that in conjunction with my studio monitors. I'm thinking maybe the XLS 1002 might be more appropriate.
 
Sorenspete said:
I'm in New Zealand so a lot of the time Sweetwater can't send certain things to me due to freight restrictions, either that or they don't sell 230v units. I do plan to switch to larger cabs, but I don't know when that will be. For now I'm happy to power my MESA 1x12 and use that in conjunction with my studio monitors. I'm thinking maybe the XLS 1002 might be more appropriate.
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The xls 1002 is probably more than enough.
 
Pedal Baby way too much color for me. Behringer is solid. The Camplifier I had was nice but a bit underpowered. I LOVE my Quilter 201. I am always on the lookout for the 202 with the FRFR voice and 3 band eq but it's still way too expensive to justify. TBH; I think the FAS gear is best ran direct vs through a guitar speaker. It doesn't need near as much turd polishing as other platforms (cough Helix cough).
 
JiveTurkey said:
Pedal Baby way too much color for me. Behringer is solid. The Camplifier I had was nice but a bit underpowered. I LOVE my Quilter 201. I am always on the lookout for the 202 with the FRFR voice and 3 band eq but it's still way too expensive to justify. TBH; I think the FAS gear is best ran direct vs through a guitar speaker. It doesn't need near as much turd polishing as other platforms (cough Helix cough).
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Makes total sense....quilter is QSC...solid products. I knew Jive was the right one to ask. 🤘😁
 
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