Couple of quick questions before I buy one of these units...

guitarjim

guitarjim

Experienced
Hello Axe-Fx fanatics,

I've been a voyeur on this forum for a while now and have read a bunch of stuff on the Axe-Fx. I am about to pull the trigger on one and wanted to get some opinions on a couple of things, so I can plan my next rig properly.

I am a former G-System owner but my rig just got way to big for my aging back. I then switched to the Line 6 HD500 and DT amp. This gives me quite a bit of versatility, but the tone just seems flat to me and I don't get the response that I want. I love my Red Plate amp and a couple of pedals, but I play in a wedding/dance band so I need a huge array of different tones. I'm hoping that the Axe-Fx will give me the best of both worlds (the versatility of the HD500 and the tone/touch of a tube amp). With that as a background, here are a few questions that will be simple for you experts to help me out.

1) One of my major problems with the HD is volume leveling. I have an incredibly difficult time matching the volume of say a clean fender patch with a high gain patch. I set them to be the same in my basement, or at band practice, but when I get to a gig and turn up to a louder volume they are out of whack again. Can I feel comfortable that I will have an easier time with this using the Axe-Fx?

2) Left over from my G-System days, I have a Fryette Two-Ninety-Two power amp and a Bruno 2/12 cab. I figure I will end up with a Matrix / FRFR setup at some point, since my understanding is that I'll get the best tube-amp simulation that way, but I was wondering if the difference between using my current amp/cab setup and an FRFR setup will be huge. Also, if I migrate from a power amp/cab to an FRFR setup, is the amount of patch tweaking I'll have to do significant (I probably use 60 patches or so at a normal gig)? I am just trying to gauge whether I should bite the bullet and get everything at one time or whether I can spread the investment out over time without being disappointed with my tone or having to completely rebuild patches when I upgrade the rig.

3) The G System also allowed me to send MIDI messages to external devices, specifically my guitar synth. Can I do the same thing with the Axe-Fx? I didn't see this in the manual (sorry if I missed it).

Also, if there are any former Line 6 HD500 players out there who might have some advice or thoughts for me, it would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks very much. I'm looking forward to being an active contributor on this forum.
 
Answer to #2) I would bite the bullet and get the Matrix, like I just did after 1 1/2 years of using a stereo tube power amp and my split stack (2 x 12 ADA cabs). I just started using a Fractal, but I had the ElevenRack, and had to make all of my own "live" presets from scratch - I couldn't really use the ones that sounded great on my computer and Yamaha studio monitors - way too much tweaking to do. Now, everything sounds the same everywhere. Loving the Matrix!

#3) I'm pretty sure the MFC-101 foot controller will let you send MIDI to other devices as well.
 
Will it be easier to level presets? Hard to tell. Some people are better at that than others. There are some great tips out there got that

Is there more tweaking involved? I will say yes but this has a lot to do with the fact that you will use an amp and cab and eventually transition to frfr. Typically patches made through a traditional power amp/cab don't translate that well when switching to frfr. If you don't want to go frfr just get a matrix and use that with your cab

Yes it does midi
 
Welcome to the Forum.

Answers basically as follows:-

1. Volume Levelling needs to be done at gig level, doing it at bedroom type volumes will give different perceived results due to Fletcher Munson curve affects.

Levelling Video. Check Scott's other videos also.



2. Only you can answer whether to bite the bullet in one go.

3. Yes, you can send midi data thru to other devices.

You also will need a Midi Foot controller of some type. Initially you could use the HD500, there used to be a patch on the Line 6 site for using it with the Axe FX. Better results would be had with Fractals MFC-101 or possibly a Liquid Foot or some other third party controller.

I used to have a Line 6 HD500 while on the waiting list for the Axe FXII which is no longer the queue that it was. My opinion for the money the HD500 is a versatile box, but the sounds compared to the Axe FX are night and day, with the Axe FX the winner by a significant margin.
 
You can use an app like AudioTools, from Studio Six Digital, for the iPhone, it has an SPL meter that'll get you in the ballpark.
 
This answer surprises me a bit. Isn't it the frfr bit that would cause me to have to rebuild all of the patches? Does moving to a matrix at the outset save me from that hassle when I go frfr?
 
guitarjim said:
This answer surprises me a bit. Isn't it the frfr bit that would cause me to have to rebuild all of the patches? Does moving to a matrix at the outset save me from that hassle when I go frfr?
Click to expand...

Basically, but its a financial decision for yourself versus re tweaking.
 
I was a long time G system user with a large rack of pedals, switching systems etc. I struggled with that rig for 3 years. Either cables going out at a gig, constant pedal tweaking, and worst of all the horrible tone sucking you get from using the G system in the effects loop of an amp. Eventually I got so frustrated at a show I unplugged the whole rig and played the gig with an amp and a bb preamp pedal. That's it.

The next day I pulled the trigger on an ultra and mfc. The initial thought was to use it with my Mesa power amp and avatar cab. After a few weeks of this setup I was happy but eventually decided to move to a full range speaker. I started with the atomic and just recently moved to the Rcf nx series. I moved to fr for one main reason. I wanted my presets to translate to a live PA as accurately as possible. It makes perfect sense that if you dial in presets on a full range speakers, that it will sound fairly accurate when at a gig and plugged direct to the house. Even when I used an amp/cab setup in the past I still struggled with my sound being way off when I was at a gig. It sounded great from my amp but like garbage out of the PA. I highly recommend a true FR setup.

As far as the axe fx's sound quality, it goes far beyond any modeler I have ever used in the past. I play in a band that does a large variety of types of songs and I can get every tone Imaginable out of this box. The feel is there, the tone is there and the flexibility is definitely there. And best of All NO TONE LOSS. its a fast and easy setup every gig and i dont have to worry about my rig failing at a show.

I've never had a problem leveling my presets. Being an in ear user I am very sensitive to presets being even slightly louder or softer. I've never had a problem. I don't even go As far as using Scott's technique. I usually just use my ear. Although you should be pretty damn accurate if you try the SPF meter technique.
 
guitarjim said:
This answer surprises me a bit. Isn't it the frfr bit that would cause me to have to rebuild all of the patches? Does moving to a matrix at the outset save me from that hassle when I go frfr?
Click to expand...

Yes... What you hear in your studio monitors will sound closer to want you hear coming out of FRFR...
 
Volume leveling - You can do it at home and then at gig remotely with a midi footswitch in 1db increments, mid-song...easy

Going FRFR & patch tweaking - Don't let patch tweaking stop you from your best sound. IMO, FRFR is your ear's/back's best friend.

Gsystem as midi footswitch - If Gsystem sends patch changes on different channels and can send CC's, it'll work. If you want an incredible footswitch that'll do anything you want and is even smaller than the MFC, check out GORDIUS Little Giant I love this footswitch!!
 
stratamania said:
Basically, but its a financial decision for yourself versus re tweaking.
Click to expand...
If your going FRFR any way and not using the Matrix with a 4x12, save your back and get a RCF NX-12SMA, or the new Atomic CLR. The RCF I've used for a bit, as have many users on the forum. It sounds amazing, accurate and 36.5lbs. You can find info on both by searching the forum.
For the RCF, contact Mike Plye at Audiopyle.com. He's been great to deal with and his prices rock!
 
guitarjim said:
This answer surprises me a bit. Isn't it the frfr bit that would cause me to have to rebuild all of the patches? Does moving to a matrix at the outset save me from that hassle when I go frfr?
Click to expand...

I have found that if it sounds good through FRFR (in my case two K12's) it sounds good through tube amp & cabs. I use both but I have grown to prefer the FRFR sound. I miss the tight low-end thump and high-end chime when I play through tubes and cabs (Fryette 2/50/2 and two 2x12 cabs). To say nothing of moving all that crap (tubes and cabs) gets real old.
 
guitarjim said:
This answer surprises me a bit. Isn't it the frfr bit that would cause me to have to rebuild all of the patches? Does moving to a matrix at the outset save me from that hassle when I go frfr?
Click to expand...
It will save some hassle but not all. The reason is that. With a tradition power amp and cab you would not use a cab ir at all and turn off power amp sims ect as the power amp your are using has it's own voice if you will, it colors the sound so it has it's spin. The cab also adds it's color. With a Matrix the amp is pretty much color less so you can use the power amp sims so that part of future tweaking is no longer an issue. You still have the cab coloration so no mater what amp sim you use it will be like using that real life amp through your cab. That can be good or bad depending on your love of the cab. True FRFR is supposed to be pretty much colorless and accurate so that what ever amp and cab ir you use sound like that amp and cab would/ should.
 
Wow, super helpful responses, thanks everyone. Can't wait to dig into the rig and participate as a knowledgeable user.

I'm sold on going straight to FRFR. If I'm taking the plunge I might as well shoot for the optimum configuration. A quick follow up on speakers. In smaller venues, we only run vocals through FOH, so rather than a monitor, I need an actual cab that will fill the room. Matrix has their Q12, which seems suited. Any other recommendations?
 
Put your FRFR on a pole, it'll disperse your tone better than a cab. Or give your back another workout, spend that extra money, and find out for yourself.
 
I have an AXE FXII - Allen and Heath Mixer which then feeds to a matrix GT1000FX and then to CFR12...the sounds are fantastic. I dont play in gigs so I cant answer to that...but I tried about 6 different options like boogie cabs, Yamaha HS80Ms and a few more. I also use a TC Voiceworks and feed that into the mixer so I can do vocals also through the Matrix. In fact the sound was so good that I ordered another seaker and got a stereo setup...bit of an overkill for the basement player but like I say...I dont buy no jewellery nor do I spend money on fancy underwear lol...so well what the heck you live once and live it well...I do what I do with passion and this definetely helps.

there is a thread on levelling...I used a standard downloaded app on an android and adjusted all presets...took me about 1/2 hr to 1 hr...set the high gain sounds to like 4db higher based on some inputs I recieved via the forum and it works great...switching now doesnt involve having to run to the knobs to adjust volume...

The CFRs are surprisingly light especially for those that come from the Guitar cab world....I would say a bit heavier than the HS80Ms....however a lot more beautiful sound...The other option to consider (though I would strongly suggest the matrix) is either matrix powered amps (I think they were planning to release some) or maybe the Atomic wedges which are a lot less expensive...but I wd do the Matrix if I had to do it all over again...just my 2c.
 
CLR has a straight cab format too. You can go with a powered speaker and eliminate the power amp. The wedge format can carry a room, you just have to position them a little differently
 
guitarjim said:
Wow, super helpful responses, thanks everyone. Can't wait to dig into the rig and participate as a knowledgeable user.

I'm sold on going straight to FRFR. If I'm taking the plunge I might as well shoot for the optimum configuration. A quick follow up on speakers. In smaller venues, we only run vocals through FOH, so rather than a monitor, I need an actual cab that will fill the room. Matrix has their Q12, which seems suited. Any other recommendations?
Click to expand...

I highly recommend the RCF NX12SMA. It's as loud as youll ever need. Very tight low end. Doesnt break up at loud volumes. Very musical. And has a fairly good spread. PLUS....you can probably grab a used one fairly cheap now. They are for sale all over the place since the new Atomic dropped. I'd also check out the Atomic but I personally like the size and weight of the RCF. Of course I haven't had a chance to try the new Atomic. I'm afraid if I do I may want to switch. I Have GAS problems.
 
boltrecords said:
I highly recommend the RCF NX12SMA. It's as loud as youll ever need. Very tight low end. Doesnt break up at loud volumes. Very musical. And has a fairly good spread. PLUS....you can probably grab a used one fairly cheap now. They are for sale all over the place since the new Atomic dropped. I'd also check out the Atomic but I personally like the size and weight of the RCF. Of course I haven't had a chance to try the new Atomic. I'm afraid if I do I may want to switch. I Have GAS problems.
Click to expand...
I agree 100% except for getting one cheap part. Although more guys are selling them they are still going to be ball park $1000 used. I would not call that cheap but that speaker is sick! It sounds so good it will make you smile with every note and I am not just saying that. It is truly a joy to play
 
I see some for sale at 900 shipped. That's a great deal. That's all I meant by cheap. They seem to have dropped in price from around 1000 over the last week and there are also a lot more for sale lately.
 
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