[Fixed 17.02] IR Player volume lower compared to CAB in 17.x

yyz67

yyz67

Fractal Fanatic
Anyone notice a relative volume drop in the IR player block? I have a good number preexisting presets that use both CAB and IRP (leveled to each other), and across the board the IR player volume is (maybe 6dB?) lower with 17.x.

I know Cliff reworked the IRP block so there may have been changes that affect the IRP output volume but it wasn't mentioned AFAIK.

@FractalAudio, if this is the way it is now (new feature, no bug) I'll adjust accordingly...
 
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I think you're right here. If I set up the same block on the IR Player and the Cab block and switch between them, there's exactly a 6 dB difference.
 
It used to be there was something like a 9 dB difference which IIRC Cliff said was because the IRP block didn't do minimum phase? Anyway, I had adjusted them relatively a long time ago (I think with 6-9 dB bump to the IRP) but now they sound quieter.

I haven't checked to see if the actual level parameter was somehow auto adjusted between 16 and 17.

EDIT: confirmed that the ~9 dB difference is between tone match and saved IR of it played through IRP, not necessarily between CAB and IRP of same IR.
 
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yyz67 said:
It used to be there was something like a 9 dB difference which IIRC Cliff said was because the IRP block didn't do minimum phase?

Anyway, I had adjusted them relatively a long time ago (I think with 6-9 dB bump to the IRP) but now they sound quieter.

I haven't checked to see if the actual level parameter was somehow auto adjusted between 16 and 17.
Click to expand...

Hmmm...Interesting. I came upon 6 dB by just boosting the level of the IR Player until it sounded the same as the Cab block.
 
The other thing is, I've compared the two blocks before, in earlier versions of the firmware, and I've never heard a volume difference until now.
 
Okay. Maybe I'm recalling incorrectly and the ~9 dB difference was between a tone-match and a user cab saved version of it in IRPs. (EDIT: yes, confirmed.)

But you see 6 dB diff anyway so I'm not imagining things. Thanks.
 
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Okay. Just weird that it changed (6 dB) from 16 to 17. I might try to go back to 16.05 and see if it goes back.
 
yyz67 said:
Okay. Just weird that it changed (6 dB) from 16 to 17. I might try to go back to 16.05 and see if it goes back.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I really thought that in previous versions of the firmware that if you loaded the same IR in the Cab block and the IR Player block that they would be the same volume. If you do find that to be the case, could you please post it to the thread for the new release? Cliff is monitoring that thread.
 
I tracked down the issue by going back to 16.05. Preset attached (saved in 16.05).
  • In 16.05: the CAB and IRP have the same level for normal cab (MP) IRs and I can get them to cancel with both set to 0 dB.
  • In 17.01, the IRP is effectively 6 dB lower by default (in default PARALLEL mode with 2nd IR off). However, if I switch to SERIES mode the IRP level is the same as CAB.
So it looks like a small bug in the 17.x IRP in PARALLEL mode.
 

Attachments

  • III-CAB vs IRP (16.05).syx
    48.2 KB · Views: 2
This is not a bug. If you are using only a single IR you should set the mode to Series. In Parallel mode you will get half the signal because only half the IRs are being used. Either that or increase the Level control by 6 dB.
 
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