"Best" amp (or FRFR) for AX8 live/ gig

Lee Servis

Lee Servis

Inspired
Hi all,

I'm an FX8 owner and love the lay-out (in fact the whole unit) and am about to purchase a new AX8. Yes, I know the AX8 has been discontinued and the FM3 is on the horizon, but I'm still feeling a LOT of love on the forum for the AX8. Plus I'd rather wait and hear some solid reviews/ watch some good vids before I even consider the FM3.
My big question - and, yes, I know I'm potentially opening a very subjective can of worms - is: what is/ are the best suggested amps (or FRFR ?) to use with the AX8 in a live, gigging situation? I've been blown away by some of the amp models etc., I've heard from the AX8.... BUT, surely if I use it with an amp (even an ultra clean Fender tube amp) the amp models will be coloured/ affected by the Fender? Then I started to read up on the FRFR alternative (I'm leaning towards a Dynacord AMX-12A) but am hearing very mixed reviews about FRFR... as one would expect, I guess.
Any suggestions, pointers would be HUGELY appreciated.

Many thanks in advance
 
Using the AX-8 in conjunction with a normal guitar amp doesn't really get you anywhere beyond what you've already got with the FX-8, IMO.

You're going to lose the power amp modeling and speaker modeling...

I think either FRFR or stick with what you have... And if you're going FRFR, then the top contenders are (definitely search and read, but this is where things are):

CLR
Xitone
RCF NX
Mission Engineering Gemini 2
AccuGroove

I've started hearing good things about those DynaCord cabs but haven't heard them myself.

Also, maybe not what you meant, but how will you purchase a "new" AX-8? They are no longer for sale new...
 
I'm using an Atomic CLR Neo wedge and really enjoy the sound, features and functionality in live performance.
 
Thanks both very much for your responses.
I thought using amp models with a real/ tube amp might be defeating the object .
So... when I decide on an FRFR do I just plug AX8 into it as I would my amp and use it as such? No other gadgetry required then? I’m a simple man... so need to keep things as simple as possible.
G66 in Europe confirmed two days ago they still have some brand new AX8 stock... as well as a few B stock units (used I guess that means).
Thanks again for your advice/ suggestions.
 
Lee Servis said:
Thanks both very much for your responses.
I thought using amp models with a real/ tube amp might be defeating the object .
So... when I decide on an FRFR do I just plug AX8 into it as I would my amp and use it as such? No other gadgetry required then? I’m a simple man... so need to keep things as simple as possible.
G66 in Europe confirmed two days ago they still have some brand new AX8 stock... as well as a few B stock units (used I guess that means).
Thanks again for your advice/ suggestions.
Click to expand...
Assuming you're using a powered FRFR, you will just plug in... But you may need to properly gain stage the setup.

I wondered if maybe you were in Europe and buying from a distributor... B-stock usually means a return or some "imperfection".
 
I guess I will go for a powered FRFR (i’m Guessing that’s the preferred option?) but i’m unsure of what you mean by “you may need to gain stage the set-up”. I’m not the sharpest tool in the box and have always been very much plug in and play.
Thanks again for taking the time to respond. Much appreciated.
 
Lee Servis said:
Thanks both very much for your responses.
I thought using amp models with a real/ tube amp might be defeating the object .
So... when I decide on an FRFR do I just plug AX8 into it as I would my amp and use it as such? No other gadgetry required then? I’m a simple man... so need to keep things as simple as possible.
G66 in Europe confirmed two days ago they still have some brand new AX8 stock... as well as a few B stock units (used I guess that means).
Thanks again for your advice/ suggestions.
Click to expand...
Right -- part of the reason I've been using this digital rig for the last year rather than my tube amp rigs is the simplicity of this setup.

Guitar->AX8->CLR (and -> PA system)

No wet-rig or rack, no add'l pedal board.

Yes, if you're going the FRFR route and simplicity is your preference, you'll want a powered FRFR. I think the neo CLR is among the best sounding and is absolutely the best value. And it's quite light and portable.
 
Very, very helpful. Thank you.
So one area (among many, lol) that confuses me.... if I have the FRFR (CLR for example) can I just play straight through that? Or do I NEED to go through a PA also?
Sorry for the ‘dumb’ questions but i’m a total newbie to the whole amp modelling/ FRFR arena.
Thanks again.
 
Lee Servis said:
I guess I will go for a powered FRFR (i’m Guessing that’s the preferred option?) but i’m unsure of what you mean by “you may need to gain stage the set-up”. I’m not the sharpest tool in the box and have always been very much plug in and play.
Thanks again for taking the time to respond. Much appreciated.
Click to expand...
You need to "optimize" the input of the FRFR and the output of the AX-8 with regards to the level (gain).
 
Lee Servis said:
Very, very helpful. Thank you.
So one area (among many, lol) that confuses me.... if I have the FRFR (CLR for example) can I just play straight through that? Or do I NEED to go through a PA also?
Sorry for the ‘dumb’ questions but i’m a total newbie to the whole amp modelling/ FRFR arena.
Thanks again.
Click to expand...
That depends... Some people use FRFR for backline, some only for personal monitoring, some for both.

If you can, then you'll benefit from sending it to the PA as well.
 
I still use a CLR for gigs, but have started using the Headrush 108 for rehearsals. It’s only 19 pounds and makes for a way easier set up. Can’t say it’s as good as the CLR but it sounds really good still to my ears and has plenty of punch. Found it for $167 as a returned model!
 
Ok, thank you... i’m learning a lot here.
Still not sure exactly what “optimising the input of FRFR and output” means (or how to even actually do it, lol) but i’m sure i’ll get there if I do some research.
Many thanks again.
 
Lee Servis said:
Ok, thank you... i’m learning a lot here.
Still not sure exactly what “optimising the input of FRFR and output” means (or how to even actually do it, lol) but i’m sure i’ll get there if I do some research.
Many thanks again.
Click to expand...

It’ll all start to click as you begin your journey. When I bought my AX8 I assumed I could dial in pristine tone using anything to amplify it. Most of my playing is with a band where the amps aren’t mic’d and it’s just vocals thru the PA. I didn’t know what FRFR was at the time. Fortunately you can run the AX8 into the FX return on an amp and get absolutely great tones. Some folks run into the input of the amp and it’s really just up to your ears. The point I would stress is to research and ask questions to see what application is going to suit you.
 
Lee Servis said:
Ok, thank you... i’m learning a lot here.
Still not sure exactly what “optimising the input of FRFR and output” means (or how to even actually do it, lol) but i’m sure i’ll get there if I do some research.
Many thanks again.
Click to expand...
Have you ever used a mixer? Think of the input to a powered FRFR like a simplified mixer channel strip (because that's basically what it is).

You want to make sure you aren't sending an Output signal into the input of the FRFR that is too loud or too quiet.
 
unix-guy said:
Using the AX-8 in conjunction with a normal guitar amp doesn't really get you anywhere beyond what you've already got with the FX-8, IMO.
Click to expand...
Have you used the AX8 with a 'normal' amp? It gets you much beyond what's capable than with an FX8. It can actually sound great when using the amp modeling into the front of an amp. Very slight edge of breakup on the amp seems to yield the best results in my experience. I've had more success in this configuration than using the fx loop of an amp and used it live for a few months before committing to direct to FOH.

Regarding the 'must turn off the power amp sim', it's dependent upon the amp model (AX8). Some sound better with it on, other with it off. Just a matter of experimenting. The cab modeling is another matter, most don't sound very good through a normal guitar cab with it engaged.
 
Thanks a bunch Bman... that all makes a lot of sense.
Unix-Guy: no i’ve never used a mixer - i’ve always plugged my pedals/ FX8 straight into my tube amps (Fender Blues Jnr; Marshall DSL; or Mesa Rectiverb 25 combo.
Joker iii... I haven’t purchased the AX8 yet - just about to order it - but have been using my FX8 with my tube amps.. with great results. I thought the whole point of the AX8 was to NOT use it with tube amps as that will colour/ affect the sound you want from your modelled amps?
Thanks for all the feedback folks... love these forums and, more importantly, the people who take time out to share their expertise and experience with newbies like me.
Cheers
 
Lee Servis said:
I haven’t purchased the AX8 yet - just about to order it - but have been using my FX8 with my tube amps.. with great results. I thought the whole point of the AX8 was to NOT use it with tube amps as that will colour/ affect the sound you want from your modelled amps?
Click to expand...
That's the beauty of it; there's no "right" way to use it. True, using modeling with a tube amp will color the tone from a purist's point of view and kind of defeats the purpose of the AX8. But using it with my tube amp was a great way to make the transition from the FX8 and an amp to direct with the AX8. It allowed time to get used to the idea as well as learn how to dial in the AX8 without having to struggle with a "poor" tone during the process.

The biggest factor, and probably what helped more than anything using a tube amp, was not having to figure out which cabinet IR to use. It was just a matter of dialing in the amp model just like any other amp; Gain, Bass, Mid, Treble and Presence. Once there was a comfort level dialing in the amps, it was then a matter of finding an IR that was close to the cabinet I was using. This was key to going direct; not being familiar with most of the cabs in the AX8, I was able to find one of the actual speaker I used and was very familiar with. This was a tremendous help in dialing in the direct tone.

After dialing in different amps with the familiar IR, it was time to try other IRs that were "correct" for the amps I wanted to use. The difficulty here was resisting the urge to try to make the new IR sound like the one I was used to. Learning to like and get used to the tone the way it was 'supposed to' sound.
 
Wow... a very comprehensive response there Joker iii - thanks so much. If honest, I don’t even know what IR us/are.... all I do know is that i’m loving the FX8... but recently have been loving what i’ve been coming out of the AX8... some of the Plexi sounds have blown me away and that’s just one example of many.
Again, I really do appreciate you taking the time to share your thoughts and experiences with me.
 
JoKeR III said:
Have you used the AX8 with a 'normal' amp? It gets you much beyond what's capable than with an FX8. It can actually sound great when using the amp modeling into the front of an amp. Very slight edge of breakup on the amp seems to yield the best results in my experience. I've had more success in this configuration than using the fx loop of an amp and used it live for a few months before committing to direct to FOH.

Regarding the 'must turn off the power amp sim', it's dependent upon the amp model (AX8). Some sound better with it on, other with it off. Just a matter of experimenting. The cab modeling is another matter, most don't sound very good through a normal guitar cab with it engaged.
Click to expand...
Fair enough... My comments should have been prefaced with "for the most authentic results".

I remember when I let a friend (and fellow forum-ite) run his Axe Fx through my Matrix amp instead of his tube power amp that he'd been using for a couple years. And his reaction: now my AC30 sounds like an AC30!

And soon he ended up with a Matrix amp, too.

Many amp models rely quite a lot on the power amp and it's characteristic distortion for much of their tone.

Can it sound good with a traditional amp and cab? Most definitely... But something like the AC30 or the Plexi (as mentioned by the OP) isn't going to sound the best that it can when used that way.
 
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