Axe vs Eleven [vs HD500] clip

Re: Axe vs Eleven clip

Clark Kent said:
There's some weirdness in the mix since both sound overly cutting. I'd scoop the mids a bit. When I tried the 11R all cab sims were scheisse. So i guess the fizzy version is 11R. What amp sims/cab sims were used?
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Fair enough. I prefer my amp tones to be 'cutting', with less top and low end. I find that if I keep it this way, the notes come out more articulate, and adding highs and lows pushes the guitar back in the mix. If this were a final mix I would have messed with post-amp EQ, but that wasn't the purpose of my test.

Thanks for the feedback!
 
Re: Axe vs Eleven clip

ElectricPhase said:
The two tones aren't dialed in similar enough for comparison. That said, I liked the darker sounding set better across the board.
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I started out by making a patch on the Axe that I liked, recorded the takes and then tried to match it with Eleven. If they aren't similar enough for comparison, it is simply because the two modelers just sound different. Like I said, I didnt use any post-amp EQ because I wanted to hear what the models sound like right out of the box
 
Re: Axe vs Eleven clip

mortega76 said:
Ok... I have a test for you...

Each one of these pictures is supposed to be an accurate digital representation of an orange... Which one looks more like an orange?
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:D Funny, but you never mentioned which one of the two you like better.
 
Re: Axe vs Eleven clip

mouzer said:
mortega76 said:
Ok... I have a test for you...

Each one of these pictures is supposed to be an accurate digital representation of an orange... Which one looks more like an orange?
Click to expand...


:D Funny, but you never mentioned which one of the two you like better.
Click to expand...
Hahahaha... the way you had both patches setup... I preferred the 11R only because it was brighter... I would love to hear a single track using the same "amp" on each unit each with the same dial settings... 1 o'clock on low, 2 o'clock mid, etc... whatever as long as they are identical... then maybe using the same IR in a DAW.
 
Re: Axe vs Eleven clip

mouzer said:
Fair enough. I prefer my amp tones to be 'cutting', with less top and low end. I find that if I keep it this way, the notes come out more articulate, and adding highs and lows pushes the guitar back in the mix. If this were a final mix I would have messed with post-amp EQ, but that wasn't the purpose of my test.

Thanks for the feedback!
Click to expand...

I love cut! In this recording there's something unnatural sounding that cuts through in the midrange so I felt you should lower the guitars in the mix. That would lead to losing the low end/high end cut so that's why I'd simply scoop the mids a bit but that's just my opinion.
 
Re: Axe vs Eleven clip

Clark Kent said:
I love cut! In this recording there's something unnatural sounding that cuts through in the midrange so I felt you should lower the guitars in the mix. That would lead to losing the low end/high end cut so that's why I'd simply scoop the mids a bit but that's just my opinion.
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Thanks again for the feedback. Theres no doubt that things could sound better, I'll continue to play with the session, just because I like mucking with things :D I'll definitely give your suggestion a try.

As far as setting up the Axe and 11 with the same settings and comparing...it would be real silly. Even though these are both 800 emulations, the models react differently to the dials. The 11's controls react more like the real thing (I often keep the bass and treble low on a real JCM800/JMP), while the Axe sounds more like the real thing :lol:
 
Re: Axe vs Eleven clip

mouzer said:
The 11's controls react more like the real thing (I often keep the bass and treble low on a real JCM800/JMP), while the Axe sounds more like the real thing :lol:
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This is exactly how I see it, too.
 
Re: Axe vs Eleven clip

Clark Kent said:
I love cut! In this recording there's something unnatural sounding that cuts through in the midrange so I felt you should lower the guitars in the mix. That would lead to losing the low end/high end cut so that's why I'd simply scoop the mids a bit but that's just my opinion.
Click to expand...

Hey man-

I tried going back and scooping some of the mids out with post amp-eq. It didnt really tickle me too well, so I tried turning down the mids in Eleven (I can't on the Axe because the tracks were already printed) and the tone turned all mushy.

Theres something about the mids in Eleven...they just don't seem to be there like on the Axe. With the Axe, all the frequencies are there and they sound great in the stereo image, but with Eleven the 'meat' just doesn't exist, let alone the details. Without the cranked mids, Eleven turns into a mushy mess, and the hash-y fizzy highs dominate the tone.

I'll keep your suggestion in mind next time I go tone dialing and give it a try. Thanks again for the suggestion!
 
Re: Axe vs Eleven clip

mouzer said:
Theres something about the mids in Eleven...they just don't seem to be there like on the Axe. With the Axe, all the frequencies are there and they sound great in the stereo image, but with Eleven the 'meat' just doesn't exist, let alone the details. Without the cranked mids, Eleven turns into a mushy mess, and the hash-y fizzy highs dominate the tone.
Click to expand...

That sums up my experience with the R11 pretty well. I owned one for a couple of months till I gave up tweeking high gain tones and bought the Axe. I just couldn't get a bright heavy sound without too much fizz and some strange boxy feel in the mid range.
 
Re: Axe vs Eleven clip

Hey mouzer,

Thanks for posting these clips.

I listened to them on my laptop speakers. The riffs were cool. I can't say which one I think is better, but the Axe-Fx seemed more 3D in that it seemed to spread out from the speakers more than the 11. The solos on both tracks seemed a little quiet on my laptop speakers.

Nicely played.

-Lopp
 
Re: Axe vs Eleven clip

Listening now.

I agree the solo needs to be mixed up, but I understand these are demos. Great material; great playing/performance (tight!) and hooks. I enjoy listening to music this well done. You understand the craft and do a great job.

The 11R version, to me, is less dimensional. There is something on the top end of the 11R, and I hear it on every 11R recording, that lacks the clarity of a real amp and the Axe-FX. There's this 'purity' on the Axe-FX; that is futzy on the 11R. It doesn't sound bad, it sounds great. It's much more clear than most any other modeling source, but I hear it.

The Axe-FX version, is much more amp like and doesn't grate at all. I'd dial up the tone different; but that's my aesthetic and taste - not yours.

I can almost always pick out that top end on the 11R and find it somewhat odd that other guys cannot hear it, or at least don't listen for it. Doesn't matter how you dial it, it's the character of the highs.

All COMPLETELY IMHO. Utterly subjective and posted in the spirit of trying to express my opinion with more... clarity. On the high end. :D
 
Re: Axe vs Eleven clip

Hey guys thanks for the feedback and compliments :D

Scott, I agree with you about the top end on the 11. I've been spending the past couple days messing with the mixes, trying pre-amp EQ, post-amp EQ, various ways of driving the 11's amp modeler, as well as all sorts of analog-ish 'sweetening' plugins, etc. Its just not working for me. I've tried switching amp models in an effort just to get closer to the Axe's tone with no avail.

To me, the Eleven mix equates to a regular TV signal while the Axe is a crystal clear 1080p. As soon as the Axe kicks in, all the 'snow' in the 'picture' disappears, and everything on the 'screen' becomes clear as day. It's just easier. There may be more to tweak on the Axe, but once you've settled on a tone, the mixing process seems to be way easier.
 
Re: Axe vs Eleven clip

Just from listening to those two recordings I would say that the 11 uses the top end to mask the lack of complexity in the mids. At first I thought that the Axe sounded muddy, but that is probably my preference I would probably just dialed down the mids or little less of drive to acomplish more clarity, because there is too much going on it the mids for my liking. But again that is a good thing. :) but with the 11 it seems that you have to make it sound more in your face, because you simply don't have the stuff in the middle to fill it with, so the highs will get your attention ...

but that is only my opinion, I am just describing what goes through my head right now ... :)
 
Re: Axe vs Eleven clip

Hey guys. Just bumping to let you guys know I added a few Pod HD500 mixes to the comparison. I couldn't decide which one I liked best out of the models so I posted three (out of the 6-7 that I had).
 
Re: Axe vs Eleven clip

I just now listened to all of them for the first time!

1. I'd definitely choose the Axe as the one that sounded the "best" to me, it was definitely the most tube tone dimensional. I will have to echo what Scott said, I too would dial up the tone differently.

2. For me, the Eleven Rack was a near second. It had good tube tone and sounded nice and dimensional. I agree about the Eleven Rack having top end character that Scott mentioned, I did notice it when I had mine, but it didn't bother me because it was so much better than the POD's and BOSS I had been using before. The ONLY reason I didn't keep my 11R was its' lack of editing ability especially on the effects side of things!!! The 11R tones I think are a great bang for the "budget buck", certainly as huge step above the POD's and the BOSS. I've recommended the Eleven Rack to a few of my friends that simply couldn't afford the Axe-Fx and after they got it they sold all their POD and BOSS stuff too.

3. The POD HD's are definitely a clear step up from the older POD's but I still don't like the tone they deliver, it is still much to straight line, sterile and low dimensional. There was definitely a more dimensional feeling to the POD HD tones which does make it better than the previous POD's, but it still has that sterile "low budget" digital tone feel to me!

It was really good hearing all the clips sided by side the way you put them up! I've been trying to do some tone matching between my Prophesy and the Axe and it's HARD tedious work!

You ROCK dude!!
 
I felt like all the mixes were a bit weird sounding. (did I already say that before?) Anyways I had the chance to try the HD500 yesterday and the cab sims are the weakness. Since all those guitar tracks sound equally weird are you using the same plugins/compressors/multiband compressors/EQs with them?
 
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