Axe II vs Kemper for this tone...which is better

Re. the above post. The Axe-Fx II uses two floating-point TigerSHARC processors. Their list price is around $300 ea. The KPA uses one fixed-point Motorola processor. It's list price is around $12.

If that's indeed the case, then ya gotta give the Kemper dude "mad props" for creating such a stir in the $2000 digital amp world with a $12 processor. This has got to be a positive reflection on the power of the profiling amp+cab together as one profile approach!

This takes nothing away from the Axe Fx approach but there is no doubting the fact that the KPA has shaken things up a bit in the higher end digital amp world!

At the end of the day it's all good for us consumers of guitar related shit!!!
 
If that's indeed the case, then ya gotta give the Kemper dude "mad props" for creating such a stir in the $2000 digital amp world with a $12 processor. This has got to be a positive reflection on the power of the profiling amp+cab together as one profile approach!!

More like mad props for successfully marketing an overpriced modeler with a cheap processor.
 
Floating-point processors will sound different than fixed-point. With fixed-point you run into problems with finite word-length effects more easily than floating-point processors, especially if you are oversampling. The more you oversample, the more word-length you need. The Axe-Fx II uses 40-bit math in the amp modeling for this reason. Regular SHARCs can only do 32-bit math and Motorola DSPs are only 24 bits.

Well, I guess I just learned something :)
 
More like mad props for successfully marketing an overpriced modeler with a cheap processor.

I guess Muse who use the KPA live for all amp tones & the Axe II for effects have been fooled by the Kemper marketing!

I own an Axe II & a KPA + many great tube amps & I have no dog in this fight like some of you seem to. I don't care or give a rats ass about any particular company or owner/inventor to be honest with you. It's all replaceable gear to me at the end of the day.

Both the Axe & KPA are very good products. The Axe II is a much more mature product with better options & I prefer it overall at this point, but the KPA has shaken things up & done great things in a little over a years release time here in the USA.

If something sounds good nobody cares what's under the hood!
 
I guess Muse who use the KPA live for all amp tones & the Axe II for effects have been fooled by the Kemper marketing!

You said it, not me. And that's beside the point. The Kemper is very overpriced for the component quality/features. That doesn't mean that people won't find a use for it, particularly multi-platinum bands who can afford to blow a couple grand on a whim. :lol
 
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The Great thing about choosing the AxeFX II is that it holds its Value VERY Well.
If you find it is not for you they generally sell for good money on eBay especially if you list it to sell overseas.
When I bought mine it was during the "Waitlist" times.
Back then they were selling for More than you could buy it for!
So I figured worst case I would make a few hundred dollars.
Of course... I fell in love with the AxeFX II and could not come to part with it.

My problem with the Kemper is that it can "Capture" a Real Amp and Mic setup, but then it is a bit in-flexible from that point.
You cannot simply select a different Mic. You cannot change the Mic Distance.
Your "Learned" Amp is Learned as an Amp and Cab and Mic Combo.
This is probably great for some, but not so much for my needs.

Then the Axe at FW6 we got ToneMatching. This allows you to setup an Amp and Capture the EQ curve of what you are looking to Recreate.
I personally do not use the ToneMatching very Much. Just Straight up Amps and Cabs.
 
More like mad props for successfully marketing an overpriced modeler with a cheap processor.

The Kemper is clearly fine for many folks who want an easy solution. IT DOES A GOOD JOB.

There is no doubt the Axe II is deeper and more advanced. Whether it does a better job on *this tone* or *that tone* is a matter of opinion...nothing else.

Don't get caught up in 'mine is better' arguments. It goes nowhere. Be fookin' happy with the gear you have.
 
The Kemper is clearly fine for many folks who want an easy solution. IT DOES A GOOD JOB.

There is no doubt the Axe II is deeper and more advanced. Whether it does a better job on *this tone* or *that tone* is a matter of opinion...nothing else.

Don't get caught up in 'mine is better' arguments. It goes nowhere. Be fookin' happy with the gear you have.

My point has only been that it's overpriced. Period.
 
Galo is a friend of mine. Shoot me an email at webmaster@ and I'll introduce you. He's Axe-Fx all the way. We just hung out at NAMM last week.

WAY OFF TOPIC WAY

Would you dare to ask Galo wether he can share some of his Santana settings on Axe particulat from Abraxas and Supernatural?

thanks

Roland

On the Kemper thing I have no comments except how much amps,truely modelled do you have in a Kemper?
 
It's difficult to dial something into a Kemper profile that wasn't there to begin with. I'm hearing a thick but detailed attack on Galo's clips that's not in the Peter Fisher clips.

I have an AxeII, Kemper and Fuchs ODS50 and am not saying the profiles aren't accurate, just not profiles of the amp dialed in the same. For Galo's tone I would look at the Axe II, there are quite a few Boogie and ODS style models that could fit.

If you get the Axe check out both the Drive and Input Trim as well as tone controls to get the overdrive right, then use the Graphic EQ in the amp block to get the detail in the attack.
 
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Thanks Max, that is exactly what I was wondering, some specific ideas on how to get there with the Axe. I think the tweakability of the Axe is what would get such a tone possibly better than the Kemper, even with a profile of Galo's amp and settings (due to the kempers imperfections, even if very slight).

I think what makes some people think the kemper tones are superior to the axe is that with the kemper there are many good profiles that one can download instantly for just about any amp, and bam it's there. Instant gratification. Whereas with the Axe being a more complex unit, there is more tweaking involved and not that same instant gratification. That is why I am so surprised that there aren't any 3rd party presets done by someone who really knows the unit (someone like Scott Peterson) where a person can just plug in a usb flash drive or something and have just unbelievable preset after preset....instant gratification. Like the Kemper has the amp factory, and back in the day the Digitech GNX modelers had a SuperModels CD with tweaked amps and numerous artist presets and such. I think this instant gratification and ease of use is really the weakest point of the unit and could be remedied in this one fell swoop.

I think if someone went through each amp and made some presets for that amp that showcase the way that amp has been historically used would be a great idea. All types of advanced settings could be incorporated into these presets. Like on the Axe 2 wiki page for Scott Peterson : tips and tricks he has article titled: Understanding Speaker Resonance in the cab block, amp block, reverb block etc. It would be killer to have these settings for each preset and any other settings an advanced user has found to be optimal. So there could be a few or many presets for each amp that showcase what the amp was intended to do or how the amp was and is most often used , but done in a very professional detailed manner, with all the tips and tricks in the presets, even with the effects block set up with effects in an intelligent way.

The presets could even be in 2 categories: direct and live. Where minor tweaks could be made to make the presets better for higher volumes (like on the Axe wiki page tips and tricks Tyler Grund talks about putting para eq mid boost for live, or adding a little reverb to all live patches, or whatever) One could even go so far as to have the same presets slightly tweaked for a Strat, PRS, or Les Paul and the user just chooses from a menu. There could be artist patches for every major guitarist and maybe on this forum there could be a page where people could suggest certain artist tones and with each update Fractal could add more killer presets. Heck they could even include tone matches of acoustic guitars. I just think of these possibilities and how nice it would be to have something like this. People would have such a good starting point for each amp and probably would have to do very little tweaking. It would be killer if Fractal packaged a USB flash drive with the unit itself with all these killer presets, all in a very friendly organized manner that even a child could understand.

The key would be for Fractal to continuously improve and update these presets with each update....and in one fell swoop, the Axe's weak point is no more.
 
I think what makes some people think the kemper tones are superior to the axe is that with the kemper there are many good profiles that one can download instantly for just about any amp, and bam it's there. Instant gratification. Whereas with the Axe being a more complex unit, there is more tweaking involved and not that same instant gratification.

Spending hours auditioning profiles to find the 'one' is tweaking as much as spending hours dialing in an Axe preset is tweaking. It's not instant gratification when you had to run through a couple hundred profiles to find 'the one'. Both devices involve some amount of discovery.


That is why I am so surprised that there aren't any 3rd party presets done by someone who really knows the unit (someone like Scott Peterson) where a person can just plug in a usb flash drive or something and have just unbelievable preset after preset....instant gratification.

There are a few users who have uploaded great collections of presets, Fremen's are well regarded.

The drive, tone, master on the Axe behave like the real amp - and real amps don't behave like other amps. A good place to start is with a model of an amp you know. As you move on find out how people dial in a real amp, or find an artist's settings, then use those settings on the corresponding Axe model. Don't worry about deep parameters as Drive, tone, Master get you most if not all the way.
 
I personally think the only issue with our presets versus 3rd party expensive profiles is marketing. People pay money for those amp preset or profile packs and some artist or producer has been paid to tell you how wonderful they are so they must be the best thing since sliced bread, right?

However, factory presets everybody is conditioned to think they suck because everybody knows factory presets have sucked since they got their Digitech GSP-21 in 1989, right?

A huge chunk of our artists use factory presets or slightly modified variants. They sound amazing. A lot of them are very close to default amp settings with a complementary cab block. Nothing fancy.
 
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+1 on Fremen's presets and some great factory ones. If you know how to tweak an amp, getting great sounds from the Axe isn't hard. If you're trying to use a bunch of effects and get creative that way, it's trickier, but, again, Fremen's presets (and others' as well) have all kinds of great effects stuff.

In the basic sound world though, I don't know how it could be easier now. Pick an amp, cab, little verb or delay if you want. Adjust the drive and tone controls. Smile. Play. Play. Smile. Play etc. Obviously cab choices matter a lot and you can lose yourself for days in that world, but great basic sounds are there with almost no effort. It wasn't always so, but now the Axe is practically plug and play to get very giggable sounds very fast.
 
+1 on using the AxeFx factory presets with very little changes. My most frequent changes would be to bypass some blocks and change the basic amp controls. Very very usable for me.

To my ears, the Amp Factory profiles, and various clips posted that use these profiles, sound very pro and good. They are dirt cheap and the folks at the Amp Factory seem like good folk to me. I don't consider them hyped beyond what they are.

Richard
 
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