Amp cuts out when changing channels

markyd

markyd

Inspired
Hello,
My FM3 has a audio gap when changing amp channels. It also has the gap when changing scenes when the scene has an amp channel change. My AXEFXIII does not have this problem. The gap is about a quarter to a half second. The CPU is at about 79%. (I don't like to miss the first note of the solo!) I am running 1.04. I am NOT running FM3 edit. Attached is the preset. (Pay no attention to the the mixers in the preset, I am using those for continuous controls that have been disabled for testing.) I was expecting the switching to be not as quick as my III, but the fact that the audio actually cuts out completely will make the FM3 just not usable for me. Any thoughts? Thanks.
 

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I don’t have an FM3 to test. Curious if the Amp types are the same between channels. Not sure if there is a difference in the audio ‘gap’ if the Amp type doesn’t change.
 
I have the same issue. Coming from an hx stomp, I was expecting scenes to work the same as snapshots in terms of having seemless switching....
 
markyd said:
Hello,
My FM3 has a audio gap when changing amp channels. It also has the gap when changing scenes when the scene has an amp channel change. My AXEFXIII does not have this problem. The gap is about a quarter to a half second. The CPU is at about 79%. (I don't like to miss the first note of the solo!) I am running 1.04. I am NOT running AX3 edit. Attached is the preset. (Pay no attention to the the mixers in the preset, I am using those for continuous controls that have been disabled for testing.) I was expecting the switching to be not as quick as my III, but the fact that the audio actually cuts out completely will make the FM3 just not usable for me. Any thoughts? Thanks.
Click to expand...
Did you have FM3-EDIT running?
 
biskitboy said:
I don’t have an FM3 to test. Curious if the Amp types are the same between channels. Not sure if there is a difference in the audio ‘gap’ if the Amp type doesn’t change.
Click to expand...
The amp type is the same between channels A and B. The only difference is the input gain is turned up on channel B.
 
Try removing some blocks to get the CPU down a little and see if the gap goes away. I think if the CPU is high, switching slows down since audio processing is always given priority.

Also, if you're just changing that one parameter, you can also use a scene controller to change the gain setting between scenes.
 
How much of a gap are we talking about? The amp block does mute when changing channels to avoid any pops or cracks. It’s very short, and there and numerous threads documenting/discussion the short gap.
 
As a workaround until the final answer is known, I would use Scene Controllers as mentioned by @mr_fender. Or use a control switch. I always use control switches for my "dry" signal so I can have them persist across my scene changes which are all "wet". You should give it a try, it might give you new ideas on how to build your presets.
 
mr_fender said:
Try removing some blocks to get the CPU down a little and see if the gap goes away. I think if the CPU is high, switching slows down since audio processing is always given priority.

Also, if you're just changing that one parameter, you can also use a scene controller to change the gain setting between scenes.
Click to expand...
I did that, and I can get the gap down to an acceptable length, but basically just and amp and a cab. Kind of useless at that point...
My Ultra was fine, my AXEFXII was fine, my AXEFXIII is fine, they all change PRESETS with no gap. I was expecting to have to use scenes rather than presets with the FM3, but just the gap with just changing amp channels make that unuseable.

I was under the impression that as long as the CPU is under 80%, things should be ok...

A scene controller is an interesting idea, but I already have a CC attached to the amp gain.
 
biskitboy said:
As a workaround until the final answer is known, I would use Scene Controllers as mentioned by @mr_fender. Or use a control switch. I always use control switches for my "dry" signal so I can have them persist across my scene changes which are all "wet". You should give it a try, it might give you new ideas on how to build your presets.
Click to expand...
That is a good idea, but I really like having a CC pedal already attached to the amp gain.
 
I just opened your preset on my III. I see the modifier on the Input Boost which is fine (I use CS's for this). Nothing is preventing you from assigning a Control Switch or Scene Controller to the Input Drive & the Level at the same time. Nothing is currently assigned to those. You don't need extra switches for this. You can use an extra one for CS but it's not necessary. There is a CS per Scene function too. This definitely looks like a good use of Scene Controllers here, and you shouldn't get any gap at all.

Preset looks pretty cool! Now, I need to go have a listen to it.
 
biskitboy said:
I just opened your preset on my III. I see the modifier on the Input Boost which is fine (I use CS's for this). Nothing is preventing you from assigning a Control Switch or Scene Controller to the Input Drive & the Level at the same time. Nothing is currently assigned to those. You don't need extra switches for this. You can use an extra one for CS but it's not necessary. There is a CS per Scene function too. This definitely looks like a good use of Scene Controllers here, and you shouldn't get any gap at all.

Preset looks pretty cool! Now, I need to go have a listen to it.
Click to expand...
Thanks for checking out my preset. I really appreciate it. I will see if I can rethink the way I make presets to use scene controllers instead of amp channels.
This might work to change the gain for leads, but I think to change to a clean amp it might not be a workable solution.
Thanks for the help!
 
IIRC, there was a fairly recent update to the III that improved channel switching speed for the amp block that has not been ported to the FM3 yet. Am I recalling that correctly?
 
markyd said:
I did that, and I can get the gap down to an acceptable length, but basically just and amp and a cab. Kind of useless at that point...
My Ultra was fine, my AXEFXII was fine, my AXEFXIII is fine, they all change PRESETS with no gap. I was expecting to have to use scenes rather than presets with the FM3, but just the gap with just changing amp channels make that unuseable.

I was under the impression that as long as the CPU is under 80%, things should be ok...

A scene controller is an interesting idea, but I already have a CC attached to the amp gain.
Click to expand...


Yes m the Ax3 had an update that fixed the channel gap and preset changes much faster , I think your clip above is normal its just where we are at right now with the FM3 switching speeds
 
Randalljax said:
I think your clip above is normal its just where we are at right now with the FM3 switching speeds
Click to expand...

If that is true then it's quite disappointing; those gaps are very noticeable. I would be very interested to hear others experiences. The AX8 got to be pretty seamless. I turned down my invite for the headphone-less FM3 and am having second thoughts about the HP version now, (not just because of this issue and I know this is early on and Fractal does tend to fix things pretty quickly, so don't shoot me!).
 
the FM3 is on Version 1.xx, as alluded to. though we don't know if the Axe3 faster changes can be added to the FM3 in the same capacity, it's been stated that it hasn't made its way over yet.

most other gear that i've used - and i've used a lot, being the ordering manager for a large local music store - i've had to press any switches slightly before the downbeat as well. my peers in local music here do as well with all their gear. i think it's a lot to ask for analog or digital systems to change sounds seamlessly, instantly, smoothly, etc.

yes, in some music styles and situations with a single guitar, it is crucial to change sounds that quickly. the way the pros do it is have 2 amps or more so only audio path is changing, not channels or anything else. one amp for clean, another for dirty, maybe another for lead. even in "signature amps" with several channels, that pro is usually using multiple amps as i just described for the fastest changing, cleanest audio.

in the Axe world, that would be the equivalent of 2 Axe units, or a preset with 2 Amp blocks or other blocks that need seamless switching, and Scene changes so audio is just muting and unmuting, no channels or other settings actually changing. it's a reality of audio processing. of course the FM3 doesn't have 2 amp blocks, and i'm not at all suggesting using 2 FM3 units. but seamless instant audio is very difficult for a lot of gear to handle.

i guess i tend to change Scenes/Presets around an 1/8 note early (depending on tempo). then it's ready to go for the downbeat. if i need seamless gain change from clean to dirty, i'll usually use the same amp channel, use Scene Controllers to change the Input Drive and other parameters, and/or unmute a Drive block if i need high gain - like the Ruckus or something.

chances are, the audio gap will be reduced, as it has on all previous FAS gear.
 
markyd said:
My Ultra was fine, my AXEFXII was fine, my AXEFXIII is fine, they all change PRESETS with no gap.
Click to expand...

Really? I upgraded from Ultra to FXII just to have scenes... And I'm still having a switching gap in the III.

IMHO, seamless AMP changes is the kind of functionality we cannot expect in the FM3. I am for myself debating over staying with AxeFXII or going for FM3 as a backup exactly for this.
 
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