All effects - is one more effect impossible? Wrong approach?

[Fretts]

If you’re dead set on having all switches toggle effects then an FC6 is your only solution to get you to the required 15 switches. There are plenty of creative ways to get you where you need to go, but if you’re unwilling to explore them then that is your only option.

Actually I have poked around with most of these options and found that I did not enjoy that kind of operation. I realize that if I were in a set situation like a long tour or a scripted show of some kind, it would work to perfection after some "button rehearsal" to get used to what changes to make during and between songs, since it was never going to change.

 

[Fretts]

I know you are hesitant to go the route because of the extra expense with the FC controllers, but the way the Fractal gear works together as an integrated system can't be understated. And if you are only using one additional FC, all you need to connect the two devices is a single XLR cable. If you keep them close to each other you can easily get away with a 3 foot-er.

I approach cover gigs a different way than you do though. Neither way is wrong, they are just different approaches. I originally used a preset per song approach back in the Axe FX II days but as you know, setlists and song order can be very fluid in a cover band situation. There were a few too many instances of me hunting for the preset and coming in a bar or two late for my comfort so I switched it up to using 3 basic presets (clean/crunchy/heavy) that gave me an easy 'base' sound and then effects were switched in and out on the base for individual songs situations. I use scenes heavily for switching in and out of lead tones or stunt sounds quickly.

It gets pretty quick to switch in and out sounds for different songs when you are only using 3 presets and 3-4 scenes per preset. It also lets muscle memory kick in when you use a system for each of the presets like - scene 1 base (typically clean to eob) sound, scene 2 like 1 but with added balls, scene 3 effects, scene 4 lead. Combine that with channels on the effects and you can string together radically different tones with a minimum of dancing. For songs that required extra effects or stunt sounds, I'll throw that in as an extra preset. For example, I set up an intro for a song using M@'s Blade Runner preset that went over very well.) But most shows, I got by with 3 or less presets typically using 2-4 scenes per preset. That said we played mostly pop songs not prog epics.

I guess that TLDR of the above ramble is:

Don't fear using an FC-6 or FC-12 with your FM-9. It just works and the extra setup time for the second bit of kit is really negligible due to the simple one cable plug and done method Fractal has implemented. If you absolutely need the switches, it's the best solution. Otherwise you need to do some dancing or change your methodology.

The thing I worry about for you is if you get an FC-6 and suddenly you add a song to your setlist and need a 16th switch...

That's a great answer and you do understand the nature of a covers project. I try to embody the essence of the records I am covering; I don't have to, it's just a point of pride and gives me a challenge I enjoy. The upshot of it is - I need a lot of variety during the course of a set. Absolutely I could sit down and map out an entire setup for each different gig for the songs and the order they will be in, but that would be a lot of homework for a single event. Your 1-2-3 method is interesting and I will give it a shot. Especially since your situation seems not too different from mine. It might be a good compromise vs a completely flat layout with everything visible at the same time.

 

[md1234]

I use the OCD quad to switch the FC-12 between the presets, scenes, or master layout in a pinch. Works great for me. This can all be done with just the Fm9, but I don't like to have to constantly be tap dancing through layouts.

Not to derail the thread, but I was wondering how to set this up: switch the FM9 to another layout with an external footswitch.

 

[Mystic38]

He wants to use it like a pedalboard. Instant access to any effect at any time.

Scenes don't address that.

We have to remember that my use case is not your use case and that is not the OP's use case.

Many do want to use it the same way. It's a valid scenario in my opinion.

But there are limits and you have to be crafty to work around some of them.

You actually missed my point.

With all respect, "Using it like a pedalboard" is not actually what he wishes to achieve, that is a "how" to do something, not a "what" to do.

I assume from this thread that he wishes to change the sound/tone of his rig with minimal tap dancing (as do we all no?), and there are numbers of ways to incorporate presets/Scenes/effects along with stand in switches to do this.

Different tools often require different approaches, and an advanced modeler is a different tool. The OP is not facing any different a problem than other other user of Fractal gear... I was simply advocating stepping back and looking at solutions to meeting his core needs in a different way.

 

[Mystic38]

Not to derail the thread, but I was wondering how to set this up: switch the FM9 to another layout with an external footswitch.

You can do this with a "stand-in switch", a single switch per pedal jack on the back is supported. This can mimic pressing any FM9 button on any layout, including switching to another layout. check the manual and youtube.

I currently use 2, one for the tuner, and one for the looper layout.. IF you want the same switch to revert back (such as for say an fx bank A>B switching) then map the target switch to revert back otherwise you may have to tap dance to get out..lol

 

[md1234]

@Mystic38 Thank you for pointing me the right way. I will look into it!

 

[unix-guy]

You actually missed my point.

With all respect, "Using it like a pedalboard" is not actually what he wishes to achieve, that is a "how" to do something, not a "what" to do.

I assume from this thread that he wishes to change the sound/tone of his rig with minimal tap dancing (as do we all no?), and there are numbers of ways to incorporate presets/Scenes/effects along with stand in switches to do this.

Different tools often require different approaches, and an advanced modeler is a different tool. The OP is not facing any different a problem than other other user of Fractal gear... I was simply advocating stepping back and looking at solutions to meeting his core needs in a different way.

Then we disagree on what the OP is asking for.

I understand quite clearly about different approaches. The OP clearly said what he wants.

Please reread this:

Thank you for the input. I'm pretty clear about what I want to achieve; I'm having trouble achieving it within the way the FM9 works. What I actually want is an array of 12 effects immediately accessible, and very likely another 3 soon to come for a total of 15. So far, I have squeezed much of it out of 9 switches by having three switches do double duty via Hold functions to change FX channels or to invoke another effect entirely.

 

[Mystic38]

Then we disagree on what the OP is asking for.

I understand quite clearly about different approaches. The OP clearly said what he wants.

Please reread this:

I was, and am, fully capable of understanding the words the OP wrote..

I responded with a contributing post to suggest the OP goes back to first principles to reassess WHAT he wishes to achieve rather than HOW to implement a legacy method previously used.. and a flat fx board view is a legacy implementation view of HOW an outcome is achieved in a pedalboard system, and is not a goal (WHAT) in itself.

FWIW, This process is a well known and understood method to use when there is a shift in perspective, as in this case, the use of a Fractal unit rather than a pedalboard.

TL/DR - My post was meant to stimulate a thought process for the OP to consider the many different ways he can now skin a cat and use what the box had to offer rather than to force fit the FM9 into a legacy viewpoint.

If you don't agree with my post, thats ok, it was for the OP to decide if it had any value to him

 

[unix-guy]

If you don't agree with my post, thats ok, it was for the OP to decide if it had any value to him

That I definitely agree with

 

[Fretts]

I certainly appreciate the attention this discussion has received!
Hellbat's suggestion seems the easiest to implement for me, given my mindset.
Adding an FC-6 would undoubtedly work, but what holds me back on that idea, besides the money, is that the result would be unwieldy. A big part of the appeal for me was the prospect of reducing my pedalboard realestate requirements down to a compact self-contained all-in-one unit.
I've done a bunch of experimenting at home with the FM9 , a bunch of rehearsals and one gig with it. Now I'm going to do my next rehearsal with my familiar pedalboard and see if I like it better, or less, or the same. It's been a while and I might have a rosier memory of it than reality.

There is always the possibility of going hybrid and using my certain special pedals on a board with the FM9 doing duty as a multi-effects station. For that, I'd probably want an FM3.
Next rehearsal is tomorrow night so this should be an interesting comparison.

 

[Fretts]

I did a rehearsal with the original pedalboard and as expected, it sounds great. I had about a minute when I needed to fix one of the patch cords that was misbehaving but no complaints about the sounds.
A week later I brought the FM9 again and it was also very good - no complaints there, either.
So, all things considered, I'm going to roll with the FM9 until further notice.
I have added a Lovepedal COT in front of it and it is just great, the guitar just loves it, wants to marry it. If I could get a proper model of that pedal, I would be entirely in the box for these rehearsals and live gigs. Hope that will happen!