John Mayer plugin tips

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FractaNoob

New Member
Looks like his new plug-in with neural just dropped today. Im sure I could just buy it, however ive been loving my fm9 and dont really want to buy another software. Im sure the experts here could help me achieve a setup that is similar with the fractal tools.

My current preset im loving is basically a two amp setup in parallel, one fender clean, one driven, blended together with footswitch 2 (leaving footswitch 1 for volume swells) I have 3 different scenes setup up for different voicing, 1 for "chime" or sparkly breakup, 2nd is classic rock smooth midrange, and a 3rd for when I need modern chunk

I only say this because it would seem that mayers plug in has a similar setup, blending 3 amps together in parallel, with different voiced OD's.

A few things that stick out to me that id love some info from you guys:
*thanks by the way im new to this fractal world
Id love to know what you guys think the amps are based off, for instance The "smooth operator" amp on his plugin appears to me as a bassman, and one is a probably two rocket not really sure about the other
The "gravity tank" im interested in playing with, any tips?
The post amp reverb, and eq/compressor i havent played much with but im interested to incorporate into my sound/ and maybe some examples of what you guys use for this
Last thing would be the "doubler" function, which basically would allow me to record two tracks and have one be slightly different. Could this be achieved with amp speaker impedance, or cab "alignment"
Apologize for the novel here, but I figured id be as detailed as possible, ive noticed there are a lot of follow up questions that really bog things down
Thanks!
 
I think it's based off a dumble

As for the doubler, this has been addressed already, I don't remember what the reason is exactly, possible intellectual property, but it's not happening any time soon. Some people have been able to get close though, look through the forum
 
The main amp is a dumble model the Fractal ODS or overdrive special is a Dumble
There is a doubler type effect I believe in the Petrucci presets from Cooper it supposed to be like a TC mimic or try the enhancer as well
 
Thanks
Randalljax said:
The main amp is a dumble model the Fractal ODS or overdrive special is a Dumble
There is a doubler type effect I believe in the Petrucci presets from Cooper it supposed to be like a TC mimic or try the enhancer as well
Click to expand...
Thanks ill look into it, id be using it for purely tracking purposes, so id love a solution for always recording different tracks
 
Mayers Dumble is the Steel String Singer (#002). The Dumble from FAS is an Overdrive Special (I don’t remember the number). I’m sure someone here could tell you the difference and/or how to “mod” the ODS to be more like the SSS.

The other two amps are a ‘65 (I think) Fender Vibroverb and a Two Rock John Mayer signature (a prototype version).

Apparently the “magic” lies with using all three amps together.

I do plan on taking advantage of the 14 day trial and doing my best to recreate his tones on the FM9 after I get back from tour next week.

One of my favorite past times is to recreate tones from plugins on the FM9. It’s just so easy to literally get any sound that’s already available (plus MANY that aren’t).

Isn’t the doubler basically the same as the enhancer block? Maybe the classic mode?
 
Aja said:
Mayers Dumble is the Steel String Singer (#002). The Dumble from FAS is an Overdrive Special (I don’t remember the number). I’m sure someone here could tell you the difference and/or how to “mod” the ODS to be more like the SSS.

The other two amps are a ‘65 (I think) Fender Vibroverb and a Two Rock John Mayer signature (a prototype version).

Apparently the “magic” lies with using all three amps together.

I do plan on taking advantage of the 14 day trial and doing my best to recreate his tones on the FM9 after I get back from tour next week.

One of my favorite past times is to recreate tones from plugins on the FM9. It’s just so easy to literally get any sound that’s already available (plus MANY that aren’t).

Isn’t the doubler basically the same as the enhancer block? Maybe the classic mode?
Click to expand...
Ok sweet thanks, im honestly curious what people come up with
 
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Aja said:
Apparently the “magic” lies with using all three amps together.
Click to expand...
Great project!
Watch Rett Shull video about the plugin, he did a bit of reverse engineering, not a lot of "magic", just careful gain stacking & use of EQ etc.
To the OP, The "Gravity tank" does not exist, it's a combination of Strymon Flint spring reverb & an harmonic trem unit.
 
assaf110 said:
Great project!
Watch Rett Shull video about the plugin, he did a bit of reverse engineering, not a lot of "magic", just careful gain stacking & use of EQ etc.
To the OP, The "Gravity tank" does not exist, it's a combination of Strymon Flint spring reverb & an harmonic trem unit.
Click to expand...
For sure. I meant “magic” as in the thing that everyone fawns over with it.

The thing that I’m curious to reverse engineer myself is the subtle (or not so subtle) use of post eq, filters (if any), post compression, his use of the Katana as an “always on enhancer” etc. It may be a bit hyperbolic but Mayers tone has been long long long theorized and to see this come out is pretty impressive (in regards to Mayer being involved with an amp sim at all) considering the snobbery coming from Mayer over the years. There is no “magic” when it comes to gear, and I love when artists pull back the veil and show us that as well.
 
A vibroverb and the two stone 35 will get you pretty close. I dont actually think the amps make a huge difference as they are set really clean. The key is the way he uses his pedals. You need an always on keeley katana boost, a klon, a TS10 and a blues breaker. Seems like to match the plugin you would use 3 drive blocks. Fist would be a katana (look up Jon Kaneshiros video on how to approximate it with the FET boost), drive block 2 would be the klon (modelled in the FM9) and the third block channel A would be a TS10 (not modelled, a ts 808 would work although i have heard the maxon OD808 (maxoff OD808) is actually closer to a TS10) and channel B would be a Bluesbreaker (modelled as "blues OD"). From there add an envelop filter, a harmonic trem, and a reverb block with channel A set to your favorite spring, channel B set to you favorite hall, and channel c you favorite plate. Add a compressor and parametric EA after the amps and you have it. With that setup, you should be 98% there. Mess around with the room parameter in the cab section as well.
 
So the amps modeled in the NDSP plugin are a Fender Blackface Vibroverb, a Dumble Steel String Singer, and a Two Rock John Mayer signature (but an unreleased prototype).

Fractal has a Blackface Virboverb model so that should be fairly easy to replicate.

For the Two Rock, Fractal has a model of a Two Rock Jet 35. However, it only models the overdrive channel, not the clean. There are ways to dial it in so you get a cleaner tone but it never really worked for me personally.

For the Dumble, Fractal has a lot of Dumble models. However, they're models of a Dumble Overdrive Special (or models of clones of an ODS). The clean channel of the ODS can get you in the Mayer ballpark but an ODS doesn't really have the same headroom as a Steel String Singer (or so I've been told. I've never played the real ones)

Fractal doesn't have a model of a Steel String Singer BUT there is a way to make one using advanced parameters. @Austin Buddy describes here how to make a Dumble Steel String Singer by using an Ampeg SVT bass amp model. Legend has it that a Dumble Steel String singer is essentially the Pre-amp tone stack of a Dumble ODS, but the power section of an Ampeg SVT. You can re-create that by changing the tone stack of the Ampeg model.

I use this as my main "Mayer-inspired" clean and I absolutely love it. This really gives you the high-headroom clean pedal platform. I compared it to the Dumble model in the JM plugin and I have to say that it's pretty comparable.
 
FractaNoob said:
Looks like his new plug-in with neural just dropped today. Im sure I could just buy it, however ive been loving my fm9 and dont really want to buy another software. Im sure the experts here could help me achieve a setup that is similar with the fractal tools.

My current preset im loving is basically a two amp setup in parallel, one fender clean, one driven, blended together with footswitch 2 (leaving footswitch 1 for volume swells) I have 3 different scenes setup up for different voicing, 1 for "chime" or sparkly breakup, 2nd is classic rock smooth midrange, and a 3rd for when I need modern chunk

I only say this because it would seem that mayers plug in has a similar setup, blending 3 amps together in parallel, with different voiced OD's.

A few things that stick out to me that id love some info from you guys:
*thanks by the way im new to this fractal world
Id love to know what you guys think the amps are based off, for instance The "smooth operator" amp on his plugin appears to me as a bassman, and one is a probably two rocket not really sure about the other
The "gravity tank" im interested in playing with, any tips?
The post amp reverb, and eq/compressor i havent played much with but im interested to incorporate into my sound/ and maybe some examples of what you guys use for this
Last thing would be the "doubler" function, which basically would allow me to record two tracks and have one be slightly different. Could this be achieved with amp speaker impedance, or cab "alignment"
Apologize for the novel here, but I figured id be as detailed as possible, ive noticed there are a lot of follow up questions that really bog things down
Thanks!
Click to expand...
I got the plugin and have been testing it. It really boils down to the reverb, that’s a huge part of the sound. Stacking a TS10 into a Klon is also key.

I recently bought a Nano Cortex, so last night I started cloning the hell out of the new plugin. I’ll probably buy it once it goes on sale.

Watch this video it explains everything about the amps, FX, and cabs.

 
nicolasrivera said:
I got the plugin and have been testing it. It really boils down to the reverb, that’s a huge part of the sound. Stacking a TS10 into a Klon is also key.

I recently bought a Nano Cortex, so last night I started cloning the hell out of the new plugin. I’ll probably buy it once it goes on sale.

Watch this video it explains everything about the amps, FX, and cabs.

Click to expand...

The gain staging is definitely important, but I think people dismiss the clean amp too easily. Any clean amp will get you in the ball park, but there's an immediacy, snap, and responsiveness in the Steel String Singer and Two Rock cleans. Not only are they high headroom, they're very fast amps with virtually no sag and that's a super important element to the tone and feel IMO.

As I mentioned before, the Austin Buddy Steel String Singer Mod is the best way to get that IMO.
 
I'll buy it. These are some my favorite tones after all. As much as I depend on Fractal for almost everything, I am still almost 100% using plugins for recording. So until/unless FAS releases "AxeFX Native" as a VST, it'll likely stay this way.

That said, I'll at least try to wait 90 days - that's when NDSP starts to honor various coupon codes and discounts. I want them to get as little of my money as possible, hahaha
 
GMGM said:
I'll buy it. These are some my favorite tones after all. As much as I depend on Fractal for almost everything, I am still almost 100% using plugins for recording. So until/unless FAS releases "AxeFX Native" as a VST, it'll likely stay this way.

That said, I'll at least try to wait 90 days - that's when NDSP starts to honor various coupon codes and discounts. I want them to get as little of my money as possible, hahaha
Click to expand...
Why not use the FM9 as an input device within your DAW? With fractal edit open it really is like having a plug in ready to record at any moment.
 
GMGM said:
I'll buy it. These are some my favorite tones after all. As much as I depend on Fractal for almost everything, I am still almost 100% using plugins for recording. So until/unless FAS releases "AxeFX Native" as a VST, it'll likely stay this way.

That said, I'll at least try to wait 90 days - that's when NDSP starts to honor various coupon codes and discounts. I want them to get as little of my money as possible, hahaha
Click to expand...

Man, FAS would absolutely dominate the modeling world as a whole if they finally went the route of providing software and hardware intercompatibility like Line 6 with Helix Native. I came from the Line 6 ecosystem, where I could jump from the DAW to the stage and back at the press of the Export Preset button, never missing a thing and having the exact same sounds in both environments, with the convenience of a VST plugin when at home or in the studio, and the reliability of dedicated hardware when performing.

It's the only thing that still at the back of my head that keeps me from feeling I'm 100% a FAS world convert now.
 
Aja said:
Why not use the FM9 as an input device within your DAW? With fractal edit open it really is like having a plug in ready to record at any moment.
Click to expand...

There are many reasons...

- FM9 is in my rehearsal space (not at my DAW workstation).

- FM9 is my live rig, I need to be able to work faster - and more seemlessly - in my DAW. And if I'm working a mix remotely, I don't want to carry additional hardware with me.

- FM9 has fixed sample rate @ 48kHz. No human can actually hear the difference between 48 or anything higher, but it really does become an issue if you do any serious sample manipulation (ie - like big time stretches or pitch manipulation).

- My DAW is Windows based, and I'm too stubborn to switch. But the truth is that Windows has sh#t the bed for audio. Somehow, we're still largely dependent on ASIO drivers, which are still unable to aggregate audio interfaces, So in order to use FM9, it needs to become my audio interface, which means re-pathcing my speakers, and a bunch of outboard gear - or worse - wearing headphones. Maybe SPDIF could b an option - but since my interface doesn't a SPDIF connection, it doesn't really matter.

- I can better latency with plugins than I can with a messy FM9 re-amp setup.

- TLDR: I just prefer plugins (for recording).


Phosphenetre said:
Man, FAS would absolutely dominate the modeling world as a whole if they finally went the route of providing software and hardware intercompatibility like Line 6 with Helix Native. I came from the Line 6 ecosystem, where I could jump from the DAW to the stage and back at the press of the Export Preset button, never missing a thing and having the exact same sounds in both environments, with the convenience of a VST plugin when at home or in the studio, and the reliability of dedicated hardware when performing.

It's the only thing that still at the back of my head that keeps me from feeling I'm 100% a FAS world convert now.
Click to expand...

There are so many great plugins today, but I'd happily delete them all for AFX Native VST :)

I mean, how cool would it be to use the same sounds from your record, on stage?

But also, I totally understand why FAS hasn't released an AFX plugin. It'd cannibalize too many hardware sales, which would NOT be in their best interests. But still, I'd be among the first to adopt it if it ever did happen :)
 
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