Which FRFR? Is it worth it?

I tried a bunch of them and I really like the Laney FR112 and FR212. They have the option to be "voiced" like a 1x12 of 4x12 so you can turn off the cabsim on your FM3. It does take some fiddeling with the knobs, but you can end up with an adequate "amp in the room" sound that way. Also you can fiddle with the highs on the cab itself should you find yourself playing in a darker sounding venue. They're loud as flock and, should this be a consideration to, not all that expensive. The frontlight is cheesy, but you can turn that off. On the other hand, if you were already gigging in the eighties like me, you might be raised on the notion that there's no such thing as visual overkill.....
 
I tried a bunch of them and I really like the Laney FR112 and FR212. They have the option to be "voiced" like a 1x12 of 4x12 so you can turn off the cabsim on your FM3. It does take some fiddeling with the knobs, but you can end up with an adequate "amp in the room" sound that way. Also you can fiddle with the highs on the cab itself should you find yourself playing in a darker sounding venue. They're loud as flock and, should this be a consideration to, not all that expensive. The frontlight is cheesy, but you can turn that off. On the other hand, if you were already gigging in the eighties like me, you might be raised on the notion that there's no such thing as visual overkill.....
Just had a Laney 112 delivered today. Sounds very nice with either the FM3 or AX8. Hope to give it workout at tomorrow's gig.

Paired alongside my 2 Headrush 108s the tone is big, full, and powerful.
 
Just had a Laney 112 delivered today. Sounds very nice with either the FM3 or AX8. Hope to give it workout at tomorrow's gig.

Paired alongside my 2 Headrush 108s the tone is big, full, and powerful.
Interesting. How are you running that? For example, the Laney mono from one of the Output 2 jacks and the 108s from Output 1 (stereo of course)? Are they just mirrored or are you doing a wet dry thing?

That is DEFINITELY going to be a lot of sound. I finally got my 108s working well (using the output PEQ discussed earlier) and it is plenty loud. I have the 108s dialed to about 75% and the output pushing about 1/2 volume and it is just about right with the band levels.
 
Interesting. How are you running that? For example, the Laney mono from one of the Output 2 jacks and the 108s from Output 1 (stereo of course)? Are they just mirrored or are you doing a wet dry thing?

That is DEFINITELY going to be a lot of sound. I finally got my 108s working well (using the output PEQ discussed earlier) and it is plenty loud. I have the 108s dialed to about 75% and the output pushing about 1/2 volume and it is just about right with the band levels.
Yes the sound is mirrored right now. Laney - Out 2 / Headrush - Out 1.

Going to layout a signal path so I can experiment with a W/D sound today.

Laney : HR.jpg
 
I think I may be giving up on a FRFR system but will be converting to an SS amp through my Marshall 1936 cabs. I tried that using a Crown XLi2500 amp and really liked it. Then I wouldn't have to lug around my pair of JCM900 heads that I currently use as power amps.
 
This is my gigging set up. Ideal for small venues, plenty loud and my presets are based on Austin Buddy’s Live gold ones - absolutely top drawer and sound amazing.

View attachment 101787
Is that the FR212 cab or just a regular vertical 2x12? The HB200 is making me question it.
I've been trying with a pair of those instead of lugging two 4x12s around. (This is for a brutal and loud metal band for reference).
 
Is that the FR212 cab or just a regular vertical 2x12? The HB200 is making me question it.
I've been trying with a pair of those instead of lugging two 4x12s around. (This is for a brutal and loud metal band for reference).
It’s the fr212 cab - I’ve got the power amp there as a back up in case I use a normal 2x12. Gives me the option for both.
 
It’s the fr212 cab - I’ve got the power amp there as a back up in case I use a normal 2x12. Gives me the option for both.
What type of music are you playing? Do you think that thing compares favorably to the punch send power of an actual guitar cab? Currently using mesa 4x12 and Randall 1x15 & 2x12 cabs.
 
I’m considering an FRFR speaker but I currently have the legacy K 12 speakers. My FM three sounds best through my studio monitors and I find the K 12 response to be not very flat. Thoughts? I just want to use one or two for some stage noise like a cab.

What type of music are you playing? Do you think that thing compares favorably to the punch send power of an actual guitar cab? Currently using mesa 4x12 and Randall 1x15 & 2x12 cabs.
Musikron's response is the first question you should ask. IME with a FRFR on a loud live stage, there is no replacement for displacement. I have been terribly disappointed in any FRFR I've used with anything under 12" as a woofer, and prefer a 15" if I have to use a FRFR.

Another thing; make sure the frequency response of the FRFR you select is truly flat. Many FRFRs have some kind of "vocal response" baked in to its electronics, and this response tends to make modelers sound harsh.

I found over the years that any tweeter equipped speaker I have used for loud stage monitoring has sounded harsh in the highs. I expect it is because either the power amp gives out and the clipping harmonics are harshly thrown out by the tweeter, or the woofer starts to acoustically compress while the tweeter doesn't (making the highs louder in comparison to mids and lows). However the more you pay for a FRFR, the less this seems to happen, as the more expensive ones are much better behaved. You seem to get what you pay for in FRFRs at loud stage volumes.

I FAR more prefer to use a tweeterless stage monitor system, either a standard guitar speaker/cab or a single driver full range like the Eminence 12LTA or other multiple (i.e. whizzer) cone drivers. The Kemper Kone is of this family, and with the Kemper DSP (most likely IR and EQ) it is by far the best I have used. I haven't used the Celestion F12M-150, but it looks promising on paper (somewhat along the lines of a Kemper Kone but not needing DSP). I suspect if you ran to the pawn shop and bought a used Peavey transtube Bandit, and dropped a F12M-150 in it, you'd have a loud and good sounding high volume stage monitor right there.
 
What type of music are you playing? Do you think that thing compares favorably to the punch send power of an actual guitar cab? Currently using mesa 4x12 and Randall 1x15 & 2x12 cabs.
We are playing classic rock - i think it sounds great to be honest. It’s got a hell of a lot of punch. It sounds different from a cab but not in a bad way
 
I’m considering an FRFR speaker but I currently have the legacy K 12 speakers. My FM three sounds best through my studio monitors and I find the K 12 response to be not very flat. Thoughts? I just want to use one or two for some stage noise like a cab.
ALTO TS 310 from altoprofessional
 
Musikron's response is the first question you should ask. IME with a FRFR on a loud live stage, there is no replacement for displacement. I have been terribly disappointed in any FRFR I've used with anything under 12" as a woofer, and prefer a 15" if I have to use a FRFR.

Another thing; make sure the frequency response of the FRFR you select is truly flat. Many FRFRs have some kind of "vocal response" baked in to its electronics, and this response tends to make modelers sound harsh.

I found over the years that any tweeter equipped speaker I have used for loud stage monitoring has sounded harsh in the highs. I expect it is because either the power amp gives out and the clipping harmonics are harshly thrown out by the tweeter, or the woofer starts to acoustically compress while the tweeter doesn't (making the highs louder in comparison to mids and lows). However the more you pay for a FRFR, the less this seems to happen, as the more expensive ones are much better behaved. You seem to get what you pay for in FRFRs at loud stage volumes.

I FAR more prefer to use a tweeterless stage monitor system, either a standard guitar speaker/cab or a single driver full range like the Eminence 12LTA or other multiple (i.e. whizzer) cone drivers. The Kemper Kone is of this family, and with the Kemper DSP (most likely IR and EQ) it is by far the best I have used. I haven't used the Celestion F12M-150, but it looks promising on paper (somewhat along the lines of a Kemper Kone but not needing DSP). I suspect if you ran to the pawn shop and bought a used Peavey transtube Bandit, and dropped a F12M-150 in it, you'd have a loud and good sounding high volume stage monitor right there.

Fist bump for the No Tweeters Ever Fan club. :)

Well written post expressing views and experiences
I am so on board with. :)
 
I’m considering an FRFR speaker but I currently have the legacy K 12 speakers. My FM three sounds best through my studio monitors and I find the K 12 response to be not very flat. Thoughts? I just want to use one or two for some stage noise like a cab.
I also used my K12’s when I first got my frac. Seeing as they were also my pa speakers, I decided to get separate Frfr speakers. I went through the rundown. First I made the mistake of buying (2) Headrush 112’s, and although they do get loud, they did not sound nearly as good as my K12’s did and I felt like I was seriously downgrading and they sounded very cheap to me (I guess you get what you pay for). So I asked around and everyone seemed to say either atomic clr wedges or xitone wedges. So I went with 2 atomic clr wedges. They sounded “good” to me. Also very very loud, they sounded very similar to my K12’s. I did a comparison with my K12’s and they were almost unnoticeably slightly different. I played out of these for a little while before thinking of switching to a real cab. I came from playing through Marshall, Mesa, Orange 412 cabs and missed that real “punch” that the cabs brought. But at the same time I loved the idea of stereo effects and full range/flat response true sound. So after a brief encounter buying a matrix gt1000fx and playing through several of my 412 cabs and still not satisfied, I came across a friend who told me about this stereo Frfr cab… the Mission Gemini GM-2. When I’m telling you EVERYTHING changed for me then, I mean it. I immediately fell in love with this speaker. Not only can I run stereo, it is Frfr and has that real “punch” feel of a cab and blows air from the speakers like a real cab does. It’s like I’m playing out of one of my 412 cabs yet I have the full range of a pa speaker. Truly is the best sounding speaker I’ve ever used. And the volume…. This thing gets LOUD! The one I got is powered, so I don’t need my matrix amp for it either. I couldn’t be any happier. You sound like your going through the same thing I did. So I’m wondering if you were a real cab guy before using the k12’s? That might be what your missing. And although the clr’s sounded good, they were still missing that punch I needed, that the GM-2 provided. I have heard of many people getting (2) GM1’s and running them in stereo that way to put the speakers further apart. Me, I find the stereo in this to be amazing. I originally was thinking of purchasing another to run through (2) of them, but after using this and seeing how loud it gets, I can’t say I’ll ever need another. This speaker is a game changer. I haven’t seen anyone mention it, although I didn’t read every reply. I seen some clr replies and xitone. I haven’t tried the xitone wedges and hear great things about them, and as far as the clr wedges, I think they are great. But for me, and anyone coming from a real cab, I’d recommend the Mission Gemini GM2. It’s a 212 powered Frfr cab that has this EmPower knob to adjust how much “real cab” feel you want from your speaker. Amazing technology. They also have the GM1 (1x12” speaker) in powered and passive versions and a wedge in both powered and passive versions. My next purchase might be the wedge as a stage monitor, as I can’t justify buying another gm2 because I’ll never have use for it. This thing could play a stadium it gets so loud and the sound never distorts no matter the volume. Check it out, it was worth a mention.
 
I also used my K12’s when I first got my frac. Seeing as they were also my pa speakers, I decided to get separate Frfr speakers. I went through the rundown. First I made the mistake of buying (2) Headrush 112’s, and although they do get loud, they did not sound nearly as good as my K12’s did and I felt like I was seriously downgrading and they sounded very cheap to me (I guess you get what you pay for). So I asked around and everyone seemed to say either atomic clr wedges or xitone wedges. So I went with 2 atomic clr wedges. They sounded “good” to me. Also very very loud, they sounded very similar to my K12’s. I did a comparison with my K12’s and they were almost unnoticeably slightly different. I played out of these for a little while before thinking of switching to a real cab. I came from playing through Marshall, Mesa, Orange 412 cabs and missed that real “punch” that the cabs brought. But at the same time I loved the idea of stereo effects and full range/flat response true sound. So after a brief encounter buying a matrix gt1000fx and playing through several of my 412 cabs and still not satisfied, I came across a friend who told me about this stereo Frfr cab… the Mission Gemini GM-2. When I’m telling you EVERYTHING changed for me then, I mean it. I immediately fell in love with this speaker. Not only can I run stereo, it is Frfr and has that real “punch” feel of a cab and blows air from the speakers like a real cab does. It’s like I’m playing out of one of my 412 cabs yet I have the full range of a pa speaker. Truly is the best sounding speaker I’ve ever used. And the volume…. This thing gets LOUD! The one I got is powered, so I don’t need my matrix amp for it either. I couldn’t be any happier. You sound like your going through the same thing I did. So I’m wondering if you were a real cab guy before using the k12’s? That might be what your missing. And although the clr’s sounded good, they were still missing that punch I needed, that the GM-2 provided. I have heard of many people getting (2) GM1’s and running them in stereo that way to put the speakers further apart. Me, I find the stereo in this to be amazing. I originally was thinking of purchasing another to run through (2) of them, but after using this and seeing how loud it gets, I can’t say I’ll ever need another. This speaker is a game changer. I haven’t seen anyone mention it, although I didn’t read every reply. I seen some clr replies and xitone. I haven’t tried the xitone wedges and hear great things about them, and as far as the clr wedges, I think they are great. But for me, and anyone coming from a real cab, I’d recommend the Mission Gemini GM2. It’s a 212 powered Frfr cab that has this EmPower knob to adjust how much “real cab” feel you want from your speaker. Amazing technology. They also have the GM1 (1x12” speaker) in powered and passive versions and a wedge in both powered and passive versions. My next purchase might be the wedge as a stage monitor, as I can’t justify buying another gm2 because I’ll never have use for it. This thing could play a stadium it gets so loud and the sound never distorts no matter the volume. Check it out, it was worth a mention.

I wonder what speakers they use in those. Also wondering if the EM power knob is just a volume control for the evil tweeter(s).
 
I wonder what speakers they use in those. Also wondering if the EM power knob is just a volume control for the evil tweeter(s).
I know whatever speakers are used, they must be similar to the Celestion F12-X200 modeling speakers. I’ve used them and they push air the same and have a very flat response and full range specifically made for modeling amps. Most of these other speakers people are listing are just dressed up pa speakers. Since you already have k12’s, what pa speaker is really going to sound better? Not many. But having a Frfr real cab, makes all the difference… at least imo.
 
I know whatever speakers are used, they must be similar to the Celestion F12-X200 modeling speakers. I’ve used them and they push air the same and have a very flat response and full range specifically made for modeling amps. Most of these other speakers people are listing are just dressed up pa speakers. Since you already have k12’s, what pa speaker is really going to sound better? Not many. But having a Frfr real cab, makes all the difference… at least imo.

Yeah I like the F12, that’s what I’m using now. Great FRFR speaker. I’m curious about that control you mentioned. I saw a guy on here somewhere that had some custom cabs with tweeter controls.
 
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