Kiesel No More

steadystate

Fractal Fanatic
Please allow me to blow off some steam here.

I own four Carvin/Kiesel guitars. Two DC127's, a DN612 Double Neck, and a Vader. I've been playing them as my main guitar since 1992. But the company's quality and especially customer service, despite appearances, has gone to crap.

One example; I recently ordered a pair of H22 Holdsworth 22-pole humbuckers. The coil wiring and/or internal construction did not match the Carvin standard (I have successfully installed other H22, M22, C22, and Lithium pickups). They behaved, sounded, and tested wrong no matter how they were wired (and I am very experienced at this). My inquiries to Kiesel about the proper wiring, or the possibility of assembly error, of these H22's went unanswered. No reply. None. The pickups are in a drawer, where they will remain indefinitely.

I also recently ordered a Vader with a $400 top to be hand-selected and fit by Jeff Kiesel. I sent in pictures of the type and direction of flame I wanted. What I received was exactly what I explicitly told them I did NOT want. Since it took 12 weeks to build, and I needed the guitar to pay the bills, I kept it.

Now, the lock nut on the headless Vader is proving to be garbage. They use the ancient design, first adopted then abandoned by Kahler, where an Allen screw insert rotates directly onto the string, acting as an effective string cutter. The line between the Allen screw holding or cutting is a very fine one. You must be very very careful to screw it down hard enough, but not too hard.

Now, the nut won't hold the unwound strings. They just slip through the Allen screws no matter how hard you tighten them. This design is an abomination and should never be used on any guitar, let alone a $2000 guitar. It is a joke. Kiesel has yet offered no reply, let alone useful help. I replaced it with a $4 Chinese part from Aliexpress that has a much better design. The quality of the metal is poor, but at least the design securely holds the strings without breaking them.

I've loved and used Carvin guitars for many decades. But I'm afraid I have to say goodbye. Their customer service is a disgrace compared to what it once was. The first problem I ever had was with a 1990's double neck. Mark Kiesel called me personally to resolve the problem. That was then. This is now, and now sucks.

I'm sure dozens, if not hundreds, of you have nothing but glowing things to say about them. I was once like you, and I understand where you are coming from. I wish I could still be there with you.
 
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I have a Carvin Bolt and Contour 66 (got them a couple years before they became Kiesel) that I really enjoy, but their headless guitars are a different story. I had an HH2x for a while, and like you, quickly realized how poorly designed the nut was.

The first time I changed strings, I discovered that one of the hex nuts had been stripped, and I could not for the life of me get it out. I reached out to customer service, and fortunately they got one to me quickly, but I still ended up buying a couple backup nuts from JCustom just in case.

But yeah, those hex screws are delicate little flowers, and if you’re not super careful, they’ll fall out of the nut at the drop of a hat. Imagine that happening on a dark stage. You’d be toast!

And that is one of my biggest gripes with headless designs — there are too many unreliable fiddly bits that can easily get lost (and the fact that no one seems to make 22-fret models.)

I love the headless look and ergonomics, but until someone addresses the hardware issue, I’m done with them for now.
 
I have a KOA Carvin DC 145. It's a great guitar but I never really jived with it. The stock pups were terrible and it currently wears a JB/Jazz set that sound ok. Koa can be bright and I've been thinking of putting in a Pegasus/Sentient set. My Carvin pre-dates the Kiesel thing though and it is well made. The fret job and fit and finish is excellent. Sorry to hear you are having troubles.
 
Jeff posts shop tours on youtube really often lately. There's some amazingly beautiful things he shows, but I do worry when he says there's several hundred ready to go out and there's many more waiting. Even with cnc doing most of the heavy lifting a great guitar requires some serious quality time spent with an experienced person.
 
I've got two great Carvins, and have owned many more, but I started having service problems years before the changeover and moved on. When I first started working with them (this would be the late 70s... possibly 77-78) they were a real anomaly in the industry. They made great stuff, listened to user input, would do all the little things right. Customer service got continually worse over the years, but they were still making killer guitars. I eventually moved to the PRS 513 in 2007 and never saw a reason to go back. Nothing with the new name has pried my wallet open.
 
Bummer to hear about your problems, I thought Keisel was on the upswing with their brand new shop, price hikes and all one would think they were moving in the right direction.

Personally I've always had an issue with their electronics, specifically the pots and switches - pups not so much. Though I have been contemplating trying another swop again.

Not that I personally know Jeff but I'm going by their in a few weeks, if you want send me a PM with your info and I can drop in and personally pass on the message to him if you like.
 
From the moment the father died and that kid took over, changed the name and started running his mouth like s QVC salesman on the Internet (seriously listen to him talk on NAMM videos and tell me he doesn’t sound like he’s selling a set of steak knives) I knew there was nowhere to go but down. Then the Carvin division was killed off completely and that pretty much validated the thought process. This kinda seals the deal. My Carvin DC800 and HH2X are great instruments from a company that in my mind no longer exists.
 
I've got two great Carvins, and have owned many more, but I started having service problems years before the changeover and moved on. When I first started working with them (this would be the late 70s... possibly 77-78) they were a real anomaly in the industry. They made great stuff, listened to user input, would do all the little things right. Customer service got continually worse over the years, but they were still making killer guitars. I eventually moved to the PRS 513 in 2007 and never saw a reason to go back. Nothing with the new name has pried my wallet open.
+1 on what @Rick said.
 
Forgot to mention the longitudinal crack that developed in the fretboard spanning 10 frets and splitting three inlays in half. I've never had any other guitar with this problem. This guitar is shit. I'm submitting a claim for warranty repair, but I'm not holding my breath waiting for them to do right by me.

Jeff claims he changed the name to honor his grandfather. I suspect that it was more to stroke his own ego. I also suspect that his grandfather would be saddened at what has become of his company's service and quality control.
 
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I have some older Carvins including 2 basses. Excellent instruments. Good bang for the buck. Sad to see them going downhill so badly. You would think that management would see what has happened to Gibson, and correct course.
 
Not defending them for what happened in your case, but I love my Kiesel Vader. It's perfect as far as I'm concerned. I have no problem with the nut or any other aspect of the guitar (it does NOT have a term, however.) You should call them or email until you get through. I'd be surprised if they don't solve your problems or take care of you.

I know that's what Fractal Audio would do in this situation.
 
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I have had my 2012 CT624 for 4-5 years now but I have changed out the pots and switch and the bridge (Hip shot) perfect drop in, big difference from the cheap Wilki they were using. Other than that it's been a great guitar.

I've been eyeballing the S6X as of late!
 
From the moment the father died and that kid took over, changed the name

Mark Kiesel ain't dead

and started running his mouth like s QVC salesman on the Internet (seriously listen to him talk on NAMM videos and tell me he doesn’t sound like he’s selling a set of steak knives)

He doesn't to me. I appreciate the deep dives and inside knowledge. Hardly steak knives salesman but I guess I'm the age group of the target. I enjoy all the factory walkthroughs.

I knew there was nowhere to go but down. Then the Carvin division was killed off completely and that pretty much validated the thought process.

See I thought the other way.. After Jeff took over, I thought he infused the brand with much needed freshness, finally improving on those awful pickups almost nobody kept on their guitars, updated models that me and many others had requested from Carvin for a looong time.

The Carvin/Kiesel split was probably a family feud - but in the end... it was up to Carvin Audio to survive on their own... it's tough out there trying to manufacture electronics here and be competitive - and honestly I never associated Carvin with high quality electronics (owned an MTS320, some DCxxx amps.).

I own 2 carvins from before the transition - On my Bolt, they used an awful bridge with soft metal that I ended up replacing completely. Nut had some binding. The rest was good though.

My DC127C - they were boneheaded on the 90's and didn't want to install lock nuts... So I got mine with a Floyd and no locknut - always a turning issue. After replacing the pups and their active module (a waste of money I should say) that guitar still sings - one of my fave with 15" radius.

So yeah even before the transition, the guitar hardware quality has been spotty but the guitars themselves are great.
 
I had a Carvin CT6M with a Floyd Rose that I had built by Carvin in 2008. Beautiful guitar but would not stay in tune.
Took it to my luthier and he found the nut was installed wrong and was not stable. He had to drill out the holes, add wood dowles and reinstall the nut.

Better but still not a s stable as I wanted so I sold it.

I could have sent it back under warranty but Cali is a long way from Michigan and I took the easier route. Should have been right to begin with.
 
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