Initial impressions from a bassist and first time FAS owner

K

keith.f.kelly

Member
Great build quality, outstanding sound quality, tons of flexibility... but treats bassists and bass guitar as a second-class citizen. None of the presets seemed to be geared toward bass, and none of the drives are very well suited for bass (you can make some of them work "well enough" with a LOT of tweaking away from the default settings, but there's really no decent simulation of an MXR Bass Fuzz or a SansAmp Bass DI anywhere). All of the wahs over-emphasize the mids and tone-suck the low end right out; no equivalent to the CryBaby Bass Wah as far as I can tell.

So overall, great product, but I really hope you all plan to deliver more effects and features with bassists in mind in an upcoming firmware update.
 
Hah! Welcome to FAS. Bassists are a 2nd class citizen around here - but it is a product marketed towards guitarists, for guitarists, by guitarists. Make no mistake of that.
With that said, it's certainly usable by use low-end dwellers. It'd be nice if we were thrown more of a bone - not necessarily in presets even, but on some of the included amps/cabs/FX. It does take quite a lot more tweaking to get really refined tones from it, whereas a guitarist has many presets they can use right out of the gate. It'd be cool if FAS would include some of the presets people like SeeD, myself and others make directed towards bassists. Even just a small handful would be cool. Everytime I've offered any help, I get silence in return. It is their company, and their product. They can/will do what they want. I'll keep using it, and sinking time into using it because it's fun. It could be more fun, but oh well :)
 
It's a product advertised as working just as well for bass and other instruments, but many of its effects really do not work very well for bass at this time.
 
I also have to wonder why the folks who make this seem to have a prejudice against bassists. Do they not understand the huge missed market opportunity there? For us bassists, the only similar option currently on the market is the Zoom B3 / Zoom MS-60B, which are cheaply built and have issues with sound quality (lots of high-pitched digital artifacting and noise introduced by those units). FAS could make a killing with the FX8 if they would truly invest in shoring it up for bass players.
 
Awesome, thanks! That's what I was hoping to hear. The FX8 is a great piece of hardware, so it's a shame to see it held back for my needs simply by a few software things.
 
Well, I can't say I disagree. Bassists need to be more persistent and clever in order to get these goodies sitting properly for bass guitar. I wouldn't get too depressed being bummed out that there isn't much bass love here in FAS land. I've been there, and it doesn't get you anywhere. To the contrary, if you can demonstrate excellence in creating tones of any kind, it is usually met with recognition on the forum, and even by the FAS powers that be...so don't give up.

[edit: just saw this is FX8...apologies!] If you have the time, $$ and inclination, I'd recommend the ML Sound Labs 4x10 Ultra Res cab pack (11?), and the Ownhammer 4x10 IRs (needs Cab Lab to convert to AxeFx format). They can be the last bit that puts your tones over the top.

As a previous Sans Amp BDDI owner (sold my main and backup units), I can understand that a BDDI drive/amp model would be cool, as it is a familiar place for many bassists to live, tone wise. However, I've found that the more I've used the AxeFx, the less desirable the BDDI sounds have become. Over time, I've become much happier with the amp/cab emulations in the AxeFxII by comparison.

I had good luck with the Rat distortion in parallel, with the low filter set above 400hz or so, to keep it from getting muddy. From there, you can get it as fuzzy or gritty as you like depending on how much drive you dial in, and by tweaking the tone parameter. Parallel seems to be the key, though.

As for the wah, experiment instead with putting the wah block in parallel (again), and with fairly aggressive settings, blended to taste...OR...try using a Filter block with an expression pedal assigned to sweep the frequency, dabbling with the Q to taste. You might like it better. I agree, though, that the low and high frequency ranges of the wah block need to be adjusted lower to accommodate the sweet spot of the bass...low freq doesn't go low enough, if I recall correctly.

At the same time, I' don't think that it would kill FAS to spend a little time making some decent bass amp starting point presets. We can wish, can't we?
 
Last edited:
keith.f.kelly said:
It's a product advertised as working just as well for bass and other instruments, but many of its effects really do not work very well for bass at this time.
Click to expand...
After spending many months with my Axe-Fx II Mk 2, I would have to argue that the effects work well for bass. Yes, it often does mean needing to go in and sift through the parameters, lots of iterative testing and so on... but usable tones are definitely in there. If they weren't, I would've dumped mine by now. I've also turned several other bassists on to the Axe-Fx II - I've worked with them on building their presets and lending a hand with it, but in the end, each one has kept it and use theirs as much (or more) than I do now. Several "big name" bassists have recently or have for a long while been using these as well... hopefully, now that they have it, the rest of us "little guys" will get a small voice, over time.

It just takes a bit of time. But, once you do sink that time in, and refine your workflow for presets, it becomes easier. Still takes a heap of time, but at least you can get where you're going faster.
 
In parallel with what -- the uneffected signal? If so, aren't you just referring to the "Mix" knob? Or are you actually referring to running the DRV and WAH blocks in parallel with something else?
 
I agree that I can *mostly* dial in what I want for bass, but it's still not ideal, and it takes a crazy amount of time and tweaking. The FA folks really need to include a set of presets (or provide an alternate "Factory Defaults" set I could download from their web site and flash to the FX8) that are all targeted specifically at bass, with default values for everything that are sensible for bass.

Tangent -- forums admin might want to change the fact that "F X 8" (without the spaces) gets automatically turned into an emoji, since that product name is likely to be referenced in lots of posts going forward...
 
If I had to venture a guess... FAS has no bassists on staff to make an alternate bank of presets to do that ;). But, that is wholly just a guess.
 
G'day Keith & Welcome!
Time for use to admit it... we _are_ second class :) Having said that, the Axe FX is a great unit - Make sure you get yourself the AMPG Cab pack - Best I've seen for bass and makes a huge difference.

Pauly
 
keith.f.kelly said:
In parallel with what -- the uneffected signal? If so, aren't you just referring to the "Mix" knob? Or are you actually referring to running the DRV and WAH blocks in parallel with something else?
Click to expand...

My frame of reference is the AxeFx, so sure, the wet/dry MIX should work and is simpler than a parallel path to the main signal path.
 
pauly said:
G'day Keith & Welcome!
Time for use to admit it... we _are_ second class :) Having said that, the Axe FX is a great unit - Make sure you get yourself the AMPG Cab pack - Best I've seen for bass and makes a huge difference.

Pauly
Click to expand...

I don't hav an Axe Fx, I have an FX8 (purely effects, no cab modeling).
 
Yes, but the problem with that approach is getting a strong enough effect without tone-sucking the low end. The trick to good bass effects isn't in blending a strong amount of the original signal, it's in having the effect only manipulate frequencies in the right mid-range band suitable for bass while leaving lows and highs relatively untouched. Most guitar effects just bandpass out all the lows and highs and boost the high-mids, which may be swell for guitar but just sounds like an anemic and painful "HONK!" on bass guitar. Blending enough of the original signal back in to keep the bottom and clarity from dropping out usually leaves too little of the desired effect -- as has been the case with all of my attempts to wrestle the WAH block into submission.
 
you should search for some of Seed's bass tones, great stuff that proves you can get great bass tones with what's there....but that doesn't mean it can't be improved upon, obviously.
 
jlynnb1 said:
you should search for some of Seed's bass tones, great stuff that proves you can get great bass tones with what's there....but that doesn't mean it can't be improved upon, obviously.
Click to expand...

Agree, and props to SeeD for his Axe-Fx bass tones, but Keith the OP has an FX8.

I'm a long time guitarist and still newbie bassist.. but in my current band I'm 50% guitarist and 50% bassist, so I would LOVE to see more bass love in the FX8.
 
keith.f.kelly said:
Yes, but the problem with that approach is getting a strong enough effect without tone-sucking the low end. The trick to good bass effects isn't in blending a strong amount of the original signal, it's in having the effect only manipulate frequencies in the right mid-range band suitable for bass while leaving lows and highs relatively untouched. Most guitar effects just bandpass out all the lows and highs and boost the high-mids, which may be swell for guitar but just sounds like an anemic and painful "HONK!" on bass guitar. Blending enough of the original signal back in to keep the bottom and clarity from dropping out usually leaves too little of the desired effect -- as has been the case with all of my attempts to wrestle the WAH block into submission.
Click to expand...

This is exactly why I run a stereo (or dual-mono) bass rig. I'm a FAS newbie and still in the beginning stages of experimenting with the FX8 but, (to me) you should treat effects for bass like icing on a cake; having a dry side to maintain your fundamental low-end tone, articulation, etc. and run the wet side with just enough blended to top it all off. And so far, the effect are a good as any pedal I've used in the past. There's a Pitch Shifter in there sounds as good (and tracks better) than my old Boss OC-2.

Also, I believe the month that the FX8 was released to wait list customers FAS had a full page add for it in BassPlayer magazine. I trust FAS hasn't totally forgot about us. Heck, BassPlayer's new Artist of the year, Henrik Linder, I believe is an Axe FX II user/endorser... and he runs a wet/dry/wet rig. I'd bet his auto-pans and multi delays will make you dizzy.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom