Questions about the FM9 before purchasing

I don't know about a video, but I use the plexi models extensively. I have compared them to Pete Thorn's videos, and my own SV20H. They are spot-on. However, I can actually get them to sound not-quite exactly the same in a way that I prefer. So the real amp is just a subset of what the models can do. It's also been my experience that the speaker cab IRs are 60% of the amp tone. So that is a huge knob that you can turn that is really impossible in real life.
 
elvis said:
I don't know about a video, but I use the plexi models extensively. I have compared them to Pete Thorn's videos, and my own SV20H. They are spot-on. However, I can actually get them to sound not-quite exactly the same in a way that I prefer. So the real amp is just a subset of what the models can do. It's also been my experience that the speaker cab IRs are 60% of the amp tone. So that is a huge knob that you can turn that is really impossible in real life.
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How does that work when I plan to use the FM9 basically through my existing Friedman set up? I have a be-100 deluxe with a 4x12 Friedman cab. How does using that sound through an actual amplifier? I know a lot of people do the modeling stuff direct to their computers but I probably won't be doing that for a long while. I'll be mostly analogue.
 
For me it isn't either or. I use my FM9T 80% of the time when recording. I use it 100% of time at band practice. I used it 70-80% of time when solo practicing. In any venue with good FOH - I use it 100% of time.

The only time I use my analog pedal gear is when my Mesa amp goes into a Boss Waza Tube Amp expander for recording, or I am going to a small grab and go gig. Then I bring a 1x12 combo and a small pedal rig.

The latter is the only case that my FM9T hasn't worked for me yet, but with the recent release of the Fender FR-12, I could achieve the same result with my FM9 but with infinitely more tonal possibilities in a grab and go format. So ,,,
 
911ap said:
How does that work when I plan to use the FM9 basically through my existing Friedman set up? I have a be-100 deluxe with a 4x12 Friedman cab. How does using that sound through an actual amplifier? I know a lot of people do the modeling stuff direct to their computers but I probably won't be doing that for a long while. I'll be mostly analogue.
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It wouldn't. But if you do buy an FM9, it will very much grow with you, or you with it. My own journey started with a digital MFX with a real amp. But then I moved to a load box and cab IRs, which is ideal for playing at home. And right around that time, the load boxes and IRs got a LOT better.
And then amp models. Similar deal. I had an AXE II, and the amp models were OK, not great. And they got a LOT better with the AXE III.
 
elvis said:
It wouldn't. But if you do buy an FM9, it will very much grow with you, or you with it. My own journey started with a digital MFX with a real amp. But then I moved to a load box and cab IRs, which is ideal for playing at home. And right around that time, the load boxes and IRs got a LOT better.
And then amp models. Similar deal. I had an AXE II, and the amp models were OK, not great. And they got a LOT better with the AXE III.
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But for instance if I wanted to use the FM9 as a glorified pedal board it would work fine hooked up to my amp head and cabinet correct? I just connect it using the 4cm into the head? Also I am assuming if I wanted to dabble with the modeled head sounds it would bypass my Friedman head and go straight through the cab would it not? Similar to how synergy works if you run it through an existing amp head. It bypasses the preamp and uses the power amp and cab to produce the sound.
 
You're correct that you can run 4CM with your existing head and get the benefit of effects like OD hitting your front end and time-based effects in the loop.

And at any point you could also modify that preset to put an amp sim through your FX loop, bypassing your head's preamp completely like your Synergy. Once you find a model you like, it would take you all of 30 seconds to modify a preset if you build it with both uses in mind.

I have a feeling we'll be seeing another post in a few months raving about your FM9 🥳
 
911ap said:
I think you describe it well. I want to start with modeling the effects I want, then little by little dip my toes into amp modeling if it can actually satisfy. I started my guitar world with modeling amps (line 6 and others) and I never ever liked them compared to the actual tube amps they were trying to model.


ehhhh I've gotten close haha. I'm closer with a Friedman head than was with his actual 5150 EVH head. Honestly that head was bad. I've seen a few videos of people on YouTube who honestly nailed his tone 100%. Pete Thorn replicated it perfectly with basically copying everything he did.



Skip to 11:50 and then 13:10. See that sound becomes like this cracking super dirty distorted sound like the amp is going to blow up or something. My Friedman gives me this more refined tone not an out of control one. I got closer using a ME 70 I had laying around that I threw in there and used the OD-1 pedal on it with the phaser and delay.

^If even I get this close I'm satisfied. I'm not looking to get his guitar, a super lead, turn every setting on 10, and then add a variact.

But I'm still wondering if the pickups make THAT big a difference between humbuckers. Utopia vs I believe they are Seymour Duncans?
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That guy has a ton of stuff on the floor to get what your going after! I always thought Curt Mitchell nailed way back in the mid 90's befor everyone was trying to emulate his tone.

 
Sixstring said:
That guy has a ton of stuff on the floor to get what your going after! I always thought Curt Mitchell nailed way back in the mid 90's befor everyone was trying to emulate his tone.

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I'll be honest. The first strums he does in the first 5 minutes already sounds like how I get the Friedman with my Ibanez. Even he is not quite 100% there. The closest person I saw get it was Pete Thorn in the video he did with Dave Friedman. See he says the sound has less treble and more bass, but to me all of these are very trebly (not sure that's spelled right). Also, that sound Van Halen gets I'm wondering if that's the power tube distortion from turning the volume all the way up. Which I am guessing is impossible for me to get on the Friedman without an attenuator. I do have a PS100 on order coming soon. As of now I can barely get the volume above 2 on both the system volume and channel volume.

Also if all of these amps back in the day didn't have FX loops, that means all of their effects (delays, reverb, phaser/flanger) were run in front of the amp?
 
911ap said:
I'll be honest. The first strums he does in the first 5 minutes already sounds like how I get the Friedman with my Ibanez. Even he is not quite 100% there. The closest person I saw get it was Pete Thorn in the video he did with Dave Friedman. See he says the sound has less treble and more bass, but to me all of these are very trebly (not sure that's spelled right). Also, that sound Van Halen gets I'm wondering if that's the power tube distortion from turning the volume all the way up. Which I am guessing is impossible for me to get on the Friedman without an attenuator. I do have a PS100 on order coming soon. As of now I can barely get the volume above 2 on both the system volume and channel volume.

Also if all of these amps back in the day didn't have FX loops, that means all of their effects (delays, reverb, phaser/flanger) were run in front of the amp?
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Yea I have watched Petes vid on that he does get very close! I think Curt has the better chops though, he was way more slippery as he refers it.

I'm sure Ed ran into the front early on in a live setting! Once he was established I have read that they tapped the signal from the speaker out, loaded it down and rand the time based effects in that then to a slave amp that went to guitar cabs. or something to that effect.
 
911ap said:
Also if all of these amps back in the day didn't have FX loops, that means all of their effects (delays, reverb, phaser/flanger) were run in front of the amp?
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No. In Eddie's case, I believe it went something like this:

He got his base tone through his Marshall, mic'd the cab, sent that to his rack effects using a mixer, then sent that to power amps, then on to the stage cabs.
 
In your case, just grab some pedals. The FM9 is great but if you like to adjust things on the fly, it is not super convenient. You would want to have you PC Editor open.

On the upside, you can create setlists and with a click of a button or three, cover an entire song. There is however a fairly decent learning curve- and a 15 hour class you can sit through for $99.

It comes down to personal preference. If you have not even bought one and you are already having doubts, I would not suggest it...and especially since you said your tonal needs are pretty basic. I've gone both routes and currently built out a really nice board. I have a RC500 looper, a compressor, two delays, including the Boss DD500 which is nice, Immerse for wacky stuff and a Flint for Reverb/Tremolo...and a Boss OD pedal. I round it out with a superior Peterson StroboHD tuner. It's a really nice set-up. I can adjust on the fly easily and it sounds great. If one part fails, I can still play.

I am hoping Fractal will update the UI on their units so they are more like the new Fender Tone Master Pro (easy to adjust w/no PC needed for most things.) A FM6 would be an ideal form factor as well. If they make that, I will add it to my current set-up.
 
FXFanatic1! said:
In your case, just grab some pedals. The FM9 is great but if you like to adjust things on the fly, it is not super convenient. You would want to have you PC Editor open.

On the upside, you can create setlists and with a click of a button or three, cover an entire song. There is however a fairly decent learning curve- and a 15 hour class you can sit through for $99.

It comes down to personal preference. If you have not even bought one and you are already having doubts, I would not suggest it...and especially since you said your tonal needs are pretty basic. I've gone both routes and currently built out a really nice board. I have a RC500 looper, a compressor, two delays, including the Boss DD500 which is nice, Immerse for wacky stuff and a Flint for Reverb/Tremolo...and a Boss OD pedal. I round it out with a superior Peterson StroboHD tuner. It's a really nice set-up. I can adjust on the fly easily and it sounds great. If one part fails, I can still play.

I am hoping Fractal will update the UI on their units so they are more like the new Fender Tone Master Pro (easy to adjust w/no PC needed for most things.) A FM6 would be an ideal form factor as well. If they make that, I will add it to my current set-up.
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Yea good point. For the Boss DD500, can you return two different delay patterns simultaneously? I am thinking how Steve vai runs 2 different delays (though in his case it's one for each cabinet).

One advantage is just the FM9 would be easy to run effects in the front and in the loop. For instance if I want delay in both the loop or in front simultaneously. My doubts come more from my skepticism with modeling from my early days in the early 2000s. People raved about modeling then too and it was never as good as the analogue stuff. I'm just told that today it's come a long way so that's why I considered it. Especially when I see artist I follow have moved from their analogue set ups to fractal ones.
 
911ap said:
One advantage is just the FM9 would be easy to run effects in the front and in the loop. For instance if I want delay in both the loop or in front simultaneously.
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Section 4 in the manual describes how to set up the modeler in various scenarios, including straight into the input on the amp, followed by using the 4-cable method. And, there's nothing that says you can't do both at the same time, it's just a combination of the two and involves setting up a preset that has additional In and Out blocks. See pgs 34 and 36. And get or make some Humbuster cables to deal with potential noise.

911ap said:
My doubts come more from my skepticism with modeling from my early days in the early 2000s. People raved about modeling then too and it was never as good as the analogue stuff. I'm just told that today it's come a long way so that's why I considered it.
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Modeling has changed SO much since then. Originally they basically took a distortion box and tried to EQ it into shape. Now every component in the circuit is modeled so the overall preset acts like the amp, and even things that aren't really electronic but affect the sound, like his recent Reverb block changes, are now coming into play.

I hated the sound of early modelers because they didn't react like tubes, then they didn't react like a tube amp, then it was they didn't have the nuances of a tube amp, and now it's to the point that I like my modelers and my tube amps and then logistics and the stage environment affect my decision what I'll bring, because sometimes a little tube amp is more convenient. It's not that it sounds better, it's just faster to set up. On a big stage I'll have my Fractal and one or both of my EVs.

911ap said:
Especially when I see artist I follow have moved from their analogue set ups to fractal ones.
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The smart ones do. :)
 
911ap said:
But for instance if I wanted to use the FM9 as a glorified pedal board it would work fine hooked up to my amp head and cabinet correct? I just connect it using the 4cm into the head? Also I am assuming if I wanted to dabble with the modeled head sounds it would bypass my Friedman head and go straight through the cab would it not? Similar to how synergy works if you run it through an existing amp head. It bypasses the preamp and uses the power amp and cab to produce the sound.
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Yes, absolutely. I also use it that way at home. And way more. There's really nothing it can't do. I've gigged a TC Electronic G System, a Line 6 HFX, a Fractal FX8, an AXEFX IIXL+. I've done the "amp + Multi FX" about every way you can. The FM9 is all that.
 
As I have been watching more gear review videos I saw Metallica uses the fractal exclusively if I understand correctly? They don't even use actual amps or cabinets anymore it's all pure modeling? That is crazy. Now I am leaning towards the FM9 again. I am wondering are there people who could just program it for me? Honestly if someone programmed it for me with what I wanted (I would pay them), I'd have no qualms getting it.
 
911ap said:
As I have been watching more gear review videos I saw Metallica uses the fractal exclusively if I understand correctly? They don't even use actual amps or cabinets anymore it's all pure modeling? That is crazy. Now I am leaning towards the FM9 again. I am wondering are there people who could just program it for me? Honestly if someone programmed it for me with what I wanted (I would pay them), I'd have no qualms getting it.
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Metallica is a great example but there are tons of pros who are only using Fractal stuff direct. We knew you would see the light.

Indeed there are people who can program the units for you depending on what you want, as long as you know exactly what you'd like to do!
 
DrGreencock said:
Metallica is a great example but there are tons of pros who are only using Fractal stuff direct. We knew you would see the light.

Indeed there are people who can program the units for you depending on what you want, as long as you know exactly what you'd like to do!
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Who could program the unit?
 
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