Struggling with Marshall Sounds using FM3 + Power Amp + Real Cab

I couldn’t get the FM3’s Citrus 50 to sound like my Rockerverb 100.

On the real amp, you want the MV at 1-2 o’clock, so that’s where I always set it on the FM3.

Today I set the MV to 11 o’clock, and bam, there it is.

(this is on the wrong thread)
 
I guess that this thread is a similar problem, that I had. I thought that the fm3 has too much mids, the treble was not aggresive and bass quite flubby and not metal enough. I was dialing in an engl savage. The main problem is the master volume not correspondig to the taper of the master volume of the real amp. Other controls were just fine, but MV not. Also the impedance curve has huge impact on the behavior. Lower the bass resonance and get the MV to 7 for more defined bottom end. I prefer to leave the values where they are by default, but try to choose one, which fits my cab.
 
How could i A/B only the FM3's amps preamp to the real one? Like, to a/b only the preamp's gain stage - the power amp is only used by the real amp. If this would match, i could move on and only setup the power amp section.
 
I hooked up to a real tube head this weekend (AC30) and played through the same cabs I usually use with my FM3. The power section of the AC30 was freaking glorious. Like Marty McFly, all knobs to 11, getting knocked backwards. :) And the crazy part was that it was at reasonable volume levels. To even get close to moving the room with the FM3 set up, I was probably 5-7 dB louder.

Back to where I kind of started, is it realistic that a Fractal device can make speakers react the same? If not, it’s totally ok, I still love the device and see how it works so well for those that go direct to FOH, record and use IEMs.

I’m coming to the conclusion that for a Fractal to power amp to real cab set up, the power section is the weak link. I’ve tried Power Stations and Power Stages and nothing makes the speaker kick like a tube amp. Would a Matrix be the missing link or a heavy tube power amp? Until then, I’ll keep changing the Low Res decimal by decimal until I find the perfect setting. Thanks all!
 
Seems strange the Power Station isnt doing what you want it to. After all, apart from attenuating, thats whats its designed to do.
I have run my Axe II with Ares 2.0 through 4 different tube power sections, and it sounds stellar through every single one.
 
Flat sounding : if anything the non-cab signal from the fractal should be harsh as hell in the upper frequencies.
Are you running a cab block? I would think not.

try a low pass anywhere from 3500-8000Hz and see how that goes.

I've had great luck with the Axe -> SS power amp -> real cab setup.
 
I got a little closer today to improving the feeling of the strings under my fingers by turning up the input trim up to 1.25 (with P90s nonetheless). From what I’ve read this is similar to increasing the gain, so I’m not sure why it makes any sense. To me, it seems to thicken up the strings somewhat and the 0.25 increase doesn’t add noticeable gain to me. It also doesn’t increase the volume in any noticeable way either, so it’s a win/win.
 
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I think I’ve finally figured it out. The SD Power Stage needs a decent amount of volume to really drive a speaker. Maybe all solid state power amps do.

I try to do most of my comparisons around 80 dB to take it easy on my ears and my family. At this level the tube amps were hitting the speakers so much better versus the FM3 + solid state power amp. I then took it up a little closer to gig volume today, say 85-87 dB range, and BAM there it was. Finally found the sound that I knew was in there vs. tube amps.

I’ve clearly had it up this loud for gigs a fair amount but never when A/B’ing with another amp.

With an appropriate amount of volume almost all other deep tweaks were completely unnecessary for my purposes.

I’m stoked. Thanks all.
 
When I was using my ADA power amp ,would get a great sound around 90 db, same range.
 
I have the Duncan Power Stage as well and the tones are kind of “blah” through my 2x12 cab until the volume gets up there. I also agree that my tube amp doesn’t need to be as loud to sound great through the same cab. Maybecthe compressor block would help in the FM3 but I don’t have any magic settings or routing for that yet.
 
When playing at non band volume, I always use the Gain Enhancer on the Amp blocks compression tab.
 
Hi all, late answering to the topic,... but I will share my own experience of my preferred setup after several investigations in many Forums. Just sharing here in case usefull to somebody (free to use or fre to discard)

Using :
FM3 + PowerStage 170 + CABS Marshal 1936 & 1960
Les Paul & ESP Horizon II

SETTINGS & TODO’s:
  • INPUT sIgnal - Setup I/O INPUT 1 PAD (Close to 0 as possible)
  • On the Speaker page of the Amp block,
    • set Speak[1]er Drive, Speaker Compression to zero
    • Thump to zero or as desired
    • Set the LF Resonant Frequency to match the resonance of your connected cabinet
    • on the Advanced page of the amp block, set the Output Mode to “SS PWR AMP + CAB”.
  • GLOBAL SETTINGS: CONFIG PAGE: Speaker Impedance Curve (same as AMP Block above!)
  • Output 1 is ready to be connected to consumer line level inputs (-10 dbV no 4dB)
  • Output 2 has both LINE LEVEL and UNITY gain settings (recomm Unity , but then -> Output 2 Boost/Pad to review db Boost)
  • To set PEDAL1 Global Volume: SETUP: MIDI/Remote: Other. + select Output 2 + Select “PEDAL 1 (EXP/SW TIP)”
  • SETUP: Global: Config: Power Amp Modeling set to “ON”
  • SETUP: I/O: Audio and set Mode for the desired output to “COPY L->R”. (Decide)
  • the FM3 factory presets may be updated by Fractal Audio
  • SCENE REVERT OFF - MIDI/Remote menu under SETUP. 2. NAV to SCENE REVERT and set it “ON” or “OFF” as desired (OFF is desired)

REMINDER & Advices:
  • When placed in series, time-based effects like delay and reverb are usually best with their Bypass Mode set to “MUTE FX IN”
  • Scenes cannot change block parameters, but Scene Controllers can. Four different knobs can be used with modifiers to change the value of desired parameters. See the tutorial on p. 70 for more on this
  • If you are using Drive in the Preamp section of the Cab, adjust that block instead of the amp. (Drive on CAB???)
  • When any compressor, gate, or ducking effect is positioned after the amp, it’s necessary to adjust the level of that particular block (or follows it) instead of the amp
  • While you can’t copy channels across blocks or presets on the FM3 itself, you can do this in FM3- Edit. You can also save the settings for any channel to the Block Library on your computer for instant recall whenever you need them

BEST PRACTICES to EVALUATE
  • A good practice for professional environments is to set any un-used scenes to whatever settings would cause the least trouble if they were recalled accidentally
  • The Scene Controller system provides a way for individual parameters or groups of parameters to have different values in different scenes.
  • CHANNELS & MODIFIERS any modifiers are shared across all Channels of a block. This is a great avoiding the need to apply the same modifier multiple times as you change channels.
  • Each scene has its own settings for four Scene Controllers
  • Scenes interact with special footswitch functions called Control Switches
  • The Setlists/Songs feature allows you to create structured lists of presets and scenes to load in a specific order when you play live ”Setlists & Songs” on p. 126
  • WAH: (I personally need to evaluate best setup (personally not a Wah experienced user, so I am wondering to automate)
    • ENVELOPE FOLLOWER
    • LFO setup?
    • Sequencer

Enjoy!
 
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