noobs pops and clicks

[bigboysounds]

hey all,

relatively new user to FM9 here coming over from helix which i was super happy with.

one of the things that convinced me to make the switch was having 4 channels per block.
i generally play praise and worship music and delays are obviously a huge part of the sound. with helix i just had 3 different delay "blocks" set up and use the snapshots to turn different ones on and off for each part of a song. in the fm9 i do this by just having scenes call up various overdrives and delays. so i could go from clean/massive delay to overdrive/subtle delay and other permutations just with 1 drive and 1 delay block. however i keep getting clicks and pops (that delay) when doing this.

been working around it by adding in a second delay block and just using scenes to bypass or activate one to the other.

not a real great workflow as i build presets for each song and have a base preset that i work off of and use scenes to move from one part of the song to another and i generally don't have a lot of down time to learn songs and build set lists.

just wondering if i might be doing something wrong?

thank you!

 

[sprint]

Sounds like you might be hitting cpu limits which would result in clicks / pops (generally, keep cpu @ or below 80% in any given preset config). Some delay types are more cpu intensive than others, so if you switch channels to one of those from a less cpu intensive delay type, you'll get a cpu bump - one delay aspect that particularly impacts cpu is the "compander" feature (see "more tab"), which, if turned on, will result in a cpu bump, compared to off, from what I see on my Ax3 (about 1/3 of the stock delay block types have compander turned on by default)..

 

[Hopper_]

disabling input gate also saves cpu. I took that off all my presets.

 

[sprint]

disabling input gate also saves cpu. I took that off all my presets.

+1 - lots of ways to save cpu with minimal impact and not having to remove fx:

• turn off gates as you mention.
• reduce cab IR length
• reduce reverb quality.
• remove not needed shunts.
• turn off graphic eq sections within blocks if not used (ie Drive, Wah, Amp).
• turn off global eqs if not used.
• if mixing several cabs on board, consider purchasing IRs and pre-mixing in cablab.
• use amp block dynamics instead of separate compressor blocks if possible.
• some drives / delays are more cpu-miserly than others - if all else equal, choose the cheaper one.

 

[Lolo-G]

+1 - lots of ways to save cpu with minimal impact and not having to remove fx:

• turn off gates as you mention.
• reduce cab IR length
• reduce reverb quality.
• remove not needed shunts.
• turn off graphic eq sections within blocks if not used (ie Drive, Wah, Amp).
• turn off global eqs if not used.
• if mixing several cabs on board, consider purchasing IRs and pre-mixing in cablab.
• use amp block dynamics instead of separate compressor blocks if possible.
• some drives / delays are more cpu-miserly than others - if all else equal, choose the cheaper one.

I have just completed the sprint response (left-handed solidarity!)
-On the FM9 the quality of the reverb has no effect on the CPU load
-If you need a compressor, the “pedal” and “optical” models are less CPU intensive
I use the optical compressor which I find more pleasant.
Using the Preamp booster as a drive pedal can be a solution to save CPU and avoid adding a DRIVE block

 

[sprint]

On the FM9 the quality of the reverb has no effect on the CPU load

yes - well kindv - unlike Ax3, on FM9 reverb runs on a separate processor whose running status is not viewable by the user. So there is cpu savings with lower reverb quality, but on FM9 it's just not observable in the cpu status readout, and, since Fractal manages the 2nd cpu to not max out, processes that run there are kinda like .. free! yaaaay!

 

[guitarplayer1969]

hey all,

relatively new user to FM9 here coming over from helix which i was super happy with.

one of the things that convinced me to make the switch was having 4 channels per block.
i generally play praise and worship music and delays are obviously a huge part of the sound. with helix i just had 3 different delay "blocks" set up and use the snapshots to turn different ones on and off for each part of a song. in the fm9 i do this by just having scenes call up various overdrives and delays. so i could go from clean/massive delay to overdrive/subtle delay and other permutations just with 1 drive and 1 delay block. however i keep getting clicks and pops (that delay) when doing this.

been working around it by adding in a second delay block and just using scenes to bypass or activate one to the other.

not a real great workflow as i build presets for each song and have a base preset that i work off of and use scenes to move from one part of the song to another and i generally don't have a lot of down time to learn songs and build set lists.

just wondering if i might be doing something wrong?

thank you!

I play P&W as well, and just moved from the Helix after using live for over 7 years. I use the FM9 the same exact way you described. I have a base patch with scenes set up for tones - Clean, Crunch, Drive, P&W Clean and P&W Drive(These are just dual delays), Ambient, PAD. I just set delay type and tempo for the different songs, not really changing much else.

The FM9 is a different approach than the Helix but once you understand it, you will see it is way more powerful, especially with the Channels feature. I run Dual amps and cabs in stereo, 2 drive blocks, 2 reverbs (1 being Plex Delay block sometimes as it has the Plex Verb sound in it), and 2 Delays

The issue we have with using a Kitchen sink preset is we have alot of gain stages, and Reverb and Delay, so we push the limits of the CPU. It is true the Delay and reverbs use a differnt CPU, but if you are using the Plex Delay block, which is the big ambient one, that uses the Core CPU. You have to keep your CPU at 80% or under or you will see issues and sluggish scene changes. You might have to remove some blocks like Chorus, Tremelo, etc and only use when needed, but they have a block save feature, similar to favorites on the Helix that you can drop in when needed.

We also have a FB group for Fractal Worship users.

Start with downloadign the free presets for Worship Tutorials, and Tone Factor. They each have their own layouts as well, but ditch those and learn about layouts and create your own that works for you, as those layouts just make a mess of your FM9 IMO.. That is the first thing I did when getting my FM9 was to learn all about layouts. Took a few days but after that saw the power of the FM9 over the Helix, even if not as easy to use.

The only thing I dont like is the FM9 Audio driver for practicing with audio backing tracks, so I dont use it anymore. Nothing but issues compared to all my other USB gear, and I know alot about Windows. Got sick of reinstalling it multiple times a week to get it to keep working, so now just play the FM9 and PC backing tracks all through a USB mixer and other driver, problem solved.

 

[unix-guy]

yes - well kindv - unlike Ax3, on FM9 reverb runs on the 2nd processor whose running status is not viewable by the user. So there is cpu savings with lower reverb quality, but on FM9 it's just not observable in the cpu status readout, and, since Fractal manages the 2nd cpu to not max out, processes that run there are kinda like .. free! yaaaay!

It's a separate core, of which there are 4... There are 2 DSP chips, each with 2 cores.

 

[sprint]

It's a separate core, of which there are 4... There are 2 D chips, each with 2 cores.

I changed "the 2nd" to "a separate" in my post, but does that nuance somehow change the jist of what I stated? (are reverb / delay cpu stats viewable on FM9? and not maxoutable? - maybe, can't seem to find a definitive reference)

 

[Chromatizm]

clicks and pops (that delay) when doing this

just wondering if i might be doing something wrong?

If you could share the preset, the solution would be found very quickly by the community, but I personally had clicks and pops in three cases:
1. Clicks - Pitch follower on Input Trim. With FM3 there is often not enough CPU to process that
2. Pops - significant volume difference between channels
3. Loud Pops - switching between amp channels with and without boost engaged

 

[unix-guy]

I changed "the 2nd" to "a separate" in my post, but does that nuance somehow change the jist of what I stated? (are reverb / delay cpu stats viewable on FM9? and not maxoutable? - maybe, can't seem to find a definitive reference)

No, your point is still mostly valid... I believe Matt or someone for did say it was possible to run 2 Reverb blocks in such a way that the core might be overloaded, but I've never encountered anyone saying they experienced that.

But I wanted to clarify for anyone that cares.

2 DSP chips, 4 total cores:

• 1 for Reverbs
• 1 for (normal) Delays
• 1 for Amp modeling
• 1 for everything else

The reported CPU is (as far as I'm aware) showing only the last one.

Reverb, Delay and Amp can pretty much be considered "free" regarding the CPU reported.

 

[sprint]

No, your point is still mostly valid... I believe Matt or someone for did say it was possible to run 2 Reverb blocks in such a way that the core might be overloaded, but I've never encountered anyone saying they experienced that.

But I wanted to clarify for anyone that cares.

2 DSP chips, 4 total cores:

• 1 for Reverbs
• 1 for (normal) Delays
• 1 for Amp modeling
• 1 for everything else

The reported CPU is (as far as I'm aware) showing only the last one.

Reverb, Delay and Amp can pretty much be considered "free" regarding the CPU reported.

Ah - ok, I didn't realize Delays were also not part of the shared pool on FM9, so delays free also - cool!

 

[Lolo-G]

No, your point is still mostly valid... I believe Matt or someone for did say it was possible to run 2 Reverb blocks in such a way that the core might be overloaded, but I've never encountered anyone saying they experienced that.

But I wanted to clarify for anyone that cares.

2 DSP chips, 4 total cores:

• 1 for Reverbs
• 1 for (normal) Delays
• 1 for Amp modeling
• 1 for everything else

The reported CPU is (as far as I'm aware) showing only the last one.

Reverb, Delay and Amp can pretty much be considered "free" regarding the CPU reported.

Thank you for this interesting clarification.

 

[guitarplayer1969]

Ah - ok, I didn't realize Delays were also not part of the shared pool on FM9, so delays free also - cool!

The one exception is the Plex Delay block, which has Delays, Reverbs, and Shimmers in it as choices all under that Block. As a P&W player, its my favorite block on the FM9 as The Plex Verb is instant "P&W Reverb" but it does come at a cost, sometimes over 10% added CPU from what I have seen. the Pitch block is the other killer so using the POG effect we love in P&W can add alot of load.

Keep in mind also that your CPU load changes based on what channel of a block is active, even if the Block itself is bypassed, so you should consider that when setting up your scenes, changing the channel to a lower CPU type when not using it and the block is bypassed.

 

[bigboysounds]

Whoa..

Thanks for all the great responses all!

Will give it a go later tonight and update in time.

 

[Lolo-G]

Since the 2 reverb blocks have a dedicated core. Why keep this quality option? I don't see any musical benefit in putting the reverb in economy mode. Does the FX 3 axis also have this quality choice option?

 

[unix-guy]

Since the 2 reverb blocks have a dedicated core. Why keep this quality option? I don't see any musical benefit in putting the reverb in economy mode. Does the FX 3 axis also have this quality choice option?

All three current generation devices have quality options.

One reason might be the you want your presets to be exactly the same between your FM9 and your Axe Fx III or FM3, neither of which have a dedicated core for Reverb...

 

[Admin M@]

Since the 2 reverb blocks have a dedicated core. Why keep this quality option?

Not related to the discussion of DELAYS, but I'll comment. The reverb evolved with better quality and new features, but these use more CPU. Rather than leave those new sounds and features out of the FM9, we included them with the option to lower the quality if you think you're pushing things too far. (Before you ask: a 2nd CPU meter will NOT be added.)