How do I get closer to my real SLO?

axes

axes

Experienced
I've been lucky enough to snag up a technically new SLO-100 which is one of my all-time dream amps. I could never really bond with the SLO models in any gear but the real one loaded with the Fractal LB-2 with my fav IRs sounds absolutely glorious.
I've tried matching the Axe model to it to no real avail. I went as deep as it made sense to me, not matching with my eyes but my ears and changing the speaker impedance curve to the LB-2's UK curve but I'm still not close enough.
The real amp has a kind of roughness that I simply don't get with the Axe model. The Axe model sounds like the "bowtie elegant kid" version of my real amp. It's just smoother, more rounded, less visceral and girthy. It's almost as if the real amp would always want to fall apart and while it doesn't it gets almost all the way there while the Axe model has a similar tone and distortion texture but always stays cool and calculated. The model also sounds considerably tighter which could also contribute to my percepted difference.
Is there a parameter (or are there multiple parameters) in the Axe that I could tweak and it would get me closer to this kind of "explosive" behavior?
Cheers :)
 
My name is mud said:
Hi, some Audio ?
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I'll be sure to record and post something when I have the time.
Budda said:
At first glance it seems like you need to play with the master volume+level in the model to get the virtual power section doing whatever the real amp is doing.
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I have definitely played with the MV and level, not just trying to number match the setting. Unfortunately it still stays way too distinguished compared to the brutal animal that the real head is.
 
Set up the AXE 3 in 4cm with you real SLO and real cabinet. Have one patch where you use the amp tone of the SLO and any pre and post effects that you desire. Have another patch or scene that will allow the AXE 3 SLO Amp Sim to play through the SLO power section and your real cabinet. Sure, the SLO power section will color things slightly, but this will give you a quick reference between the real amp and the amp sim of the SLO keeping everything else apples to apples. I would do this when I owned numerous tube heads and being able to quickly A/B the real amp to the amp sim, I could dial things in real quickly to get the two to sound almost identical.

Going from the real amp and cabinet to the AXE 3 and amp sims is too much of a stretch. Try my method to get the base amp tones nearly matched then start experimenting with the Cabinet IR's later.

In the end I sold off all my high end tube amps and real 412 cabinets and now just run the AXE 3 and a pair of Atomic CLR's and couldn't be happier.
 
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Alainarose said:
Set up the AXE 3 in 4cm with you real SLO and real cabinet. Have one patch where you use the amp tone of the SLO and any pre and post effects that you desire. Have another patch or scene that will allow the AXE 3 SLO Amp Sim to play through the SLO power section and your real cabinet. Sure, the SLO power section will color things slightly, but this will give you a quick reference between the real amp and the amp sim of the SLO keeping everything else apples to apples. I would do this when I owned numerous tube heads and being able to quickly A/B the real amp to the amp sim, I could dial things in real quickly to get the two to sound almost identical.

Going from the real amp and cabinet to the AXE 3 and amp sims is too much of a stretch. Try my method to get the base amp tones nearly matched then start experimenting with the Cabinet IR's later.

In the end I sold off all my high end tube amps and real 412 cabinets and now just run the AXE 3 and a pair of Atomic CLR's and couldn't be happier.
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Thank you for your suggestion.
Maybe I was confusing in my original post but I'm not trying to go from real amp and cab to the Axe 3 - I'm using the SLO with Fractal's LB-2 reactive load into my audio interface and using the same IR for both the Axe and the real head and trying to match them this way. I did the same back then with my Mesa JP2C with immediately great results which eventually ended up being sold. So I'm not essentially a newbie to doing this, I'm just finding the SLO models sounding very different to my amp compared to the JP2C for example.
 
did you play around with speaker compliance / drive/compression/thump in the amp block ?

if you've zero'd those out to try and better match the real amp through IRs, disregard =) having the loadbox curve in the fractal is a huge advantage

if it's any help using a looper/split before the amp/loadbox and the fractal running into your audio interface can make dialing things in a lot easier, that's how i look to do it, as opposed to comparing recordings, tweaking /repeat
 
It may or may not help, but I have recently been using a melda plugin to eq match some real amps. I record the same DI guitar track through 1) the source with cab and mic/IR and 2) the fractal amp sim without an IR. I then create an IR that matches the fractal sim to the source, and load that IR into the fractal.

I have been able to match the Rockerverb sim to a real rockerverb 100 watt MK III that sounded way bigger. I did the same for an slo NAM capture, and it got super close, indistinguishable in blind audio tests I made. Again the capture sounded quite a bit "larger" than the sim before the match was made (whatever the reason). I have even used this technique to a match fractal sim to my settings of an amp sim (deliverance MKI) that was removed in later firmware. Jumped between firmwares to do this.

The built in sim needs to have some characteristics that are close enough, like gain levels, but this can go a long, long way.

Maybe you are familiar with such techniques. But if not, and you would like me to make such an IR for you, I can, if provided proper audio recordings and the IR you are using for the amp (if it's not commercial).
 
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Isn't it the case that the SLO circuit is NOT the same as it was 30 years ago?

As in the models we have are not exactly the same circuit as the SLO you have.
 
OrganicZed said:
You might want to try adjusting the transformer match parameter.
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Thanks, I'll be sure to try that!
Paul Bradshaw said:
did you play around with speaker compliance / drive/compression/thump in the amp block ?

if you've zero'd those out to try and better match the real amp through IRs, disregard =) having the loadbox curve in the fractal is a huge advantage

if it's any help using a looper/split before the amp/loadbox and the fractal running into your audio interface can make dialing things in a lot easier, that's how i look to do it, as opposed to comparing recordings, tweaking /repeat
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I actually haven't really tried that to be honest. I automatically do it when connecting the Axe to my Fryette LXII going to a real cab but never thought doing that in this scenario. Will give that a try, too! Thanks.
Dimi Guitar said:
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Maybe you are familiar with such techniques. But if not, and you would like me to make such an IR for you, I can, if provided proper audio recordings and the IR you are using for the amp (if it's not commercial).
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That sounds just great, thank you! I'll let you know when I have recordings of both of them.
cole lewis said:
Isn't it the case that the SLO circuit is NOT the same as it was 30 years ago?

As in the models we have are not exactly the same circuit as the SLO you have.
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I was thinking about this, too, but I'm not sure if the difference is really that huge?
 
cole lewis said:
Isn't it the case that the SLO circuit is NOT the same as it was 30 years ago?

As in the models we have are not exactly the same circuit as the SLO you have.
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Different parts have been used due to availability, but other than that I don't think there has been much changed other than DC heaters & the new FX loop. Of course the B.A.D.-era ones have a different transformer than Deyoung, but that's not a big deal.

I have an SLO and I've yet to play a modeler that feels or reacts like the real thing.
 
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I saw an interview with Soldano, where he said the old amp was very particular with which speaker to use and the new ones were not…
 
"Historically, one of the most popular SLO “mods” is the addition of a DEPTH control to the amplifier’s power section. The Depth control in now standard on the SLO-100"

"New custom transformers improve upon the famous originals"

From their website on the page for the SLO.

"The Axe model sounds like the "bowtie elegant kid" version of my real amp. It's just smoother, more rounded, less visceral and girthy. The model also sounds considerably tighter which could also contribute to my perceived difference."

The SLO models are not ones with the depth mod, or the "new custom transformers".
 
I own an early 2000s SLO and was able to get really close. I dont know what the reference amp was for the model, but maybe they’ve changed a bit? As soon as I pull up that model, it sounds like an SLO to me. Can you try maybe a different signal path altogether? I know you are doing apples to apples, but see how they both get on with a power amp and a cab, or some other way to load the amp down. Thru my Torpedo Reload, I got good results.
 
cole lewis said:
"Historically, one of the most popular SLO “mods” is the addition of a DEPTH control to the amplifier’s power section. The Depth control in now standard on the SLO-100"

"New custom transformers improve upon the famous originals"

From their website on the page for the SLO.

"The Axe model sounds like the "bowtie elegant kid" version of my real amp. It's just smoother, more rounded, less visceral and girthy. The model also sounds considerably tighter which could also contribute to my perceived difference."

The SLO models are not ones with the depth mod, or the "new custom transformers".
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I don't think the Depth mod matters too much - it is simulated in the Axe model and if I turn both to zero I still don't get the same. I really hope the new custom transformers also don't matter too much, it would be pretty disappointing and I'm almost sure it's not the case.
Bruce Sokolovic said:
I own an early 2000s SLO and was able to get really close. I dont know what the reference amp was for the model, but maybe they’ve changed a bit? As soon as I pull up that model, it sounds like an SLO to me. Can you try maybe a different signal path altogether? I know you are doing apples to apples, but see how they both get on with a power amp and a cab, or some other way to load the amp down. Thru my Torpedo Reload, I got good results.
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Thank you. I'll try comparing them in different circumstances, too. I actually have three different loads (Fractal LB-2, Suhr RL, Fryette PS100). It's just that I think it should work this way as well. It certainly did work with my JP2C, I easily got 99% close.
 
axes said:
I don't think the Depth mod matters too much - it is simulated in the Axe model and if I turn both to zero I still don't get the same. I really hope the new custom transformers also don't matter too much, it would be pretty disappointing and I'm almost sure it's not the case.
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The depth mod is for playing at lower volumes. Mike Soldano doesn't care for it.
 
axes said:
I don't think the Depth mod matters too much - it is simulated in the Axe model and if I turn both to zero I still don't get the same. I really hope the new custom transformers also don't matter too much, it would be pretty disappointing and I'm almost sure it's not the case.

Thank you. I'll try comparing them in different circumstances, too. I actually have three different loads (Fractal LB-2, Suhr RL, Fryette PS100). It's just that I think it should work this way as well. It certainly did work with my JP2C, I easily got 99% close.
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See at least if you can match the amp to the model. I’ve found that a LOT easier than matching the model to the amp. There has to be a few settings you can get pretty close to.
 
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