Help with Citrus RV50 tone (Ultra vs 2 clips)

M

MadScientist

Member
I've had the Axe-FX 2 a little more than a week now and I am trying to get the same or better tones that I got out of my Ultra but haven't been very successful so far. After some experimenting I recorded a clip of the Ultra and the 2 reamping the same clip on the Citrus RV50 model and the Cali 412 on both units. I have a Rockerverb 50 tube amp and it’s always been my “go to” amp. The difference between these recordings is subtle but when switching between the two, the Axe-FX 2 sounds thinner and lacks the clarity of the Ultra. My first thought was that the presence sounds lower on the Axe-FX 2 clip but turning up the presence sounded harsher and doesn’t bring out the clarity of the Ultra clip (presence was set to 12 O’clock on both units which is 0.0 for the Ultra but 5.0 on the 2). I used the default amp and cab block settings wherever possible and 12 O’clock for the other basic settings. The Sag setting seemed to be the most significant different default setting between the two (2.01 default for the Ultra, 2.5 for the 2), but I couldn’t tell the difference between a Sag of 1.0 or 10.0 on the Axe-FX 2, maybe a bug? Any suggestions for getting the depth and clarity I had with the Ultra out of the Axe-FX 2 would be appreciated.



 

Attachments

  • Citrus Test Tone Axe-FX2.syx
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  • Citrus Test Tone Ultra.syx
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I use a standard - and also the RV model a lot. TBH though - I listened to both those takes without realising which was which, and thought the first one must the Ultra (from your description). i thought it was much thicker and my valve like. The 2nd - which turned out to be the Ultra just sounded so harsh a nd much less smooth by comparison. If I had to choose I wouldnt be using the Ultra version.

That said, I can see what you mean about clarity - but its not presence I dont think. it sounds like theres a thicker gain to in. Maybe back off the rpe-amp or power amp (or both) and raise the hi-cut or transformer HF if you want to get closer.
 
Agree with the above post. I've had a RKVB 50 as well. Keep the Master down and the Drive down. For clarity, turn the mids, treb and presence up to taste (I've got mine fairly high). I use the FET Boost to get the heavier tones and it works better (ie. clearer).

-rob
 
paulmapp8306 said:
I use a standard - and also the RV model a lot. TBH though - I listened to both those takes without realising which was which, and thought the first one must the Ultra (from your description). i thought it was much thicker and my valve like. The 2nd - which turned out to be the Ultra just sounded so harsh a nd much less smooth by comparison. If I had to choose I wouldnt be using the Ultra version.

That said, I can see what you mean about clarity - but its not presence I dont think. it sounds like theres a thicker gain to in. Maybe back off the rpe-amp or power amp (or both) and raise the hi-cut or transformer HF if you want to get closer.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the feedback, as I said the difference is subtle. When listening to them back to back or through my monitors (Behringers) it is hard to tell the difference. Listening to them by switching between the clips a few seconds at a time with my AKG headphones, the difference is much more noticeable with the Ultra sounding preferable. I had my girlfriend listen through the headphones as well, I figured her "untrained ear" wouldn't be able to tell the difference and maybe I'm just splitting hairs but she noticed the difference as well and described the axe-fx 2 clip as sounding "farther away" although I normalized the level to be the same and said "it was harder to hear the chords through the distortion" which is right on with what I mentioned earlier about lacking the clarity of the ultra.
 
itsadoozy said:
Agree with the above post. I've had a RKVB 50 as well. Keep the Master down and the Drive down. For clarity, turn the mids, treb and presence up to taste (I've got mine fairly high). I use the FET Boost to get the heavier tones and it works better (ie. clearer).

-rob
Click to expand...

After a lot of dialing knobs, turning down the Master is the #1 thing that helped the most. I'm still having trouble getting the right balance between "not enough clarity" on one end and "too much fizz" on the other. At this point I'm pretty frustrated trying to get a tone as good as the default settings for the Ultra. I'll give it a rest for a bit and come back to it later. If you could share any good Citrus/RV50 presets for the Axe-FX 2 I'd appreciate it.
 
Souncloud makes me feel that the Axe II tone is more thick. I have to listen more carefully but the flac told me something else. It told me that the Axe II has more medium frequencies than the Ultra tone but both sounds have the same level of details and thickness.
 
I honestly can not hear a difference.

I know differences are much more apparent when you are playing. I know when I have recorded with different amps, I feel the difference big time. Yet at times when I go back it takes me a bit to figure which was which
 
mba said:
Result : the ultra has more low end. That makes me think the Axe II has more medium.
check the frequencies here :
ImageShack Album - 3 images
Click to expand...

Interesting. I've read others posts that suggested changing the low speaker resonance to get the Axe II models to sound like the Standard/Ultra models and that seems to be right in line with what is going on in the 0 to 100 HZ range. I think a lot of the difference I am hearing also lies in that 1 kHz to 2 kHz range which seems to be the only other significant difference (at least for that window of the recording covered by the FFT). Thanks for taking the time to do that analysis. It has been a while since I dug into something with an FFT, I'll have to try out that plug in.
 
With your Ultra, add this IR into a cab at the end of your chain and let me know if it sounds like your Axe II or close.
 

Attachments

  • Gen1ToGen2.syx
    8 KB · Views: 8
Sorry, been out of town for the Holidays. I tried to import it to the Axe-FX 2 and I get the error "Wrong asset type for current config." which sounds to me like it won't let me import Axe Ultra IRs to the Axe 2. If you could send me some instruction on how you made that IR with the Ultra I could try making it for the 2.
 
This is Gen1ToGen2 so it's for the Axe-Ultra/std. This one is for the Axe II. It's of course an approximation for the citrus but it should help. (i can make something better, it's just a test)
 

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  • Gen2ToGen1.syx
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