Headphone / FM9 Mix?

[bleujazz3]

Realizing that my headphones have different frequency response curves than my FRFRs, what is the best way to create a headphone mix without rebuilding every preset? How might one utilize EQ and volume effectively, and from what feature of the FM9?

It may be clear to you that it would be wise for me to "use my ears," though the headphone mix would preferably be global for one set of headphones and not for each preset. Would like to know if the headphones jack is best used and if there might be some volume or EQ adjustments from the front panel that might help with this.

For those who have addressed this issue, please chime in. Your comments are welcome.

 

[Vio]

https://github.com/jaakkopasanen/AutoEq/tree/master/results

 

[TSJMajesty]

You can Google an EQ correction curve for your headphones, set the Global EQ1 to that curve, set OUT 2 to "COPY OUT 1", then plug your monitors into output 2.

 

[bleujazz3]

https://github.com/jaakkopasanen/AutoEq/tree/master/results

You can Google an EQ correction curve for your headphones, set the Global EQ1 to that curve, set OUT 2 to "COPY OUT 1", then plug your monitors into output 2.

Yup. Had checked the search function and up popped @Greg Ferguson's post regards this. My 2 sets of headphones were listed, and since about 10:15 PM this evening, I've researched the wiki papers on the FM9, and checked Greg's link from a couple years ago.

Pulled up a lot of info like the Fletcher-Munson Curve Explained, several useful images for routing USB I/O's, among other things. Boy, do I look dumb now. There's a lot of stuff I didn't know about that you guys sometimes speak about, and it would be well-worth my FM9 education to absorb and meditate what was copied for my personal files.

IIRC, Headphones OUT is mirrored in Output 1. It would be necessary to route my FRFRs through Output 2 and set them with their own global PEQ rather than a headphone mix in Output 1. I think...?

 

[Greg Ferguson]

IIRC, Headphones OUT is mirrored in Output 1.

It’s vice-versa but who’s counting.

It would be necessary to route my FRFRs through Output 2 and set them with their own global PEQ rather than a headphone mix in Output 1. I think...?

I basically follow p. 32 in the manual except I don’t copy Out 1 to Out 2. I split the layout and feed one path to Out 2 -> Out 3, and have a GEQ-based solo block in front of only Out 1. It’s an experiment and might get changed in a week for whatever reason strikes me.

 

[Old_Soul]

The approach talked about to flatten your headphones may only be part of the solution. You had stated that your phones sounded different than your FRFR. Your FRFRs may not be as flat as you think either. So if the goal is to get them sounding the same then you may need a discerning ear and make some fine tuned adjustments to the EQ (one PEQ) settings you find available for your headphones.

 

[Randall Smith]

Realizing that my headphones have different frequency response curves than my FRFRs, what is the best way to create a headphone mix without rebuilding every preset? How might one utilize EQ and volume effectively, and from what feature of the FM9?

It may be clear to you that it would be wise for me to "use my ears," though the headphone mix would preferably be global for one set of headphones and not for each preset. Would like to know if the headphones jack is best used and if there might be some volume or EQ adjustments from the front panel that might help with this.

For those who have addressed this issue, please chime in. Your comments are welcome.

Mini dsp makes a head phone preamp with a 10 babe programmable eq. You can measure the response of your head phones and correct them.

 

[bleujazz3]

It’s vice-versa but who’s counting.

I basically follow p. 32 in the manual except I don’t copy Out 1 to Out 2. I split the layout and feed one path to Out 2 -> Out 3, and have a GEQ-based solo block in front of only Out 1. It’s an experiment and might get changed in a week for whatever reason strikes me.

Thanks. My decision was to not copy Output 1 to 2, and set Output 1 as my headphones mix, per both yours and @Vio's previous posts here and elsewhere. Output 2 will be my main output for my FRFRs.

The approach talked about to flatten your headphones may only be part of the solution. You had stated that your phones sounded different than your FRFR. Your FRFRs may not be as flat as you think either. So if the goal is to get them sounding the same then you may need a discerning ear and make some fine tuned adjustments to the EQ (one PEQ) settings you find available for your headphones.

My FRFRs are lowly HeadRush FRFR108s that have received EQ/gain adjusts with Output 2's global PEQ.

Within Wiki are also some suggestions as to how to improve a headphone mix with the FM9's amp & cab blocks, and also possibly utilizing either a gain enhancer and additional parameters for each preset. (I'll check my research and post my findings.)

That might require my copying/saving each of my 20 presets for my headphones, but it's a small price to pay if one prefers to practice after 9 PM and not disturb the neighbors. Copying each preset is not the issue; hoping the preset will translate to a new user slot might be...

 

[bleujazz3]

FM9 HEADPHONE MIX TIPS

• Switch off the FRFR and studio monitors.
• Connect the studio monitors to another output and send the Output 1 signal to that output in the I/O menu
• Use a line level attenuator to turn down the studio monitor’s level without affecting the headphones level.
• Headphones are always hard-wired to the FM9’s Output 1.
• Use FullRes IRs in the Cab block
• Use a Far-Field Impulse Response (IR)
• Increase Proximity in the Cab block
• Increase Room Level in the Cab block
• Select the Ambiance type in the Reverb block
• Always use a stereo output signal
• Add the Enhancer block to presets, or Add a Micro-Delay / Distance in the Cab block
• Increase De-Phase / Smoothing in the Cab block
• Use Gain Enhancer in the Amp block

CURTAILING EXTENDED FREQUENCIES & FLETCHER-MUNSON

Above, we've concluded that the FRFR sound has an extended frequency range, which often is undesirable for a guitar sound, and can suffer from the Fletcher-Munson curve when not dialed in correctly.

The solution to these issues is really simple: don't dial in too much top and bottom end. And always dial in your live guitar tones at gig levels (90dB and higher). Do NOT expect excellent "bedroom" or headphones tones to translate well to a rehearsal room or stage, because sound changes as the volume changes. What sounds dull at low volume, may sound fantastic at high volume. And remember that the guitar is a "mid" instrument, so focus on the midrange.

So how do you tweak the sound for FRFR? Here are some guidelines and options:

• Use the Low Cut and High Cut parameters in the Cab block to block undesirable top and bottom end. Common values are cutting lows (high-pass) between 120-150 Hz and cutting highs (low-pass) between 5-10 kHz. This may seem to make your guitar sound bad or dull by itself, but it will improve its sound within the entire mix
• Put a PEQ at the end of the grid, or the Global EQ, and block the lower and higher frequencies
• Adjust Depth/Bass and Treble/Presence in the Amp block
• Boost the Mids. For example: put a PEQ at the end of the grid, set a band (use Peaking when using the first or last band) to 770 Hz, Q at 0.35, Gain between 2 and 4 dB. Or bump the middle slider of a 5-band Passive GEQ
• Use the Cut switch in the Amp block
• Add the Factory 1 - 1x4 Pig 57 IR to add body to the sound

 

[bleujazz3]

It’s vice-versa but who’s counting.

I basically follow p. 32 in the manual except I don’t copy Out 1 to Out 2. I split the layout and feed one path to Out 2 -> Out 3, and have a GEQ-based solo block in front of only Out 1. It’s an experiment and might get changed in a week for whatever reason strikes me.

Thanks. Page 32 is how my rig is currently set up, without the Output 1 to 2 copying.

Copying Output 1 to 3 would produce a copy of Input 1 in Output 3, a dry guitar signal, for use with a DAW or use with an external amp. Not sure how you could feed a path from Output 2 to 3. If perhaps you'd like to describe, please do.

My feeling is that Output 3 might not be required for my rig, just 1 & 2, plus the headphones...