VIDEO: HAAS Delay and how to use it

[Danny Danzi]

I'm assuming in that example you are placing chorus block in serial before the delay/split happens. Correct?

Yeah it's in front but there are times where I use it behind the delay too. It all depends if you want to Haas your chorus or chorus your Haas.

 

[Danny Danzi]

Cool stuff! Thanks! Have you tried second/different amp on another path? Even same amp, slightly different EQ or IR, takes it up a notch. Since I have been messing with this I have gone off the deep end. Different amps and cabs on each side. Different delays and verbs. Different wahs, phasers, chorus etc. The secret sauce is different "guitar" on each side. JTV variax modeled les paul say left and magnetic p rails set to p90, right side. The different attacks of the pickups, the different delays, reverbs etc, just all take it to new level. Makes tweaking a royal PIA to get right. Still can't get a great rock sound but digging my reggae patches . . . . .

Yeah I do that stuff as well but mostly in post processing. All the stuff you mentioned really brings things to life when you record independent tracks and apply some of this in a multi-layering situation.

You won't get the same effect in your axe fx in a single track/performance guitar. The reason being, when you track independently, the human timing inconsistencies create stereo.

Add in different eq, amps, different guitar, effects etc playing the parts two times with different processing and you'll be blown away. Add 4-6 guitars of this nature and you create a layering effect that will knock your socks off.

 

[Danny Danzi]

Danny...

I've only been playing for 3-4 years and I've stumbled into the AxeFx world versus "traditional amps/cabs/effects". My excuse to the wife was that the AxeFx would let me own everything at once and experiment forever while I learned and discovered. The AxeFx is an amazing piece of gear but, frankly, its the support from FAS and this awesome community that never cease to amaze me.

This is a very cool video to be sure and I greatly appreciate it... more importantly, thanx for sharing! I read the forum at work when I get a few minutes and I always find myself wanting to rush home to spark up my rig!

Please keep being silly!

I didn't even realize this thread was still alive. You're welcome and good luck! I promise to continue to be silly.

 

[Danny Danzi]

Danny D, great video, I have a question for you that's a little of topic but I noticed that you have a tone match in your signal path coming strait off the comp block don't you need an amp block in front of it to make it work?.
Also maybe you could give a quick rundown of your amp and effect settings.
Thanks Tim.

Thanks Tim! I can't answer your question to be honest, but whatever that tone match block is doing there ( I use it for my clean sound) it sounds freakin' great! It gets that nice glassy almost piezo type sound when I kick in my active pups.

So if it's not hooked up right, that's fine by me. Lol! I should post up a clip of it. It's a really cool clean sound considering it's in a preset created for an extremely dirty tone.

 

[Danny Danzi]

Is the HAAS effect similar to what my Boss CE-5 Chorus is doing? When it's used in stereo it gives a dramatic 3D effect. I've never been able to reproduce this effect in my G Major 2. I'm not even sure what it's doing, but it's way more than just a chorus.

I believe there is some sort of delay built I to the CE-5 if I'm not mistaken....and it has the chorus effect plus a fast delay on the sides. I have one of those here that I haven't used in a long time. I'll have to fire it up and revisit what it's doing.

It's probably similar, but not as strong as what the Haas delay is doing. I don't remember my CE-5 delaying the sound to the point of loosening it up to where it sounded like two guitars in one pass. The chorus and stuff that it does gives a cool stereo 3d thing, but it's not as extreme as the Haas from what I can remember.

I'll have to check it out again.

 

[Perdikament]

I was thinking, maybe adding a modifier to the delayed side to slightly vary the time to better emulate the human side of it & then if ya really wanted to get creative add a modifier to a pitch shifter block varying the pitch a few cents. Might possibly make it a little more realistic. As long as it doesn't cause any phasing issues it might be a cool effect.

 

[toasterdude]

Yeah I do that stuff as well but mostly in post processing. All the stuff you mentioned really brings things to life when you record independent tracks and apply some of this in a multi-layering situation.

You won't get the same effect in your axe fx in a single track/performance guitar. The reason being, when you track independently, the human timing inconsistencies create stereo.

Add in different eq, amps, different guitar, effects etc playing the parts two times with different processing and you'll be blown away. Add 4-6 guitars of this nature and you create a layering effect that will knock your socks off.

Of course nothing beats actual double, triple or quadruple tracking. Not possible live though. Using two somewhat different paths gets a bit closer, and then take it up a notch by using mags and models panned hard left and right with Variax. A modeled humbucker left and p90 mag right for example.

I am going to toy with the enhancer instead of delay as I rarely want it that loose and can use the delay for other stuff. Plus it may help when collapsed to mono.

 

[Danny Danzi]

I was thinking, maybe adding a modifier to the delayed side to slightly vary the time to better emulate the human side of it & then if ya really wanted to get creative add a modifier to a pitch shifter block varying the pitch a few cents. Might possibly make it a little more realistic. As long as it doesn't cause any phasing issues it might be a cool effect.

Are you really gonna sit there and rock back and forth on a pedal to loosen and tighten the delay? Lol! I actually did this and thought to myself.....this is nuts! Haha!

I don't really think it's worth the aggravation, to be honest. Any time you're too tied down to your pedal board means you have just taken the movement element out of your show. I'd rather move and be free over staying close to my board...but that's just me.

 

[Danny Danzi]

Of course nothing beats actual double, triple or quadruple tracking. Not possible live though. Using two somewhat different paths gets a bit closer, and then take it up a notch by using mags and models panned hard left and right with Variax. A modeled humbucker left and p90 mag right for example.

I am going to toy with the enhancer instead of delay as I rarely want it that loose and can use the delay for other stuff. Plus it may help when collapsed to mono.

It won't help when you collapse to mono. You'll get phasing and other horrible artifacts. Both the enhancer and a delay exhibit the same behavior mono in my experience.

 

[Danny Danzi]

I was thinking, maybe adding a modifier to the delayed side to slightly vary the time to better emulate the human side of it & then if ya really wanted to get creative add a modifier to a pitch shifter block varying the pitch a few cents. Might possibly make it a little more realistic. As long as it doesn't cause any phasing issues it might be a cool effect.

Wait....we have those auto modifiers that work on their own, don't we? I have t messed with those yet...that actually may be cool to mess with if it's possible.

 

[Perdikament]

Wait....we have those auto modifiers that work on their own, don't we? I have t messed with those yet...that actually may be cool to mess with if it's possible.

I did this morning, although I haven't had a chance to a/b it against non modified, it does work.
I tried it first with just a LFO but the consistent sweep wasn't natural. So I'm using it with an envelope which keeps it a bit more random but smooth so it's subtle but there. Another thing is I had to mess with the bottom parameters in the modifier to even out the slope so it wasn't so steep. And then as you were saying in the vid you can set your window of delay ms time from tight to loose. Although bigger millisecond gaps become a more noticeable effect or even an effect itself, I prefer subtlety.

I did the same with the Pitch Shifter but just using Negative values, (flat is more musical) I tried -.02 -> -.5.2 which was very subtle (with the same envelope attached)
And then tried -5.0 -> -10.0 & that almost seemed a tad too much for my taste, a little like a tight chorus effect.. So a little maybe goes a long way there.. Or maybe it needs to be side chained , I was only mixing that in 25% too Btw. Ymmv.

 

[GuttaLaser]

Great Trick Danny!
what about the verb? is a room kind? settings?

 

[Perdikament]

Are you really gonna sit there and rock back and forth on a pedal to loosen and tighten the delay? Lol! I actually did this and thought to myself.....this is nuts! Haha!

I don't really think it's worth the aggravation, to be honest. Any time you're too tied down to your pedal board means you have just taken the movement element out of your show. I'd rather move and be free over staying close to my board...but that's just me.

Omg, good lord no, that'd be a nightmare! People would also probably wonder wtf you were doing rocking away on the pedal for! Lmao... *Shhh, it's a secret* lmao.

Btw, if ya want the DD & PS Blocks with the Envelope Modifiers attached id be hap to send them to ya, so you can see how I have them set up, but I'm sure you'll be able to figure it all out.
It certainly doesn't take the place of separate tracks or even come close, but might add a little extra subtle neuance to the HAAS Effect.

 

[Perdikament]

Now that I've had more of a chance to mess around with the envelope settings tied to the delay, there's actually a really cool thing you can utilize by doing it this way.
Due to the fact that the envelope is tied to the guitar at its input level on the Axe Fx, rolling up & down on your guitars volume you can control how tight or how loose the HAAS feel is. Then how much variation you want within the envelopes input level can also be set/adjusted via the SCALE Setting on the modifier page.

So say when your guitars vol/vol pedal is rolled off a tad the delay time would fluctuate between 20-30ms or so then turning it up it would fluctuate between 50-60ms or so, or vice versa and whatever you set the lower & upper limits to and the scale of the envelope to.
There is a TON of customization available within the envelope parameters as to when and at what volume and how much effect (which in this case would be millisecond amount) change takes place to control to your personal taste.

 

[Danny Danzi]

Omg, good lord no, that'd be a nightmare! People would also probably wonder wtf you were doing rocking away on the pedal for! Lmao... *Shhh, it's a secret* lmao.

Btw, if ya want the DD & PS Blocks with the Envelope Modifiers attached id be hap to send them to ya, so you can see how I have them set up, but I'm sure you'll be able to figure it all out.
It certainly doesn't take the place of separate tracks or even come close, but might add a little extra subtle neuance to the HAAS Effect.

Lol that was great! Yeah after I posted that message it hit me that we have modifiers that can do this sort of thing, so I posted the other message right after. Was hoping you didn't see the one above with the rocking pedal lol!

You've really come up with some awesome things here.....well done man! The only problem I see with this is you must be in stereo or it will phase like mad and get that horrible doubling effect. Good for your stereo stuff but even live.....if there isn't a stereo PA, it will sound phased even if you double mic your stereo rig. Might not be too bad though, but in my experience it always has been. Cool to try though, thanks for sharing!

 

[Perdikament]

Lol that was great! Yeah after I posted that message it hit me that we have modifiers that can do this sort of thing, so I posted the other message right after. Was hoping you didn't see the one above with the rocking pedal lol!

You've really come up with some awesome things here.....well done man! The only problem I see with this is you must be in stereo or it will phase like mad and get that horrible doubling effect. Good for your stereo stuff but even live.....if there isn't a stereo PA, it will sound phased even if you double mic your stereo rig. Might not be too bad though, but in my experience it always has been. Cool to try though, thanks for sharing!

Yes, true regarding a mono rig. I've been running stereo / direct for over 10 years now so I tend to forget to consider all possible circumstances.
Either way, it's a cool & easy way to add some extra neuance and control on the fly options to the HAAS Delay Effect. I definitely think the Envelope is the way to go as it gives the most control with what would tend to be the most human variances because it goes by input volume dynamics and not a preset sweep such as a sine wave that you'd get with a LFO. So with the envelope it will change along with varying pick attack and along with note decay etc, which will always be changing naturally as we play.
So maybe the next step would be to run a two amp two cab set up with different amps & cabs and run the HAAS with the mod on one rig. That's probably about as close as we can get to real multi tracking tone.

 

[spx90]

Thanks Danny, really appreciated.

would be very nice, a place where talk of effects alone blocks.
divided by type
so many important information
not are lost in time

 

[clarky]

I've mentioned this word in two of my videos and always wanted to explain it a bit more in case people wondered about it. Someone actually asked me a few minutes ago to explain it as this video was rendering, so it's perfect timing! Some of you guys know about this little effect trick, but some may not...so here you go. More Danny silliness!

great video…
and btw… love the way you play..

 

[born2lift]

Lol that was great! Yeah after I posted that message it hit me that we have modifiers that can do this sort of thing, so I posted the other message right after. Was hoping you didn't see the one above with the rocking pedal lol!

You've really come up with some awesome things here.....well done man! The only problem I see with this is you must be in stereo or it will phase like mad and get that horrible doubling effect. Good for your stereo stuff but even live.....if there isn't a stereo PA, it will sound phased even if you double mic your stereo rig. Might not be too bad though, but in my experience it always has been. Cool to try though, thanks for sharing!

I tried your HASS effect but it just sounds like reverb. I have it set exactly like you do in the video. I'm wondering if it has to do with Quantum. As far as if you did your video before Quantum.

 

[Danny Danzi]

I tried your HASS effect but it just sounds like reverb. I have it set exactly like you do in the video. I'm wondering if it has to do with Quantum. As far as if you did your video before Quantum.

It has nothing to do with Quantum. A HAAS delay is just that...a delay. You're definitely doing something wrong.