Tweeter squeal ruined the rehearsal last night!

Daribo said:
Karl - that's very kind of you. There is one in this thread - scene 3 and 4 are the obvious culprits (4 has an extra drive engaged and was all but unusable at the rehearsal, so I stayed on 3, but was still an issue).
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One thing I'm seeing with that patch right away is that your bypass states for the second drive, amp, and cab in that parallel path are set to "Thru". You're essentially doubling up on dry guitar signal when they are bypassed, and it's uncolored/unattenuated. That might be part of your problem if your pickups are trebly to start with. And you have some weird cross routing going on. You've always got some dry signal bypassing the amps and drives and going to the output. That may cause your problem right there.

I'll give this a try at volume later today.
 
Karl Houseknecht said:
One thing I'm seeing with that patch right away is that your bypass states for the second drive, amp, and cab in that parallel path are set to "Thru". You're essentially doubling up on dry guitar signal when they are bypassed, and it's uncolored/unattenuated. That might be part of your problem if your pickups are trebly to start with. And you have some weird cross routing going on. You've always got some dry signal bypassing the amps and drives and going to the output. That may cause your problem right there.

I'll give this a try at volume later today.
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Thanks very much Karl - I'd appreciate that. I never really paid much attention to the bypass states of anything other than time-based effects, for the purposes of overspill. Maybe I need to brush up on my patch-building skills a little!

What should the bypass stated be set to for the purposes of a dual clean/dirty amp set-up?

Thanks again for taking the time to look into this :)
 
I tried out the patch as-is through a pair of CLRs, no problems here. I had it louder than I'd ever be on stage...which is to say, louder than loud. :) Used my Standard Strat with stock pickups and a Tele with an Area Hot T / Area T combo. Both sounded nice, and no squealing.
 
Gord said:
Been having same issues
Using single coils is more of a problem. Began to wonder if my Strat could take any gain at all!
I use Matrix FRFR CFR12s
Not playing metal but can be loudish moderate overdrive.
Can happen with any of my guitars, humbuckers also.

Doing the odd small gigs just off the backline has been an issue with feedback.
I have cured it by going output 1 to desk and FOH, and output 2 feeding the Matrix gear. Keep the monitors close and at a level that I enjoy the sound.
I assumed the issue was that I was just too close to loud speakers which was the case. FRFR is much more sensitive to this unpleasent type of feedback
Been interesting to hear that I'm not the only one with this problem.
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I think you hit it here. I play in exactly your configuration (FOH OUT1 + floor monitor L+R to OUT2). I crossed the problem one time during a gig. Guitar sound going up and getting extremely crispy and harsh without touching the Axe FX or the console and we never understood why until I read your post; I effectively had turned up a bit the sound of the (dBtechnologies) floor monitor. The guitar got more resonant in the higher part and sound through FOH became horrible. I use a HB guitar with SC positions and for the concerned song I effectively use the SC position.
Strange enough, after switching back to HB the sound remained quite harsh and loud for a while and I wonder if some remanent magnetic saturation effect could be in there. When keeping the monitor at a more moderate level : no problem.
 
Wedding went well and the band weren't as loud as rehearsal, which was great. Didn't really get any nasty feedback off of the Q12a all night, so maybe the minor adjustments and knocking off the really high and low frequencies on the master graphic did the job well.

I didn't go for adjusting the input impedance in the end as I felt it altered the tone too drastically for my ears.

Thank you all for your help, suggestions and what I found a very interesting thread!

Feel free to share your stories/ideas :)
 
Just a thought - you probably only need to knock out those high frequencies in the stage foldback. Leaving them in FOH should still be ok.
 
Rook said:
Just a thought - you probably only need to knock out those high frequencies in the stage foldback. Leaving them in FOH should still be ok.
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Hi Rook - that's exactly what I did - altered the global EQ for Out 2 to the Q12a.

Not sure if it was the minor tweaks to the patch, the global eq I set, the room, where I was standing or a combination of all that worked, but it did!

Will keep monitoring the situation at my regular gigs and see what happens. If I find anything useful that may help others, I'll definitely share as have many kind souls in this thread.
 
Daribo said:
Last night I played a rehearsal with a rock covers band I am depping for at the Weekend and they are LOUD.
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Quantify LOUD please?
If you are playing at volumes that make your sight blurry when facing the stage on a WEDDING, this band is clearly doing it wrong. Seriously, there are kids on weddings!

EDIT: Noticed your post about how it worked out on lower volumes. Good! The beauty about FRFR is that you are able to turn it down without sounding like crap. Make use of that. Turning it to 11 is so yesterday.
 
Zwiebelchen said:
Quantify LOUD please?
If you are playing at volumes that make your sight blurry when facing the stage on a WEDDING, this band is clearly doing it wrong. Seriously, there are kids on weddings!.
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some people really like Motorhead tribute bands at their weddings..
I know I did at mine...

and I say screw the kids.. if they want to see a silly lil' pop band with silly lil' skeakers.. they can fk off to someone else's wedding..
at my wedding I want big rockin bands with big fk off seakers..

sheesh.. kids of today..
 
Zwiebelchen said:
Quantify LOUD please?
If you are playing at volumes that make your sight blurry when facing the stage on a WEDDING, this band is clearly doing it wrong. Seriously, there are kids on weddings!

EDIT: Noticed your post about how it worked out on lower volumes. Good! The beauty about FRFR is that you are able to turn it down without sounding like crap. Make use of that. Turning it to 11 is so yesterday.
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You're preaching to the converted here. This wasn't my band, so I was in no position to start saying what they should do with their overall sound, I was just paid to do a job.

I play Weddings frequently with my band and we pride ourselves on having a nice punchy sound, but one that won't cause discomfort if you get within 10 feet of the speakers.

Never had a complaint yet.
 
clarky said:
some people really like Motorhead tribute bands at their weddings..
I know I did at mine...

and I say screw the kids.. if they want to see a silly lil' pop band with silly lil' skeakers.. they can fk off to someone else's wedding..
at my wedding I want big rockin bands with big fk off seakers..

sheesh.. kids of today..
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:shock


:numbness:

:lol
 
Zwiebelchen said:
Quantify LOUD please?
If you are playing at volumes that make your sight blurry when facing the stage on a WEDDING, this band is clearly doing it wrong. Seriously, there are kids on weddings!
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Our classic rock band played a wedding...once...last year. The bride and groom really like us, and we did our best to dissuade them from hiring us because we aren't a wedding band, but we thought we could keep the volume at a reasonable level. And for the most part, we did keep it down pretty well. Funny story, though, and this was pre-Axe-Fx.

I was running a Mark V rig with a 2x12 recto cab not facing the people. During a song break, little kid about 4 years old comes up to me, "Mistuh! Mistuh!". I bend over and ask him what he wants. "Could you torn you guitah down because when you pway, you're scaywing my wittle bruddah?" I just smiled and said, "Oh little buddy...NO." Seriously, keep your 2 year old at home when you know there's going to be loud music. But it's all the bride and groom's fault anyway. We warned them. :D

It probably would have gone better if I'd had the Axe and CLRs then, but the room was still awful.
 
I think Gord has the answer. If you need level like that, consider guitar speakers on stage through OUT2 into a power amp.
 
I had a similar issue cranking up powered CLRs to get over a very loud drummer. I read somewhere on this forum to insert a PEQ block at the front of the signal path and roll off the highs until the squealing stops (not too much or you muffle your highs). Primarily using a Les Paul with a Super Distortion humbucker through Friedman HBE model (with lots of gain). Works great!
 
Karl Houseknecht said:
What kind of volume did you dial your tones in at? If I had to guess, from what you've said, you dialed it in at a pretty low volume with your other band. Sound "thins out" with higher volume, etc. I play Teles and Strats with the Axe using FRFR and I don't have this issue. My presence and treble settings on some of the amps I use are generally very low. Presence sometimes even all the way off. Treble sometimes below 9:00. I would not characterize this as a problem that is unique to FRFR. More like, it's because you CAN dial in good tones at lower volumes with a modeler that you may forget to account for Fletcher-Munson.
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We all have different "sounds in our head" which is part of the reason I love the AXE, but the downside to this is that folks get into a habit of assuming that they know that there is a "right" answer is as far as tone is concerned. Which is obviously nuts, but we all are guilty. I am having the same tweeter squeal issue on small stages as the OP and not surprisingly I am getting folks telling me the canned answer that I'm too loud and I need to use less gain. I dial in essentially the same exact tone with the AXE that I do with my high gain tube amps--tweeter squeal is a very real issue esp when forced to stand close to your monitor. Cliff has confirmed this several times and yet when someone experiences it everyone (mostly folks who only play at home) jump in and start pontificating about volume and gain. Sure lowering those will help the issue, but what exactly do players who want volume and gain do LOL?

OP, I am seriously thinking about trying the Line 6 Stagesource monitor. It has some onboard EQ and feedback gates that really sound useful--esp for folks who play on different stages in different rooms. The only bad reviews I have read are all by people who have never tried one.
 
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