Showing up to gigs that expect you to use a backline with the AxeFx...

wildstar said:
Depending on the stage and venue, the sound crew might need you to connect to the FOH board via a big snake. And the inputs for those huge snakes are often XLR (mic-type of connector) only. So even if you had the kind of cable you point out, you might not be able to run it to the 1/4" line input on the board.

Or even if you could send signal with that cable in your scenario (in which the mic inputs can't handle line level), the board might not have any available 1/4" line inputs.

Or it's quite possible that even if you did patch into the snake at the stage with no trouble, the engineer might have a problem with you sending him line level signal to his end.

Or any number of possible SNAFUs!

Summing up this and my previous post, I guess my point is: due to the many variables and potential technical issues of live sound, you might need to connect your Axe to the house system via a DI box. Even if you think the sound guy just doesn't understand (and that's happened to me). No big deal, just pack your own DI and roll with it!
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So, if I run 2 XLR cables to this multicore http://www.thomann.de/gb/pro_snake_mts_164_s_multicore_30m.htm , what's the problem with connecting to mixer using a 1/4" line-in adapter, assuming the mixer doesn't have XLR line-in inputs ?
 
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Thank guys this thread is really informative. I have a question. Aside from the obvious (one needs power, one doesn't) what's the difference between the passive and active DI boxes? Does an active DI box mean you can use it for longer cable runs, does it sound better, etc?

I'd prefer to get a passive box if possible. That way I don't have to worry about batteries/power but does that mean I could get a drop in signal over long cable runs, or a loss in quality?
 
OK boys let make sure I full get what we are talking about here. All this talk about DIs ect is not about our ax or our tone but rather what the sound man need correct? So as I understand it our xlr outs are locked in to mic level and our 1/4 outs are locked into line level? The purpose of the DI is strickly to provide the sound guy with a line level signal via xlrs if that is what he needs that signal to be for his sound board? Do I have this all right
 
brokenvail said:
OK boys let make sure I full get what we are talking about here. All this talk about DIs ect is not about our ax or our tone but rather what the sound man need correct? So as I understand it our xlr outs are locked in to mic level and our 1/4 outs are locked into line level? The purpose of the DI is strickly to provide the sound guy with a line level signal via xlrs if that is what he needs that signal to be for his sound board? Do I have this all right
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Close. The XLR outputs are line level as well (+4dB). The DI gives the sound engineer a Mic level signal for FOH...that way the sound engineer can use a regular Mic Pre for your Axe. If the XLR outs were Mic level, there wouldn't be a need for the DI at all.
 
bkrumme said:
Close. The XLR outputs are line level as well (+4dB). The DI gives the sound engineer a Mic level signal for FOH...that way the sound engineer can use a regular Mic Pre for your Axe. If the XLR outs were Mic level, there wouldn't be a need for the DI at all.
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OK so both the xlr and 1/4 out puts are +4 and we only need a DI if the sound guy needs -10 from an xlr?

Make me wonder if I am using my k12 correctly. I go into it w/ a xlr and have it set to mic.
 
brokenvail said:
OK so both the xlr and 1/4 out puts are +4 and we only need a DI if the sound guy needs -10 from an xlr?

Make me wonder if I am using my k12 correctly. I go into it w/ a xlr and have it set to mic.
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-10dB is consumer line-level. A Mic level would be even lower typically. I would suggest switching your K12 to line input instead of Mic.
 
bkrumme said:
-10dB is consumer line-level. A Mic level would be even lower typically. I would suggest switching your K12 to line input instead of Mic.
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+1

Ch. A needs to be set to Line.

Much easier / foolproof: just use Channel B, it's always Line level.
 
Very interesting read here, useful to me at the moment.

Is there any reason I couldn't go from Output 1 of the Axe-FX to a mixing desk with an XLR -> 1/4" cable like this?: http://www.thomann.de/gb/cordial_ctm_10_fp_mikro_kabel.htm

And if so, would it absolutely have to be balanced? In other words, do you always have to stick to balanced/unbalanced cables for the various outputs of the Axe-FX?
 
BillE said:
Very interesting read here, useful to me at the moment.

Is there any reason I couldn't go from Output 1 of the Axe-FX to a mixing desk with an XLR -> 1/4" cable like this?: http://www.thomann.de/gb/cordial_ctm_10_fp_mikro_kabel.htm

And if so, would it absolutely have to be balanced? In other words, do you always have to stick to balanced/unbalanced cables for the various outputs of the Axe-FX?
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You could certainly use that to plug into a line-level jack on the mixing desk. The connection would *NOT* be balanced, though.
 
brokenvail said:
OK boys let make sure I full get what we are talking about here. All this talk about DIs ect is not about our ax or our tone but rather what the sound man need correct? So as I understand it our xlr outs are locked in to mic level and our 1/4 outs are locked into line level? The purpose of the DI is strickly to provide the sound guy with a line level signal via xlrs if that is what he needs that signal to be for his sound board? Do I have this all right
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The Axe-FX's XLR out are Line-out level. Pretty hot. Problem is that many cheaper and older mixing boards can't handle that kind of level into the XLR (mic) input.
So you can take the jack outputs (6dB lower level than the XLRs and unbalanced) and stick them into a DI that transforms it to balanced low impedance signal. Padswitches on the DI can lower the level even more to get it to where the mixing board can swallow it.

BillE said:
Very interesting read here, useful to me at the moment.

Is there any reason I couldn't go from Output 1 of the Axe-FX to a mixing desk with an XLR -> 1/4" cable like this?: http://www.thomann.de/gb/cordial_ctm_10_fp_mikro_kabel.htm

And if so, would it absolutely have to be balanced? In other words, do you always have to stick to balanced/unbalanced cables for the various outputs of the Axe-FX?
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That cable is indeed not balanced. Which might, under certain conditions, be more susceptible to noise. Balanced should have a three-pole Jack plug (Commonly referred to as stereo, although in this case it isn't stereo).
 
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Thanks for the replies.

Dutch said:
So you can take the jack outputs (6dB lower level than the XLRs and unbalanced) and stick them into a DI that transforms it to balanced low impedance signal.
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I'm about to get a DI box as it happens. Will any DI box do that (convert the signal from the Axe to balanced low impedance) or do I need to be careful about specs? I'm thinking about picking up a cheap one just for now, maybe one mentioned earlier in this thread: http://www.thomann.de/de/millenium_dip_passive_di_box.htm
Edit: Duh. I see that one has the words "BALANCED OUTPUT" emblazoned across it.

Is this in any way a false economy? Will a cheap DI box affect sound quality?
 
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Dutch said:
The Axe-FX's XLR out are Line-out level. Pretty hot. Problem is that many cheaper and older mixing boards can't handle that kind of level into the XLR (mic) input.
So you can take the jack outputs (6dB lower level than the XLRs and unbalanced) and stick them into a DI that transforms it to balanced low impedance signal. Padswitches on the DI can lower the level even more to get it to where the mixing board can swallow it.

That cable is indeed not balanced. Which might, under certain conditions, be more susceptible to noise. Balanced should have a three-pole Jack plug (Commonly referred to as stereo, although in this case it isn't stereo).
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Just to echo what Dutch said... that cable is NOT balanced. Not only that but it uses up your balanced outputs uselessly (since the connection won't be balanced) and probably costs more than a regular instrument cable (shielded, tip and sleeve, like a guitar cable) which would give you the same performance at lower cost *and* leave your XLR outputs available if needed. So I wouldn't recommend that cable. Just use instrument cables, out of either Output 1 unbalanced 1/4" or Output 2.
 
BillE said:
Thanks for the replies.



I'm about to get a DI box as it happens. Will any DI box do that (convert the signal from the Axe to balanced low impedance) or do I need to be careful about specs? I'm thinking about picking up a cheap one just for now, maybe one mentioned earlier in this thread: http://www.thomann.de/de/millenium_dip_passive_di_box.htm
Edit: Duh. I see that one has the words "BALANCED OUTPUT" emblazoned across it.

Is this in any way a false economy? Will a cheap DI box affect sound quality?
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Get a good one that will last you a lifetime and hold up to abuse. Not that a cheap one wouldn't sound good, but a good DI is worth its weight in gold. Not only for the Axe, but for any number of utilities. I use them for bass guitars live and in the studio, acoustic guitars and guitars with piezo systems, capturing a clean signal for re-amping, and just about anything that would require converting a Hi-Z signal to Low-Z.

I like the Radial ProDI and JDI. Whirlwind also makes a nice DI.
 
bkrumme said:
Get a good one that will last you a lifetime and hold up to abuse. Not that a cheap one wouldn't sound good, but a good DI is worth its weight in gold. Not only for the Axe, but for any number of utilities. I use them for bass guitars live and in the studio, acoustic guitars and guitars with piezo systems, capturing a clean signal for re-amping, and just about anything that would require converting a Hi-Z signal to Low-Z.

I like the Radial ProDI and JDI. Whirlwind also makes a nice DI.
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THIS.

Words of wisdom there. Buy well the first time, and never regret or need to buy again.

Well spoken.
 
bkrumme said:
Get a good one that will last you a lifetime and hold up to abuse.
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I see what you're saying.

I'm also about to start using IEMs for the first time. I'm planning to get a band mix sent from the board into input 2 of a Shure PSM200 (my Axe-FX will go into input 1). Would it be at all useful to have a DI with two channels in case I have to use a long cable to get a mix from the board? Like the Radial ProD2 for example?
 
BillE said:
I see what you're saying.

I'm also about to start using IEMs for the first time. I'm planning to get a band mix sent from the board into input 2 of a Shure PSM200 (my Axe-FX will go into input 1). Would it be at all useful to have a DI with two channels in case I have to use a long cable to get a mix from the board? Like the Radial ProD2 for example?
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Probably not for the IEM's. The PSM-200 accepts a line or mic signal and accepts a balanced connection so you shouldn't have a problem there. You *COULD* use a stereo/dual-channel DI to do dual-mono from your Axe to the mixer, though.
 
I recently started using a Radial DI box. I send Output 1 XLR to my K12 and output 2 to the Radial. Which then goes to FOH. For some reason I was having issues with the 1/4" outs into the 1/4" ins on my K12's. The DI box helps with long cable runs and has a pad switch just in-case.
 
bkrumme said:
Probably not for the IEM's.
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Would a typical band mix be sent to me from the board via something like an aux out with a 1/4" cable though? And might I have trouble with this signal if it has to travel some distance?

You'll have to bear with me here, I'm on a learning curve with this stuff :) First gig coming up with the Axe and IEMs in a couple of weeks and I want to cover all my bases, plus anything that might come up in future. In fact the place we're playing is small but I have no idea what they might be able to give me.
 
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