Wish Master Volume linked to Amp output Compensation

A

Aivoryuk

Inspired
Would like to see Master Volume linked to Amp Output so when turning the Master Volume up or down the Amp output is compensated.

This is becoming quite common in VST plugins (channel strips etc) where input and outputs are compensated so you can hear the change in tone and not be swayed by the change in volume.

Could be a toggle switch on the ideal page
 
unix-guy said:
Maybe this is humor?

If not, the question is about the volume change relative to the MV being linear or not...
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Yeah, an emoji would have helped. However I do think it would be possible to accomplish what the OP is saying even if the MV control is non-linear. I think FAS has solved way more difficult problems. Now is it a worthwhile one to tackle, I don't know. Could be a useful feature to some people I think.
 
Intoodeep1113 said:
Yeah, an emoji would have helped. However I do think it would be possible to accomplish what the OP is saying even if the MV control is non-linear. I think FAS has solved way more difficult problems. Now is it a worthwhile one to tackle, I don't know. Could be a useful feature to some people I think.
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Similar wishes have been asked before... I suspect it's far more complex to do than it is to say ;)
 
The master volume behaves the way it does because that’s how they act on real amps: as you turn it up the amp gets louder, until you reach the point where the power amp begins to distort, then the sound doesn’t get louder, it gets fatter. You are proposing that the master volume act completely different than they do in the real world.

It’s easy to set the amp’s master volume to make the power amp sound how it should, then simply adjust the level of the amp; we do it easily using the Preset Leveling tool as part of the workflow of prepping a preset.

FractalAudio said:
Master Volume:
The Master Volume (MV) controls how much signal level is sent to the power amp. Many vintage amps have no MV control and the power amp runs "wide open". Modern amps often get their distortion from the preamp and the Master Volume then allows the user to control the volume of the amp.

The Master Volume in the Axe-Fx II, as well as on real amps, is probably the singular most powerful control in the amp block. As the Master Volume is increased the virtual power amp begins to distort. The virtual power amp also begins to sag and all sorts of beautiful magic occurs. The tone becomes more focused, the dynamic response changes, the note attack is accentuated, etc.
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Setting the Master Volume is also useful reading. And…

 
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My understanding is that the OP is asking that the 2 knobs be linked, the amp MV and the level knob (assuming that is the output knob he refers to) so for example, as you dial the MV from 3 to 7, the Level knob would know to move from 5 to 4.2 to maintain the same volume in dB. Maybe more trouble than it's worth, sounds neat though, and may help new users have a simpler experience.
 
Intoodeep1113 said:
My understanding is that the OP is asking that the 2 knobs be linked, the amp MV and the level knob (assuming that is the output knob he refers to) so for example, as you dial the MV from 3 to 7, the Level knob would know to move from 5 to 4.2 to maintain the same volume in dB. Maybe more trouble than it's worth, sounds neat though, and may help new users have a simpler experience.
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See the video above, which, while being older and needing some translation between the older firmware and current firmware, shows how to do it ourselves.
 
Intoodeep1113 said:
My understanding is that the OP is asking that the 2 knobs be linked, the amp MV and the level knob (assuming that is the output knob he refers to) so for example, as you dial the MV from 3 to 7, the Level knob would know to move from 5 to 4.2 to maintain the same volume in dB. Maybe more trouble than it's worth, sounds neat though, and may help new users have a simpler experience.
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that's pretty much it - whilst I appreciate there is manual work around - I just thought it would be a cool feature to have.
 
+ 1 for this Wish.
To make this work it should be that each Master Volume and any Gain knob on non-Master Volume amps have a little button by them you can click that says: "Link to Block Level".
or
Just a button you can click on the Block Level that will keep a steady output. For instance: you click the "Steady" "Stay Here" or whatever you name it! Button and when you adjust the MV / Gain on NMV amps up or down the Block Level will compensate to stay at that same db level.

This would be a very useful feature and one that I think many users would not know they needed until they tried it out.
This would be a feature that would easily help the user find that sweet setting of an amp quickly and also helps out to get nice clean settings on NMV amps.
 
Cool wish over the lifespan of Fractal products, but the relationship of drive and master volume isn’t linear.
 
+1. I’d use this all the time if this feature were implemented.

I think some folks are overthinking this wish. I think it’s a good idea and could be implemented as follows:

ON THE AMP BLOCK: Just have a tick box in the amp block by the MV knob that, when checked, reduces the output volume as the MV is increased (whether it’s a linear relationship or not). Could be done with a behind the scenes meter or compressor to measure the actual volume difference.
-or-
Have a slider button that changes the default MV knob to an “output volume compensated master volume” knob.

ON THE OUTPUT BLOCK: choose whether the compensated MV knob is tied to the actual output knob or the scene volume. If the OVCMV knob isn’t in use in the Amp Block, then this option would be grayed out in the Output Block.

It is an interesting phenomenon how our perception of tone changes as the volume changes. It would be nice to not have to go back and forth between the Amp block and the Output block to adjust for the difference. I think the net result of the way it currently is is that many folks who haven’t owned the specific amp in question just ignore the MV knob since it’s near impossible to hear its impact on tone separated from its impact on volume, so we use all the other knobs as tone-shaping tools and the block’s output volume and the Output block to adjust for actual volume.

TLDR: In other words, the MV knob is wasted without this feature, IMO.
 
I think the result would be the level would be too loud or too quiet, meaning you’d have to adjust the level anyway. It’s what we already have.
 
chris said:
I think the result would be the level would be too loud or too quiet, meaning you’d have to adjust the level anyway. It’s what we already have.
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Well, this is why Fractal would design it so it would work correctly, and NOT behave as you describe, not some hack like me who has no idea what he’s doing :) If it works as you describe, then Fractal has not implemented the wish as described, they’d have merely created an unpredictable, useless link between two parameters lol.
 
Admin M@ said:
View attachment 112603
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Okay, okay, point taken - but that’s why you could use some sort of intelligent background process that compensates, no? I mean, sure it might take DSP, but perhaps it could be ephemeral - meaning, that while that process was in place - while I’m adjusting my MV for tone - the compressor and controller might be engaged and adjusting the output/scene volume, but then once it’s set, I uncheck the box and it goes back to a regular, non-linked MV knob. I don’t know. You guys are the geniuses, not me. I’m just the idea man :)
 
Ugly Bunny said:
It would be nice to not have to go back and forth between the Amp block and the Output block to adjust for the difference.
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There's no need to do that now. The Amp block has a Level control - that's what it's for ;)
Ugly Bunny said:
TLDR: In other words, the MV knob is wasted without this feature, IMO.
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Sorry, but I totally disagree with this opinion... Although you're entitled to have it.

Have you used real amps with a MV? They don't have this ability, either.
 
unix-guy said:
There's no need to do that now. The Amp block has a Level control - that's what it's for ;)

Sorry, but I totally disagree with this opinion... Although you're entitled to have it.

Have you used real amps with a MV? They don't have this ability, either.
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Real amp can't take a KT90 if EL84 designed. Can't change sag, voltage, input caps, breakup, compressions, transformer ratios... so what we are talking about? Fractal normalize the parameters when swapping tubes, if there was a normalization after master volume that put level in the ballpark, it could be useful. I wish it not to be linked to level, but some internal compensation.
 
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