Just pulled the trigger and an AxeFX 2 Ultra - Now some newbie questions/What to get?

G

Guitar-Zan

Member
Hey,

I'm really stoked right now. Just pulled the trigger on an Axe FX 2 Ultra. I have been mulling it over for awhile but didn't think I would be getting one this soon, maybe later this year. Looked at both the Axe FX 2 and the Kemper. Both seem awesome. Axe seemed better for what I wanted (building a sound from the ground up). I already have the Marshall AFD100 head and the Yngwie signature head and a Marshall 1960 BV Cab but want a lot of different sounds to go with. So anyways just checked this morning and the Ultra was in stock... I heard they aren't in stock often, so I bought one 5 minutes ago :)

I am a complete newb when it comes to anything sound with the guitar. I have been doing a lot of reading and it seems the majority of people on here like to run their Axe FX 2 through either a power amp and then a FRFR setup, or through a power amp and then a cab like the 1960bv I have.

I have decided I want to get an FRFR setup. I don't need super high end monitors right now, something decent that will be good for awhile. I have heard a lot of people like the Yamaha HS80's and was looking at those. I see that Yamaha replaced them with the HS8's and I can get a pair on ebay for around $600. So I guess I am just seeing if people can confirm that these will work good.

Now onto the power amp. I know the power amps job is to supply power/volume to the monitors or whatever speakers. The Yamaha HS8's are active speakers so they have their own power correct? How does this work then if I have a power amp?

Speaking about the power amp I have heard really good things about the Matrix power amps. I can get either the 800 or the 1000. Not sure which one to get. Also the 1000 has the 2U with the quite fans. Why is the 2U the same price as the 1U? I see it is larger to house the bigger fans, but I thought it would be more money...

Last newbie question. Are there any cables I should be buying, a specifically which ones? I am not interested in recording right now. I am a bedroom player so I just need to connect the axe to the wall, and then I guess to my power amp and from there to the monitors or my cab...

Sorry for the basic questions. I am going to read the Axe FX 2 manual now which I am sure will help but any info about some good starter speakers, etc is nice.

All the Best,

Cody
 
No need for a power amp if you are using powered monitors. That is what I have since I only play at home. Some people like to get a mixer and place that between the Axe ant the monitors in case you want to run other audio to the monitors.
 
Hey,

OK, another newb question. Why doesn't everyone just get active speakers so they don't have to buy a power amp?

Cody
 
Welcome to the club Guitar-Zan! I have a pair of HS80Ms that work great for dialing in presets and playing at studio/bedroom levels. I agree with kroubik that you don't need to get a power amp and FRFR monitors if you are just planning on using something like the HS80Ms for now. The great thing about this setup is you can always expand later as your needs arise. A lot of folks (myself included) use the Atomic CLR powered monitors for stage use, but I don't use them at home since the Yamahas do the job at lower volume levels. Of course there are better studio monitors out there, like the ones made by Adam, that will cost more.

As for making the connections, the Axe-Fx is pretty versatile, so you could use a couple of XLR mic cables or a pair of 1/4" guitar cables to hook things up. I know you said you are not interested in recording right now, but you may consider buying a USB audio interface to tie everything together. You can get a basic Alesis iO2 Express for $69 new and it would tie your computer, Axe-Fx unit and monitors together, which is great for playing along to MP3s or anything else for that matter, plus you could use it for recording too. It also serves as a MIDI interface for your computer. The M-Audio M-Track is essentially the same unit with different branding. Both interfaces come with a stripped down version of Cubase or Abelton recording software. These units are 24-bit/48 Khz, so while they have decent audio quality, there are better units out there. The Focusrite Scarlett 2i4 Audio interface is 24-bit/96 kHz and runs around $199. Many musicians seem to like these for a basic, higher quality interface.

Of course, you don't need any interface, but since you asked about connections, I thought I'd point out some options. Best of luck to you, and be sure to visit the forum and the Wiki for a lot useful information.
 
Guitar-Zan said:
Hey,

OK, another newb question. Why doesn't everyone just get active speakers so they don't have to buy a power amp?

Cody
Click to expand...

Some people like to cherry pick the power amp and cabs. For example, you could get a Carvin DCM1540L power amp and a pair of XiTone Passive 1x12 Wedges. To each his own.

Another reason for separate power amp and speakers is the flexibility to choose between a true FRFR rig and an amp and cabinet rig. Some people turn off the cabinet modeling in the Axe-Fx and use a power amp and their cabinet of choice, which has it's own distinctive tone. The down side to that is you miss out on the cabinet modeling in the Axe-Fx unit, but some people swear by the sound of a power amp going through a 4-12 cabinet.
 
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Hey,

Thanks for the replies, that makes sense. You would need a power amp to power the cabinet if you wanted to go that route. That's the thing though. I have heard people get a FRFR setup and go back to running axe fx 2 with a power amp and cab because they didn't like the FRFR. I already have the cab and it would be great to compare running through the monitors as well as the cab.

Another question: If you have active monitors like the HS80's that are active is there a switch on them that you can turn off the monitors power source and power them up through an external power amp like the Matrix? Would there even be a difference in tone with using something like the matrix to power speakers or using the speakers onboard power?

All the Best,

Cody
 
Wait a minute... is it an AxeFX 2... or is it an AxeFX Ultra?


There is no such thing as an AxeFX 2 Ultra... the Ultra was a generation 1 (i.e. AxeFX "1"). Just pointing it out so that you read the correct manual.
 
Guitar-Zan said:
Hey,

Thanks for the replies, that makes sense. You would need a power amp to power the cabinet if you wanted to go that route. That's the thing though. I have heard people get a FRFR setup and go back to running axe fx 2 with a power amp and cab because they didn't like the FRFR. I already have the cab and it would be great to compare running through the monitors as well as the cab.

Another question: If you have active monitors like the HS80's that are active is there a switch on them that you can turn off the monitors power source and power them up through an external power amp like the Matrix? Would there even be a difference in tone with using something like the matrix to power speakers or using the speakers onboard power?

All the Best,

Cody
Click to expand...

Powered studio monitors do not offer the option to use an external power amp. One of the reasons studio monitors accurately reproduce sounds is due to the bi-amped drivers; meaning separate amp sections for the woofer and tweeter. Some people use the powered CLR monitors as high powered studio monitors since the amps and drivers are so well matched (they are also bi-amped). Instead of bi-amping, most companies just use a crossover to separate high & low freqs.

Power amps like the ones by Matrix were designed primarily for guitar use but typically don't color the guitar tone much, so they do a good job for both FRFR and amp/cab rigs.
 
Hey,

OK so I guess the question for me is will there be much of a difference in the sound I get from the Axe FX 2 if say I went the guitar->axe fx 2->Yamaha HS8's route over the guitar->axe fx 2->matrix power amp->atomic passive monitor.

Cody
 
Guitar-Zan said:
Hey,

OK so I guess the question for me is will there be much of a difference in the sound I get from the Axe FX 2 if say I went the guitar->axe fx 2->Yamaha HS8's route over the guitar->axe fx 2->matrix power amp->atomic passive monitor.

Cody
Click to expand...

The Atomic CLRs are better quality than the HS80Ms plus they have a greater dynamic range largely due to the 12" driver. Plus they can move more air. Something to consider if you go that route; For an extra $250 per CLR monitor ($999 vs. $749) you would get an onboard amp that is perfectly matched to the drivers. This is what cinched the deal for me.

I don't personally have any experience with Matrix products but have seen a lot of demos and reviews on them. They definitely make good stuff albeit a bit pricey. Hopefully someone else can chime in and give you a better informed opinion. Carvin makes some good stuff too, and very affordable.
 
Hey,

Thanks for all the help so far, really appreciate it. I am thinking of just starting out with the Matrix 1000fx into my Marshall 1960bv cab route. There is a waiting list for the atomics. If I get monitors I want to buy them once. I already have the 1960bv cab so its just a matter of buying the power amplifier. I have heard good things about this setup and I can always try FRFR later.

I am now looking into getting a case as well for the axe and matrix poweramp. I won't really be moving my setup so I was looking at some wood cases at nice-racks.com. My main question is with air flow and depth and rails. For the axe fx 2 xl and matrix 1000fx 1u I would need 3 units of space. I heard somewhere that it is a good idea to have air flow between units, is this so? I went to google images and I see a lot of rack units with the axe and a power amp with no space between them.

I read that the Axe FX 2 XL is 14.25 inches deep so would it be a good idea to upgrade the case to a 16" deep case? I guess if I go with standard 12" case then part of the back of the Axe FX 2 XL will be sticking out lol.

Lastly the case as a rear rail option, is this necessary for the axe fx 2 xl or matrix power amp? I know some people on this forum have their Axe FX 2 XL in a nice-racks case so maybe they can help.

All the Best,

Cody
 
Me again. LOL! I forgot that you wanted the option to use your Existing cab, so the Matrix unit makes perfect sense. I was looking at the Nice-Racks website (and I'm kicking myself in the rear for not coming up with that name) and those look like a decent option for stationary racks. I don't know anything about their track record but I'm sure you can find some info on this forum (or maybe you have already).

Keep in mind that the Axe-Fx 14.25" depth includes the 2 front handles, which stick out about 1.25", so the depth of the unit itself is about 13".

I looked at the Nice-Racks FAQ section and read this:

Q: How do I know which depth to choose for my rack?

A: Depth should typically be determined by your largest (deepest) piece of equipment. For instance, if your deepest piece is 13", you should add 1/2" for the rail setback, and another 1-2" for any rear cabling requirements. In this case, a 16" deep rack would comfortably house the unit and its rear cables.

So, it sounds like a 16" depth from them would suit you. A couple of other things to consider; Expansion, as in do you foresee getting any other rack gear down the road? If so, maybe get a rack with more spaces. You mentioned having ventilation between rack units. At one point, I was considering going the rack mount power amp route and considered the same thing. Plenty of people don't have any separation between units, but if you wanted to, you could always get a 6-space rack case and put in some blank vent panels like this one: 1U Flanged Vent Panel

You don't really need the rear rails, but it's a nice option in case you want to mount something back there at some point.

You also may want to put a power conditioner in your rack, which would take up 1 space.

If you wanted something that was portable, this is the one I'm currently using: EWI Tourcase tm Model R4UE-14 rack case

Here's a post I made a few months with pics of my rig

Best of luck and be sure to post pics when you get setup!

Tom
 
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Hey,

Thanks a lot Tom for your helpful replies. So I would be fine with a 3u rack? I'm assuming most of the heat escapes out the back of rack mounted units hence the back pulling off. I think the nice-racks don't have a backing hence them being better as a stationary bedroom or studio rack. I noticed in your pics you have no space between the units in your 4u rack so I am assuming a 3u rack would work fine with the Axe FX 2 on the bottom and the Matrix 1000fx above it?

In any case I will probably go with a 4u but I am curious if you think the Matrix 1000fx will get too hot right next to the Axe FX 2?

Also how did you get the blue light onto your foot controller? That looks bad ass :)

All the Best,

Cody Kahl
 
You are welcome! BTW, IMHO, a power conditioner is really a good thing to have in the rack. It has outlets on the back and protects your investment in rack gear from dirty power and power surges, plus the pull out lights are nice.

As for power amp heat transfer, since I don't have a power amp in my rack, I can't personally speak from experience. Maybe someone else can chime in or you could search the forum (or even Google) for info.

The blue light is simply an LED Book Light with blue Sharpie ink on the lens. Poor man's black light! :D
 
I'm late to this thread and didn't read all of the posts but here is my quick and dirty.

Active (or passive) studio monitors and PA speakers/guitar cabs serve different purposes. Studio monitors which are FRFR are for use in a studio whether that be of the professional variety or your bedroom. Typically you connect your PC to them and potentially the Axe-FX or other gear via a mixer or sound card. If you are just jamming in your bedroom or living room and want to record or listen to PC media with awesome highly accurate/flat response speakers or just monitor the Axe-FX get a set. You don't need a power amp if you buy active studio monitors.

Studio monitors can get loud but not jamming with a band loud. If you want to get LOUD you need a PA speaker or a guitar cab. Note that PA speakers are (supposed to be) FRFR. If you buy a passive one you need a power amp, if you buy active you do not. You'll note people usually go for a wedge shape and 12" is preferred (15" don't have ideal crossover frequencies). If you want to take advantage of the guitar cab you already have, which is not FRFR, buy a power amp and disable cabinet modeling in the Axe-FX.

Brass tax:
* Studio monitors (FRFR) - Unless you are using the Axe-FX setup exclusively as a guitar amp buy a set. There are a billion to buy so I won't chime in on that. I personally used 8.5" powered Mackie HR824s. 8" speakers are large for small rooms but I have lots of acoustic treatment (see below)
* Guitar cab/power amp - If you go this route there are also many fine products but I'd boil it down to a Carvin (budget route) or a Matrix (high end route) power amp.
* PA speakers (FRFR) - I would go this route and select the EV ELX112P active (somewhat budget route) or Atomic CLR active (high end route), ideally two of them.
* Footswitch - If you are playing with others and/or playing live you need one. I recommend the Behringer FCB 1010 with a Eureka chip mod (budget route) or the MFC-101 with Mission CC pedals (high-end route)
* Acoustic treatment - This is critical and always overlooked. You are dropping thousands on gear. If it is in your bedroom with no treatment that is a problem. Buy ridgid fiberglass on ebay and make 12 DIY broad band absorber traps and at least 4 DIY bass traps. You'll be blown away be the improvement in the sound. Lots of info on the web on this. DIY costs a fraction of the commercial products and can have perfectly acceptable acoustic results and they aren't that hard.
* Cables - Nothing special, just buy quality
* Headphones (FRFR) - Many choices and many threads on this. Get a quality set with a flat response. I own AKG K702s open backs, moderately priced but high quality.
* Time - You are going to need to woodshed for a while to get sounds you like. The presets work great for some but not others. Check out Fremen's banks/IRs and the stuff on Axe-Change to hear more examples of how patches can be dialed-in. Tune your patches for your needs. It is helpful to have a skillful buddy to help with this part. Keep your patches simple.
* IRs - Get a handful of good Ultrares IRs. There are a lot of good free ones and third party ones. Clark Kent is a good resource. So is Fremen. OwnHammer is great third party commercial provider and you can buy a lot of their stuff a la carte. Don't go crazy with this. Focus on a few quality IRs.

OK, now I need to make my album a reality. Good luck and have fun.
 
I'm also a new (less than three months) XL owner.

I had all the same questions at the beginning. I chose a 4u SKB rack case to house my XL plus a Furman and a Matrix. I haven't noticed any heat, seems to have adequate airflow.

I also play thru a Marshall 4x12. Believe me, the GT1000FX can get loud, but it's also usable at lower (apartment) volumes.
 
Hey,

Does it matter what order you place the Axe FX 2 XL and the Matrix GT1000FX? I have heard to put the power conditioner on the top. I was thinking of having the axe on the bottom, then the matrix, and then the furman.

All the Best,

Cody
 
Hey,

I have a chance to get a used Matrix GT1600FX for about $50 cheaper than a brand new 1000FX just wondering if I should go for it. I know its more than what I need for the bedroom but who knows what else I will be doing with it eventually. The description and pictures show the unit is mint. Other than that I am just wondering if it will affect the sound of the patches any differently than the 1000fx... I doubt it but who knows. I guess I would have to keep the level lower as well with the 1600fx over the 1000fx. Oh... also the 1600 is 2u as well.

All the Best,

Cody
 
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