Graphic EQ to tighten up amp for Metal - Standards?

H

hunter

Experienced
Although I've been playing for almost 20 years, I'm not very experienced in achieving Metal Tones.

I think it helps a lot to use a GEQ for tightening up amps like the Recto New or the Ueber. Recto seems a bit muddy in the lower mids, Ueber too much in the low end, Das Metal a bit too fizzy in the high mids.

Are there any standard frequencies and what they do?

Frequencies in the GEQ are:
63
125
250
500
1,000
4,000
8,000

What are your standard usages of those to make amps tight and big for Metal?
 
hmm.. i personally try to not use eq if i dont have to... try a tubescreamer in front of the amp to tighten it up... andy sneap is known for doing this on cd's he's produced.
 
dpeterson said:
hmm.. i personally try to not use eq if i dont have to... try a tubescreamer in front of the amp to tighten it up... andy sneap is known for doing this on cd's he's produced.
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interesting question.. well, a tubescreamer basically cuts a fair amount of bass from the signal and boosts the mids slightly (or not so slightly), so you might just cut a little bass with the GEQ (up to 125 and also try the 250 band, which are mids already..).
Or try a filter block and use your own center frequency to cut a little bass..
a tight metal guitar sound needs fairly little bass i guess, as the drums and bass in metal music are really fat in that range already..

or sumthin.. :)
 
Don't wanna stray too much from the original topic, but I usually get what I want from messing with different cabs and mics combinations. If I were to use an EQ for tightening, I'd suggest trying it with the whole mix. Maybe there are low end freqs messing with the bass guitar and so on..
 
BTW, there is a guide/tutorial on the wiki somewhere on this particular subject.

and btw, would a tubescreamer in front of a higain amp really help tightening it up? I'm not saying it won't I just never thought about trying it, doesn't sound logical to me =)
 
danielodland said:
BTW, there is a guide/tutorial on the wiki somewhere on this particular subject.

and btw, would a tubescreamer in front of a higain amp really help tightening it up? I'm not saying it won't I just never thought about trying it, doesn't sound logical to me =)
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Absolutely it will. Try a TS808 drive block before the amp, turn the drive down to zero, tone to 50%, and keep the level on the default (7.68 or something...right?). It will definitely tighten up a high gainer and does wonders for models like the Recto Red channel and other fairly saggy amps. This is done a LOT by metal guitarists on real tube rigs and works in the Axe-FX world equally well.
 
glenecho said:
danielodland said:
BTW, there is a guide/tutorial on the wiki somewhere on this particular subject.

and btw, would a tubescreamer in front of a higain amp really help tightening it up? I'm not saying it won't I just never thought about trying it, doesn't sound logical to me =)
Click to expand...

Absolutely it will. Try a TS808 drive block before the amp, turn the drive down to zero, tone to 50%, and keep the level on the default (7.68 or something...right?). It will definitely tighten up a high gainer and does wonders for models like the Recto Red channel and other fairly saggy amps. This is done a LOT by metal guitarists on real tube rigs and works in the Axe-FX world equally well.
Click to expand...

Even more than that, drive 0, tone 5 and volume 10. Then almost every amp in the afx will be brutal. ;)
 
Clawfinger said:
glenecho said:
danielodland said:
BTW, there is a guide/tutorial on the wiki somewhere on this particular subject.

and btw, would a tubescreamer in front of a higain amp really help tightening it up? I'm not saying it won't I just never thought about trying it, doesn't sound logical to me =)
Click to expand...

Absolutely it will. Try a TS808 drive block before the amp, turn the drive down to zero, tone to 50%, and keep the level on the default (7.68 or something...right?). It will definitely tighten up a high gainer and does wonders for models like the Recto Red channel and other fairly saggy amps. This is done a LOT by metal guitarists on real tube rigs and works in the Axe-FX world equally well.
Click to expand...

Even more than that, drive 0, tone 5 and volume 10. Then almost every amp in the afx will be brutal. ;)
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That... was funny... :D
 
Cool...I've sometimes used drives in front of real tube amps to get a muddier, raunchier sound=) That's why I was curious =)

Will try!
 
Depending on the sound I am looking for I quite like the SuperOD infront of the amp block for heavy stuff and the TS808 for lighter tighter stuff. TS808 has a little too much mids for my personal taste. I usually keep the low cut on the drive block up at around 100-200Hz and the same with the low cut in the amp block. I then set drive (in the drive block) to 0, level from 10-12 and adjust the tone to taste. I have used this to tighten everything from Plexi, JCM800, recto, das metal and euro2.

Should get most amps to sound pretty tight though :)
 
danielodland said:
BTW, there is a guide/tutorial on the wiki somewhere on this particular subject.

and btw, would a tubescreamer in front of a higain amp really help tightening it up? I'm not saying it won't I just never thought about trying it, doesn't sound logical to me =)
Click to expand...

Typically, TS type ODs have a bit of a bass cut and a mid boost. This means when the signal hits the amp, you end up with less distorted low frequencies, which are one easy to fix source of flubbiness. Same idea with the Mesa Mark series EQ knobs. If you crank the bass knob it just gets flubby. Keep the bass knob low to get a tighter sound, and the boost the overall bass sound back up at the graphic EQ.

The Cornford model was just plain unusable for me at first. I don't mind a bit of flub, but the Cornford's low end is just plain retarded. :lol: A filter block in front to take out some low freqs though and the amp tightens up while still staying nice and thick. :cool:

For tightening purposes, I tend to stick with a simple filter block. Drive blocks just colour the sound too much, which is not usually what I'm after. Most of the time I like the sound I have, I just want it to be a bit tighter.
 
As already said, the TS in front of amp is a popular method. Drive at ZERO is the key to making it work.
As for specific EQ frequencies to rid the flub, I think it varies depending on what you are using. I like the parametric before the amp sometimes, and just play around with cutting some shit with that. Sometimes a cut at 120 hz.
 
Eureka!

So I rehearsed yesterday with GEQ after the amp. And although it cut through nicely and was tight and all, it made it sound sterile, like a solid state amp almost (although I use a VHT2502).

So today I experimented with some of your suggestions, and I gotta say, it's great. The secret is really the Drive=0 setting.
I prefer at the moment the modded 808, as it doesn't cut as much bass as the other one, but might swap them with the band if needed.

Now I got some more stuff to try, but the Metal and Ueber patches are already really good now! Also the chords are very full and tight, but single notes jump really out at you, which is perfect in the band.

Axe rulez!

:mrgreen:
 
hunter said:
So today I experimented with some of your suggestions, and I gotta say, it's great. The secret is really the Drive=0 setting.
I prefer at the moment the modded 808, as it doesn't cut as much bass as the other one....
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Remember, you have complete control over how much bass the drive pedals let through with the Low Cut control that is on the second page of the Drive block (clockwise less bass, counter clockwise more). High Cut control does the same thing for the treble.

Try experimenting with the other controls on page 2 as well. I always use a drive block in front of the high gain amps to tighten them up and give them more balls. My favorite is the Full OD (Fulltone Fulldrive2) - Drive 0, Level full, Slew Rate 0, and Clip Type set to HV Tube (high voltage tube).
 
shredi knight said:
Try experimenting with the other controls on page 2 as well. I always use a drive block in front of the high gain amps to tighten them up and give them more balls. My favorite is the Full OD (Fulltone Fulldrive2) - Drive 0, Level full, Slew Rate 0, and Clip Type set to HV Tube (high voltage tube).
Click to expand...

OMG, this is a "barrel without a bottom" as we Germans say. I've just been tweaking highgain patches the whole afternoon and my ears are bleeding :mrgreen:

Gotta go check out the Full OD now ...
 
hunter said:
shredi knight said:
Try experimenting with the other controls on page 2 as well. I always use a drive block in front of the high gain amps to tighten them up and give them more balls. My favorite is the Full OD (Fulltone Fulldrive2) - Drive 0, Level full, Slew Rate 0, and Clip Type set to HV Tube (high voltage tube).
Click to expand...

OMG, this is a "barrel without a bottom" as we Germans say. I've just been tweaking highgain patches the whole afternoon and my ears are bleeding :mrgreen:

Gotta go check out the Full OD now ...
Click to expand...
Didn't you German guys invent high gain?!?!? You should go ask Bogner... no wait... if you did that you might sell your Axe-fx and get a Spider Valve!!!! ;)
 
Threads like this make me even happier to have an AxeFX. A decent, kind community just helping each other out with great advice. Yes, it is rare on the internet!

Will try some of these tricks.
 
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