FM3 into Tube Combo Amp

S

smc

New Member
I'm currently running my FM3 directly into the input of my combo tube amp. The combo amp has no effects loop.

While the FM3 is powered on and connected to the input of the combo amp, there's a consistent loud hiss that only increases when I adjust the combo amp volume. To resolve this for the time being, I've set the combo amp volume very low and the FM3 level high. I noticed that even when I'm in bypass mode, this hissing still persists.

Any suggestions as to how I might resolve this issue?
 
@SteveD61 I had them connected to different power outlets. After connecting them to the same power outlet, the hissing has subsided significantly. Thanks!

The XLR Ground button doesn't seem to make a difference in the level of hissing.
 
smc said:
@SteveD61 I had them connected to different power outlets. After connecting them to the same power outlet, the hissing has subsided significantly. Thanks!

The XLR Ground button doesn't seem to make a difference in the level of hissing.
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Common problem with Audio gear. The earth pins can be at slightly different potential from one outlet to another glad it worked. XLR won’t do anything I doubt your amp is connected using XLR
 
Even though the way you're connecting the FM3 will work, it may not be ideal. For example, delay and reverb when used in this fashion may not have the results you'd like. It may give you a warbly type of sound.

Also, you are already using a Pre-amp, Power-amp, and speaker in your combo, which the FM3 is trying to emulate. So, you're getting emulation into the same thing again. This may color the tone quite a bit and probably not the way you want it to. This is why a lot of people use a monitor or FRFR speaker of some sort, so they get a flat response with as little colorization as possible. Another way is people plug into the Effect Return and use just the Power Amp and speaker but turn that emulation off in the Fractal. Others may use the 4-cable method but again, that requires an Effects Return, which you don't have.

My experience has been, very few people use a modeler of any kind in the way you're trying to use it. Mostly because you're really kind'a limited to only effects that are made to typically be used before the Pre-amp. It's like having a Ferrari but limited to only starting the engine and listening to the radio but not actually driving it.
 
smc said:
I'm currently running my FM3 directly into the input of my combo tube amp. The combo amp has no effects loop.

While the FM3 is powered on and connected to the input of the combo amp, there's a consistent loud hiss that only increases when I adjust the combo amp volume. To resolve this for the time being, I've set the combo amp volume very low and the FM3 level high. I noticed that even when I'm in bypass mode, this hissing still persists.

Any suggestions as to how I might resolve this issue?
Click to expand...
How far is your FM3 from Amp and guitar. I experienced a slight his at first use but had everything, voice mic, console, amps fm3 and guitar close to each other. when separating farther away the amps and FM3 all hiss disappeared.
 
smc said:
I'm currently running my FM3 directly into the input of my combo tube amp. The combo amp has no effects loop.
Click to expand...
Confirm you're following the recommendations for the preset and connections on p. 36 of the manual.

smc said:
While the FM3 is powered on and connected to the input of the combo amp, there's a consistent loud hiss that only increases when I adjust the combo amp volume. To resolve this for the time being, I've set the combo amp volume very low and the FM3 level high. I noticed that even when I'm in bypass mode, this hissing still persists.

Any suggestions as to how I might resolve this issue?
Click to expand...
Hiss or hum? Hiss is electronic noise, often caused by gain, hum is most likely power, probably a 60-cycle ground-loop which is a low-frequency note, and they're fixed in different ways. The page in the manual talks about using a Humbuster cable to help control hum but it probably won't help with hiss. And, as others mentioned, plugging both units into the same power-strip is a simple way to fix, or at least reduce, ground-loops and their hum.

Setting the combo amp preamp input low and FM3 level output high won't hurt. It'll help reduce distortion in the amp's preamp and power-amp but adjust to taste; Some people want their amp to be a "pedal-platform" where the amp is über clean and pedals provide the distortion. I'm old school and on my tube amps want true power-amp distortion so I run my preamp inputs hot to push the power amp to its limits and control it from the guitar. (I treat my presets on the modeler similarly.) Also see the tip at the bottom of the page for reducing noise using the boost/pad setting.

Note: You don't describe the preset(s) you're using, but the hiss could be coming from excessive gain in the preset itself. We can't say because we don't know what's going on inside the preset so if you want more detailed help you'll need to share one of them. It'd also help for us to know exactly what tube amp you're using.
 
This might help a few who (like me) still feel drawn to tube amps.

I came up w/ this split arrangement fiddling on my own and I've since seen other users set it up this way too.

Basically you send L to FOH and run R to your onstage mic'd tube amp (set up clean-ish / edge of breakup). Soundman can mix the signals to give you 'clarity and meat'. A little FRFR direct bleed in the monitor... Good onstage sound.

I also set up a 'Flat Response' patch to EQ the overall FRFR and Tube amp outputs to avoid overly bright or woofy crap.

Works great for me anyway and I regularly get compliments on tone from Musicians (I never met before) in audience. So, worth a try?...


FM3-Split_Direct-Tube.JPG
 
Joel.Brown333 said:
Even though the way you're connecting the FM3 will work, it may not be ideal. For example, delay and reverb when used in this fashion may not have the results you'd like. It may give you a warbly type of sound.
Click to expand...
This isn't necessarily true.

I jam with this one band that going to the desk is not an option, so I have a combo without an effects loop that I use. I set the preamp on the combo to be as close as possible to the sound of my fm3 bypassing all effects going into the effects loop of an amp. This way I mimic the eq curve of a power amp as close as possible with this combo. I start with a clean channel with everything at noon then tweak from there. Then I bypass the cab block and I'm good to go. I get rather good results including with reverbs and delays.

Some even like the way a cab block sounds going into an amp (I personally don't).

Moral of the story is - try it. If it sounds good to you, then it is good.
 
Greg Ferguson said:
Confirm you're following the recommendations for the preset and connections on p. 36 of the manual.


Hiss or hum? Hiss is electronic noise, often caused by gain, hum is most likely power, probably a 60-cycle ground-loop which is a low-frequency note, and they're fixed in different ways. The page in the manual talks about using a Humbuster cable to help control hum but it probably won't help with hiss. And, as others mentioned, plugging both units into the same power-strip is a simple way to fix, or at least reduce, ground-loops and their hum.

Setting the combo amp preamp input low and FM3 level output high won't hurt. It'll help reduce distortion in the amp's preamp and power-amp but adjust to taste; Some people want their amp to be a "pedal-platform" where the amp is über clean and pedals provide the distortion. I'm old school and on my tube amps want true power-amp distortion so I run my preamp inputs hot to push the power amp to its limits and control it from the guitar. (I treat my presets on the modeler similarly.) Also see the tip at the bottom of the page for reducing noise using the boost/pad setting.

Note: You don't describe the preset(s) you're using, but the hiss could be coming from excessive gain in the preset itself. We can't say because we don't know what's going on inside the preset so if you want more detailed help you'll need to share one of them. It'd also help for us to know exactly what tube amp you're using.
Click to expand...
Is a hum buster cable a shielded cable or what about it makes it special?
 
ptmanyoda said:
This might help a few who (like me) still feel drawn to tube amps.

I came up w/ this split arrangement fiddling on my own and I've since seen other users set it up this way too.

Basically you send L to FOH and run R to your onstage mic'd tube amp (set up clean-ish / edge of breakup). Soundman can mix the signals to give you 'clarity and meat'. A little FRFR direct bleed in the monitor... Good onstage sound.

I also set up a 'Flat Response' patch to EQ the overall FRFR and Tube amp outputs to avoid overly bright or woofy crap.

Works great for me anyway and I regularly get compliments on tone from Musicians (I never met before) in audience. So, worth a try?...


View attachment 134560
Click to expand...
can you share you PEQ settings??
 
I had an issue like this with my FM9 going into a Orange Stomp amp - sold my FM9 and got my Helix back - then realized it did the same thing. This puzzled me because my friend's HX Effects did not. They are powered different ways though as I found later - which is the root of the problem.

If you are having the same issue I did - this might help:

https://reverb.com/p/morley-mhum-x-hum-exterminator
 
smc said:
I had them connected to different power outlets. After connecting them to the same power outlet, the hissing has subsided significantly. Thanks!

The XLR Ground button doesn't seem to make a difference in the level of hissing.
Click to expand...
I had a similar issue in certain venues, and similarly found that plugging the FM3 and backline into the same outlet solved the problem.

Worth noting: Ever since I started using a Humbuster cable to connect to the backline, I've never encountered the problem.

accuser said:
Some even like the way a cab block sounds going into an amp
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🤢!
 
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