dilema with power amp sims and sag/damp.

C

Conflict

Inspired
Hi there can anyone help me with this issue.
I understand that if you leave poweramp sims to on no thump but adjust the sag to 0
Then the poweramp sims are bypassed. However why is it that when i turn off the poweramp sims in the global settings the patches sound different to the patch with pa sims on but sag set to 0.
I want to run all my high gain stuff with global pa sims off, but all cleans wirh pa sims on... Is this actuallt possible as i hear a difference.
 
By the way is it possible to run PowerAmp sim engaged signal to a PA and split the plain preamp signal for the amplifier? Sorry for stealing your thread a little bit. ;)
 
@ OP: seems strange, they should sound identically, as sag= 0 -> p.a. off and global p.a. off -> the same. Perhaps there's an unintended difference in how the presence and depth remain to work (or not). Probably a question for Cliff or Adam.


JoeHans said:
By the way is it possible to run PowerAmp sim engaged signal to a PA and split the plain preamp signal for the amplifier? Sorry for stealing your thread a little bit. ;)
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It is possible, but not by splitting. You have to use two amp blocks, one with p.a. on, the other with off (sag = 0).
 
Sebastian said:
It is possible, but not by splitting. You have to use two amp blocks, one with p.a. on, the other with off (sag = 0).
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Ok, but doesn't this create a problem concerning the effects? In this case the effects should also be separated for each amp block?
 
JoeHans said:
Ok, but doesn't this create a problem concerning the effects? In this case the effects should also be separated for each amp block?
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What problem?
Of course you'd have to keep paths separate after the amp, but it would be just the same if you could do it with a single amp block and splitted output.
 
Sebastian said:
What problem?
Of course you'd have to keep paths separate after the amp, but it would be just the same if you could do it with a single amp block and splitted output.
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Normally I would split the signal right before the cabinet simulator. This way the patch has only one delay, one reverb etc. The method you're suggesting should do the trick although it seems a bit complicated. It will eat a lot more of processor capacity and I would need to program my midi controller(FCB1010) again to switch two effects on/off at once instead of one effect. Maybe I need to experiment a little with it. :|
 
Conflict said:
Thread hijacked :(
Really need an answer on this asap as i have festivals on the way, any ideas would help.
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As I said, what you describe to be should not be. Contact Fractal Audio, because only they can give you a definitive answer. I would check the supposed behaviour myself, but I sold my Ultra for the II half a year ago.

@ JoeHans:
My point was, even if you didn't need two amp blocks but could set a single block to a "double purpose" output, you'd need to keep the signal chains separated after the amp - just logic. Theoretically there are two more options:
1. put as much FX as possible in front of the amp (yes, I know, don't complain :) )
2. use single blocks of FX which do true stereo/two channel processing, and keep settings for each channel identical. You have to pan the amp with p.a. sim and the amp w/out p.a. sim apart prior to those effects, and also use two cab blocks or a single stereo cab block with cab sims hard panned L and R. Keep in mind that the reverb is not true stereo: its effect output is stereo, but the processed FX input sums L+R.
 
JoeHans said:
Ok, but doesn't this create a problem concerning the effects? In this case the effects should also be separated for each amp block?
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For any FX you want to use post amp block, you'd have to use separately - unless you run mono, in which case you could just pan them for separation.

Another alternative would be to set up your chain with the noPASIM amp and whatever FX you want. At the end add the FX loop block then another amp block and cab. Perhaps use the "Tube Pre" for the second amp, as you want only the PA sim. Worth experimenting with, I've gotten some very good tones stacking two amp blocks. This would give you some additional tonal shaping for the DI output.
 
Thanks for the input guys. :) I'm gonna try these out once I get a change to play through amp+PA.

@Conflict: And once again, sorry for being a dirty hijacker. :D If I need further assistance with this kind of setup I promise to make a new thread. :)
 
According to FAS when you turn off the PA Sim the Presence control becomes a high shelf EQ so presence setting change etc, plus the tone will change minus the PA Sim which has some high end roll-off happening if you push it, and some mid scoop no matter the level feeding it, so you'll hear a difference with it on or off. Also the overall level changes which effects your hearing as well.

As to hearing a difference between the Global PA Sim Defeat and the local one, don't know aside from the presence setting?

Conflict said:
No problems man he he I am just trying to work this out and having no luck.
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