Axe-Fx III Firmware 25.00 Public Beta (Cygnus X-3)

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Saarang Narayan said:
This might be psychoacoustic, but anybody else feels like changing the BMT values on some amps is also affecting the amount of gain? (Not talking about the Mark series where this is kind of the intended behaviour) I spent some time with the SLO and CCV so far and found this to be the case, but not sure if I am just hearing things that aren't there.
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The shape of the EQ can make things sound more or less saturated. A mid scooped tone usually sounds higher gain than a mid forward tone.

Also it can really increase the saturation if anything after the EQ is clipping. The Mark series as you noted (and fender amps and anything else with EQ before the overdrive circuits) clearly does this because the EQ is before all the gain stages, so boosting the input with EQ clearly adds gain. But other amps with a more traditional highgain post-gain stages topology like Marshalls, SLO types, etc can still do this if the Phase inverter is clipping, or the power amp is clipping. The SLO usually defaults to enough master volume to overdrive the power amp some, and boosting the highs would boost the highs into that overdriven power amp. Try reducing the Master until it no longer exceeds the headroom of the power amp, then see if you still hear the same thing.
 
Saarang Narayan said:
This might be psychoacoustic, but anybody else feels like changing the BMT values on some amps is also affecting the amount of gain? (Not talking about the Mark series where this is kind of the intended behaviour) I spent some time with the SLO and CCV so far and found this to be the case, but not sure if I am just hearing things that aren't there.
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In the pre-amp page you can see where the tone stack is located for that particular amp and change as needed. In your case, it might be something else as they are listed POST for the CCV and SLO.

more info here: https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/what-exactly-do-tonestack-position-change.100781/

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Saarang Narayan said:
This might be psychoacoustic, but anybody else feels like changing the BMT values on some amps is also affecting the amount of gain? (Not talking about the Mark series where this is kind of the intended behaviour) I spent some time with the SLO and CCV so far and found this to be the case, but not sure if I am just hearing things that aren't there.
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real cameron ccv/atomica is like that. by manipulating the eq knobs you’ll get different amounts of gain in different eq spectrum. it is very interactive with preamp gain and your choice of diodes (aka gain style on a real amp). this is just another part of why I like camerons so much. very versatile. also, with ccv, input gain is set to get desired feel under the fingers(set it to 3 for tight and chewy at the same time, 5 might be too muddy), and amount of overall gain is set with input trim (real amp has 2 gain controls).
 
Saarang Narayan said:
This might be psychoacoustic, but anybody else feels like changing the BMT values on some amps is also affecting the amount of gain? (Not talking about the Mark series where this is kind of the intended behaviour) I spent some time with the SLO and CCV so far and found this to be the case, but not sure if I am just hearing things that aren't there.
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That should model real-world behavior. Tonestack position & values have a huge impact on how much gain (and thus distortion) is generated downstream in the circuit.

A typical tonestack has about -30dB insertion loss IIRC. This is why tweed Fenders & Marshalls are more distorted than blackface Fenders- the blackface moves the tonestack between the first 2 gain stages, so the 2nd isn't hit with as hot a signal- Marshalls & tweeds have the tonestack after the 2nd gain stage.

Changing the values within the tonestack could change that overall loss, which would result in more/less dB loss between gain stages, resulting in more/less distortion. And generally the more mids that come out of the tonestack the harder the next stage is pushed- whether that's another gain stage, the phase inverter, etc.
 
The new Morning Glory (with the Hi-Cut bypassed) is so awesome. I put it in front of the 5150-II and G12T-100 cab with a misaligned 57 and 1973, and it all sounds massive, like I'm using my guitar to punch someone in the face.

I've played through the 1959SLP Jumped and Treble, the 6CA7 Jumped and Treble, the 6550, and the 1970 Plexis, and they are all feeling so good with this update. I feel a definite sense of chaos from the amps, in a good way. I think of tube amps as unstable beasts you have to tame with your playing, and this update has that great chaos, that feeling from a tube amp that it wants to be just noise, but you have to coax it to be something more. I love it. Thanks so much!
 
Anyone else notice the delay first repeat is louder? I noticed this across several different delay types. Or are my ears playing tricks on me?
 
1234 said:
$10k is a bit steep, does this include an assortment of groupies shipping with the amp?
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Nah, it's already discounted 50%! If you mean "tube amp groupies" like mud and James F (and many others), sure they could visit and have at the amps too. Not to mention special white glove attention by Matt and FAS and other surprise perks for Club members. And a chance to get your own custom amp model!

And don't tell me a bunch of guys on here don't have at least 10x that invested in guitars, amps, tubes, cabs, rack gear, pedals, cables, studio gear & software, and random piles of junk sitting in some corner, basement, garage or storage unit.
 
Finally got to spend a bit of time A/B'ing one of my favorite models, the Nuclear Tone, and this FW is great! There is a noticeable bump in the lows and low mids as well as more clarity in the highs, at least to my ears. I liken this FW to my experience with the release of FW 11 (new speaker impedance modeling) as far as the perception of a leap in feel and tonal 'improvement'. It never ceases to amaze me that Cliff is able to improve something that already sounded so amazing.

Thank you for your never ending quest of tonal perfection.
 
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Thomas Obester said:
real cameron ccv/atomica is like that.
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Parkinthepark said:
Tonestack position & values have a huge impact on how much gain (and thus distortion) is generated downstream in the circuit.
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This just makes em think this firmware gets things closer to the real deal than before. IOW, this effect may have been there in previous FWs, but X-3 makes it more apparent. Good to know!
 
giantslayer said:
Just took my shiny new Plexi tone to practice and found that my guitar became weak and disappeared when everyone else was playing. I had committed one of the classic blunders: dialing in too much gain at home. I take back what I said about needing more gain.
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One of the many reasons, why I gradually have gravitated to the FA presets for amp block settings.
 
flyingfadr said:
Gain is usually not the culprit, but a lack of mids ( usually... and I play with absolutely ridiculous amounts of gain... LOL )
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At the obvious risk of sounding like an old guy, the usual culprits are typically (but not exclusively):
a) too little dynamics / too much signal compression (and I am not simply referring to the use of a compressor);
b) forgetting that the guitar has a volume and tone controls and leaving them dimed;
c) forgetting that the electric guitar should occupy a specific space in the audible spectrum. If your instrument is just another poppy in a field of poppies, you will be indistinguishable; and
d) In summary, if you aren't moving as much air as everyone else, with the right frequencies for electric guitar, then you're not in the room.

This latest beta release has made the amp blocks move even further towards the characteristics of real amplifiers. Play them like an amp, and move the speaker cones.
 
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