Your Favorite Third Party IR Bundles

[alcyppa]

Well, I can only really speak to my perspective (obviously). I'm not really that interested in authenticity of the IR as much as how well it works sonically for my needs. Getting subjective impressions from those who have used various third party sellers was all I was looking for.

I imagine there are folks who are looking for an accurate emulation of a real world product, this just isn't me.

Personally I choose the IR vendor based upon the "ears" of whom is doing the captures.
I find to be ear fatiguing cycling through countless IRs that represent every single mic placement around the cone so I'd rather have a handful of files to choose from.

And for doing that I'd have to trust who's responsible for them, like paying for a sound engineer whos work best represents what I like in guitar tones.

 

[State of Epicicity]

always intrigued me how often I read IR related conversations that center around which sellers' IRs sound "better" than others', but not so much discussion about which IRs sound most true to the character of the given cab / speaker / mic / micpre. I guess it could have to do with level of skill with the capture process or added "sauce" as I'm not sure that if brand A's IR sounds musically better to my ears than brand B, it necessarily means that the brand A IR is more accurate / "true".

This is a great point, but to my mind it comes down to the guitar, pick, strings and pickups used by the IR creator, and of course their playing style. Just like hearing others’ presets that are the awesomest thing ever when the preset author demos them, but sound like anus when I do. I think it’s the same with IRs when you approach it from an authenticity angle. I’ll bet it sounds authentic if you listen to the creator of the IR demo it, because of all the factors involved, but outside of that, all bets are off. Just my two cents.

 

[AminorZmajor]

My top 3 Mikko, Ownhammer and York Audio. All are awesome and my list is also not in any particular order.

 

[Will Schut]

For me it’s Valhallir all the way. The quality is top notch and they have some really special IR’s on tap.
Do yourself a favour, visit the website https://valhallir.at/ check out the products and download the free teaser pack. Not kindding, these IR’s are something else…

 

[FenderJunkie]

If you're using Marshall style amps, it's pretty tough to beat the Ownhammer 412 MRBW GNR M25 MMMC bundle. After trying IR's from nearly everyone (and lots of them), this one just sound right. The GNR Chunk is just killer!!

 

[Chromatizm]

it comes down to the guitar, pick, strings and pickups used by the IR creator, and of course their playing style

AFAIK IRs have nothing to do with strings or picks. It is an "impulse" of the speaker/cabinet playing sine wave and captured by the mic. Nobody is playing the guitar at this point

 

[State of Epicicity]

AFAIK IRs have nothing to do with strings or picks. It is an "impulse" of the speaker/cabinet playing sine wave and captured by the mic. Nobody is playing the guitar at this point

It has everything to do with strings and picks!

How else is the IR creator going to find the best spot to shoot the IR? You have to play through the amp first, probably with a dry signal of yourself or someone else playing, to find the sweet spot for the mic. Finding the best sweet spot by ear is how some IR creators distinguish themselves. After you find the sweet spot you send the sine wave through. These speakers sound so different on each spot, the only way to find the best one is by playing first, unless you’re specifically trying to find every single spot and capture that, like the MIKKO plugin does; but the MIKKO plugin is very unique and special in that regard, different from standard ML IRs, trying really to recreate every spot in the room with thousands of IRs, even blending the in between spots to allow you to move freely in the room, as if you are the assistant engineer. Even with the Redwirez captures, which are set at specific distances from the cloth, they still have to decide which spot on the diameter of the speaker, speaking relatively from the center of the cone, they’re going to shoot. The outer left will sound different than the outer right.

And if you’re not shooting blindly and randomly in that context, you have to use your ears somewhere, and the pick, strings, pickups, and playing style are absolutely going to dominate there. Each one of those factors determines how the amp reacts, and what the sweet spot of the cabinets connected to that amp will be.

If you’re just picking the same spots on every cabinet without checking for sweet spot with a good guitarist and a good amp dialed in perfectly, you’re ignoring all the engineering that has printed great guitar tone to tape through recorded history. That’s why you have an engineer in a booth in front of the monitors listening while an assistant engineer, or a robot like the one Eric Valentine uses, moves the mic until you hit the sweet spot. Again, everything about the guitar and guitarist will determine that tone and where the sweet spot is. That’s the Magic an IR creator is trying to recreate.

But without using the ears (therefore having someone play through that cabinet), it’s like a mindless process: just place the mic gear and here, and you’re done.

 

[Chromatizm]

How else is the IR creator going to find the best spot to shoot the IR?

If you are talking about one guy sharing with you his favorite spot on his favorite cab, then yes.
If you are talking about most professional packs, like Two Notes, then each cab (speaker) is captured in literally thousands of mic placement points all across the speaker cone at different distances to allow you to select any point YOU need with any available mic you prefer.
So yeah, of you'd want to share with me your capture of your fav cab, then it has to do with your hands, instrument and ears.
For professional packs, like Ownhammer, the process is automated, pre-defined, etc. etc.

 

[State of Epicicity]

If you are talking about one guy sharing with you his favorite spot on his favorite cab, then yes.
If you are talking about most professional packs, like Two Notes, then each cab (speaker) is captured in literally thousands of mic placement points all across the speaker cone to allow you to select any point YOU need with any available MIC you prefer.
So yeah, of you'd want to share with me your capture of your fav cab, then it has to do with your hands, instrument and ears.
For professional packs, like Ownhammer, the process is automated, pre-defined, etc. etc.

Two Notes is different though; I don't know their technology inside and out, but it is much more like the MIKKO plugin that I described, and the reason I brought up the factors in finding a sweet spot is that the static IRs with fewer shots available seem to be what most people use. I love Two Notes' Wall of Sound, but there is something different going on there. I've tried to capture static IRs from their plugin before (to load to the Axe-FX III), and the IRs do not sound like the plugin at all, telling me there's extra processing going on, perhaps that an IR simply cannot hold (and I've done this with their preamp, comp, and other controls off, and with their mic in mono).

I'm looking at something like the Chop Tones essential packs, where they've shot an enormous number of IRs initially, but they release something like ten of them for these special packs. So they're choosing which ones, based on the sweet spots, but those sweet spots have to be determined by a guitar signal and an amp, each of which have so many variables.

And I'm not sure how each IR creator does this, if some just choose a spot that they assume is going to be great for every cab, like what you're saying Ownhammer does as an automated process unchanging per cabinet, but if that's the case, then it becomes a crapshoot, because the sweet spot on one cab can't be the same on another. I don't know what Ownhammer does specifically, and I only own their GNR cab pack, which I think is great, but in that, I think the reason they've included so many files (over 7,000) is in recognition that the sweet spot varies dependent on everything before the cab.

 

[Will Chen]

I don't use any 3rd party IRs, just the ones in the box. No need for me with the options available.

 

[Greg Ferguson]

Anyway, if you have a strong recommendation for a particular bundle, I'd love to hear it. Or if your opinion is that the Fractal included IRs are equally good, I'd love to hear that also.

Your best starting point is to audition the factory presets, which use factory cabinets exclusively. There are great sounds to be found in the amp and cab combinations. The factory cab list and amp list help identify recommended combinations.

Third party cabs are great also; I use a couple York cabs and have many thousands of cabs in about 15 different packs from Red Wirez and others that I’ve acquired from having bounced off different modelers prior to settling on my Fractals. I find though that the factory cabs are more than adequate for 90% of my needs, and are less hassle to work through than decompressing and scanning through all my third-party cabs.

 

[drnat]

If you're using Marshall style amps, it's pretty tough to beat the Ownhammer 412 MRBW GNR M25 MMMC bundle. After trying IR's from nearly everyone (and lots of them), this one just sound right. The GNR Chunk is just killer!!

I bought these when I was trying the Headrush, not loaded them onto the FM3 though - think I should do now….thanks

 

[Joe Bfstplk]

Dr. Bonkers has a good collection of 'not the same old same old' cabs. RedWirez has a few nice ones also, like the Weber BlueDog 12". I also have York, Ownhammer, and Mikko sets....

 

[State of Epicicity]

And I have to say it's worth it to try the Chop Tones essential packs. I just tried two myself (Bogie OS 412 Demon and Brit J2144 G12M), and they are free of perceptible room reflections, which is always cool to me; I was using them last night at Max length, not feeling the need to trim them at all. Not everyone goes in for that, but I like it really dry (that sentence just populated a dozen jokes in my head right away).

 

[Joe Bfstplk]

If you’re just picking the same spots on every cabinet without checking for sweet spot with a good guitarist and a good amp dialed in perfectly, you’re ignoring all the engineering that has printed great guitar tone to tape through recorded history. That’s why you have an engineer in a booth in front of the monitors listening while an assistant engineer, or a robot like the one Eric Valentine uses, moves the mic until you hit the sweet spot. Again, everything about the guitar and guitarist will determine that tone and where the sweet spot is. That’s the Magic an IR creator is trying to recreate.

I listen to the individual mics and have a handful of mic 'flavors' I like, as well as some I know I don't like, which speeds the selection. I will also give the pre-mixed ones a listen. I generally like an SM57, SM58, or similar dynamic mic, along with a ribbon of some stripe (121, 160, etc.) for my sound. If you like vanilla, chocolate, strawberry ice cream, and don't like garlic ice cream, it is no crime to skip the garlic....

 

[State of Epicicity]

I listen to the individual mics and have a handful of mic 'flavors' I like, as well as some I know I don't like, which speeds the selection. I will also give the pre-mixed ones a listen. I generally like an SM57, SM58, or similar dynamic mic, along with a ribbon of some stripe (121, 160, etc.) for my sound. If you like vanilla, chocolate, strawberry ice cream, and don't like garlic ice cream, it is no crime to skip the garlic....

The few tones I’ve heard from you are really something, just very dimensional and, to me, aspirational, so I’m glad to know how you think about it.

What I do is just very robotic haha:

Although I have an FC12 to my left, I also have a Logidy UMI3 to my right. I process the UMI3 through Bome MIDI Translator, which essentially gives you near limitless powers. For this purpose I created the most simple of translator presets to get the pedal to function as Up and Down arrows on the keyboard. I prefer the front panel of the Axe-FX III for most things, but for this I go to the Cab block in Axe-Edit, load Scratchpad 1, go into Manage, load whatever file folder I want to explore, select Auto-Audition, then use the UMI3 to scroll through IRs while I play. Since I like it dry (here come those silent jokes again), when I find one I like, I’ll bend some high note with Marty Friedman level wild vibrato to bring out any room sound to see if I want to trim or use Smoothing. Then, I’ll dial in the OD and amp to get the right character and finally add Proximity by adding too much, then fine tuning for the best Proximity Frequency, then dial it back to a decent supportive level. Then amp output EQ, if it really needs it.

I never think the flavors matter to me as much as if I had those mics in my hand.

 

[Joe Bfstplk]

The few tones I’ve heard from you are really something, just very dimensional and, to me, aspirational, so I’m glad to know how you think about it.

Thanks! I stopped, at some point, expecting one mic to 'do it all' and started mixing flavors. One has the high end, midrange presence, and sparkle I like but is a bit bass shy. One sounds a little woofy on its own, but a pinch of that fills in the other mic's gaps so it doesn't sound too thin. I suppose you can also work the other way 'round and find the low end punch you like and bring in a brighter mic to add some cut and sparkle. Maybe that is how the very few mixes I have liked with the Sennheiser 421 are constructed, since they have a bit of a spike in the highs that is a little grating in most if the single mic samples I've tried....

What I do is just very robotic haha:

Although I have an FC12 to my left, I also have a Logody UMI3 to my right. I process the UMI3 through Bome MIDI Translator, which essentially gives you near limitless powers. For this purpose I created the most simple of translator presets to get the pedal to function as Up and Down arrows on the keyboard. I prefer the front panel of the Axe-FX III for most things, but for this I go to the Cab block in Axe-Edit, load Scratchpad 1, go into Manage, load whatever file folder I want to explore, select Auto-Audition, then use the UMI3 to scroll through IRs while I play. Since I like it dry (here come those silent jokes again), when I find one I like, I’ll bend some high note with Marty Friedman level wild vibrato to bring out any room sound to see if I want to trim or use Smoothing. Then, I’ll dial in the OD and amp to get the right character and finally add Proximity by adding too much, then fine tuning for the best Proximity Frequency, then dial it back to a decent supportive level. Then amp output EQ, if it really needs it.

I never think the flavors matter to me as much as if I had those mics in my hand.

Your wokflow works, too. There are many different roads....

 

[Valhallir]

Well, I can only really speak to my perspective (obviously). I'm not really that interested in authenticity of the IR as much as how well it works sonically for my needs. Getting subjective impressions from those who have used various third party sellers was all I was looking for.

I imagine there are folks who are looking for an accurate emulation of a real world product, this just isn't me.

I suggest the free V2-teaserpack from www.valhallir.at
Pretty sure, you will find some stuff there you will like.

 

[laxu]

always intrigued me how often I read IR related conversations that center around which sellers' IRs sound "better" than others', but not so much discussion about which IRs sound most true to the character of the given cab / speaker / mic / micpre. I guess it could have to do with level of skill with the capture process or added "sauce" as I'm not sure that if brand A's IR sounds musically better to my ears than brand B, it necessarily means that the brand A IR is more accurate / "true".

We honestly don't really care about "authenticity" or "accuracy". When something sounds better to our ears it's often described as "more accurate" when it might have e.g. hyped bass, more volume or other aspects that make it sound more impressive to our easily fooled ears.

I think many agree with e.g. York Audio's ear in dialing multi-mic mixes and having someone do the hard work lets you, the IR pack buyer, get results you like faster.

I mostly use ML Sound Lab MIKKO because I can dial in my own mix (and enjoy Mikko's preset sounds as well) easily by moving mics around a virtual speaker. Makes IR mixing child's play. I see this as the future of cab sims and hope that Fractal offers something similar in their next gen products, whenever those might appear.

The only bad thing about ML Sound Lab is that they focus too much on the rock/metal speaker stuff so it's 95% 4x12s when I could use some 1x12s, 2x12s, 10" models etc.

 

[sprint]

The few tones I’ve heard from you are really something, just very dimensional and, to me, aspirational, so I’m glad to know how you think about it.

What I do is just very robotic haha:

Although I have an FC12 to my left, I also have a Logody UMI3 to my right. I process the UMI3 through Bome MIDI Translator, which essentially gives you near limitless powers. For this purpose I created the most simple of translator presets to get the pedal to function as Up and Down arrows on the keyboard. I prefer the front panel of the Axe-FX III for most things, but for this I go to the Cab block in Axe-Edit, load Scratchpad 1, go into Manage, load whatever file folder I want to explore, select Auto-Audition, then use the UMI3 to scroll through IRs while I play. Since I like it dry (here come those silent jokes again), when I find one I like, I’ll bend some high note with Marty Friedman level wild vibrato to bring out any room sound to see if I want to trim or use Smoothing. Then, I’ll dial in the OD and amp to get the right character and finally add Proximity by adding too much, then fine tuning for the best Proximity Frequency, then dial it back to a decent supportive level. Then amp output EQ, if it really needs it.

I never think the flavors matter to me as much as if I had those mics in my hand.

on Bome Midi Translator pro - I've been able to do a ton of cool stuff with that.