Will the Enhancer block be enhanced...

I think I've read somewhere that there's a doubling algorhythm in the new pitch block.
 
I wonder how the this new pitch block doubling effect compares to the TC Mimiq pedal. Or is it just like the old detune/micropitch shift effect?
 
If you guys haven't tried the TC mimiq stereo pedal, you need to. This is the best artificial double-tracking effect I've ever heard. Nothing else comes close to it, including member attempts I've heard here on the forum with the Axefx. Checkout 1:20 to 2:20 below. I've never heard the Axefx do this without the pedal.

 
The real test of a modulated delay doubler is to sum it to mono. The Mimiq fails, like all others. It sounds like one signal being delayed and modulated, not like two different signals. It's at least as good as any other I've heard, but it is no breakthrough. A fundamentally different approach will be needed.
 
steadystate said:
The real test of a modulated delay doubler is to sum it to mono. The Mimiq fails, like all others. It sounds like one signal being delayed and modulated, not like two different signals. It's at least as good as any other I've heard, but it is no breakthrough. A fundamentally different approach will be needed.
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Makes me really hope fractal is doing something innovative with that pitch block doubletracking
 
guitarfreak365 said:
Makes me really hope fractal is doing something innovative with that pitch block doubletracking
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I have my doubts as to whether it is possible with a modulated delay.

First of all, the attack of the double is identical to the original. Playing it back slightly slower or faster does not help. It's like a cheap electronic drum set that plays the same sample every time you hit the drum, but randomly shifts its pitch slightly each time you hit it. It sounds fake when you play a roll. You'd need to synthesize a different attack based on the original signal.

The decay suffers from the same problem, and always exhibits telltale comb filtering. Real double tracking does as well, but it is not the same. It is difficult to hear it as a hard comb filter.

Real double tracking also does not rely on time delay or on pitch modulation. If you record two real tracks super-tight (negligible time delay), you can still tell it is two guitars. And they will sound great in stereo and mono. These delay-based devices must add a delay time substantial enough to modulate in order to obtain a pitch bend. This delay produces the fake-sounding attack described above and the additional problem of needing to modulate the delay time to avoid a stationary comb filter and produce pitch shifts not present in double tracking. Neither guitar in a real double track modulates in pitch (at least while chording, and neglecting the tendency of the string to go sharp when plucked).

IMOHO, modulated delay alone will never produce a totally convincing double. It can and does sound great as an effect, separate from double tracking. But it is no replacement. I hope, one day, some enterprising individual changes the game with something totally new. I'd put my money on Fractal or Electro Harmonix. Funny, because they represent the top and the bottom of the market, respectively.

So there is my wish: a totally convincing doubler that does not as yet exist anywhere in the known universe. At least, to my feeble knowledge.
 
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Well, until that day, the TC Mimiq in stereo still sounds the least chorus or detune. It's the best fake one yet.
 
claxor said:
Well, until that day, the TC Mimiq in stereo still sounds the least chorus or detune. It's the best fake one yet.
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It is a good modulated delay doubler, no argument. I guess my posts are really in the wrong thread anyway, as the enhancer was never intended to be a doubler.
 
steadystate said:
It is a good modulated delay doubler, no argument. I guess my posts are really in the wrong thread anyway, as the enhancer was never intended to be a doubler.
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Hey man, I love the enhancer and the Mimiq for different uses. Enhancer is better to me for cleans, Mimiq better for classic thrash metal rhythms. Both are great tools for different uses.
 
I’ve owned the mimiq and it does work, sounds best with two different amps, in stereo, but there is a fundamental problem with it and any delay/pitch/attack type of doubling and that is they can only delay the effect after the intinial input.

When two players, or one player, lays down multiple takes, there is differences in timing, pitch etc, but those differences can be both early and late.

There is no way for an effect to produce a doubled sound before the original input produces one, it can only produce a second track with varying delay after the fact.

It can sound good, but it’s never going to sound as good as two players, or real layering of multiple takes

I ended up selling my miniq as it just didn’t sound good enough to me to be worth the trouble of dual amps and running stereo. I just use the enhancer these days which is pretty decent and easy to use.

If one wants dual guitar sounds, get a second guitarist, or do multiple takes at home or in the studio.
 
shemihazazel said:
I hadn't even heard of this pedal until now. Have you had a chance to use it yourself?
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Hi,

Sorry for answering lately. Yes I had the chance to use it and believe me or not I bought 3 of them :
The first one at the very beginning : I was so excited by the features, no other device on earth was doing the same thing. Result : it was cool but there was a big phase problem with the impression that in 3 guitars mode the panning of one guitar was constantly changing. You could clearly hear it with headphones. Moreover, when the new FW was released, I tried to load it but it failed. I returned it, bought a second one … same problem, had to send back the second one too.

I contacted TC Electronic to talk about the problem. I have about 10-15 emails from them. At first, they didn’t took it too seriously but when I sent them some samples (done with the Axe of course), it was clear. In fact, I could trigger le problem just changing the attack of the pick, the pan/phase problem could easily be heard. They send me (and some other guys having the same problem) the 1.2.00.1162 FW and the problem was still there. I had to buy a third Mimic Doubler just to try this and I had to send it back for the third time !!!

Don’t get me wrong, I know people who find this pedal great with 2 tube amps but with headphones with a surgical listening, it’s not professional at all.

Thomann (I bought 2 of my pedals from them) don’t sell this pedal anymore…

To finish : When I used dit in the loop of the Axe, I experienced a latency problem and when I replaced it with an Enhancer block, it was night and day : no latency, better result… but it’s not a dubbing

Having such a feature in the Axe FX III would be great, it would be the unique device to have it but finding a good algorithm IS NOT easy. A good challenge fot FAS.


PS : If you want to read me more about these problems with the Mimic Doubler pedal : http://forum.tcelectronic.com/topic/21012/problem-with-mimiq-doubler-pedal/
 
I was having no luck with this pedal that I was going to sell it, I could only use it in 1 mode if I used 2 or three I was getting phasing issues.
I tried running after the guitar to the rear input in stereo mode running through 2 separate amp and cabs
Finally I can use it in any mode perfect sound
 
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