Wide Stereo Field with Pitch Shifter - Question

Hi guys -
I just picked up my XL+/101 on Monday. I got impatient waiting for my AX8 invite and decided to take advantage of the holiday combo deal. So far so good - this thing is unbelievably configurable, and has all the tone I want and more. So after three days of playing, I have a question.

I usually like to have a patch or two with a really wide stereo field, and I used to do this with my GSP1101 by using a detune effect, shifting by -12 cents, and sending a dry signal to one channel, and the wet channel to the other. I've been experimenting with doing the same on my XL+. It works fine, and I like the results better than what I get with the enhancer or using a delay block. That said, I did have to experiment a bit - and it led to a question on the detune voices when in stereo input mode.

When the input mode is set to stereo, is voice 1 tied to the left channel input, and voice 2 tied to the right? I realize you can pan the voice itself to either side, but I've found that if I feed only a left signal into the block, voice 2 ignores it, and visa versa. Is this intended? I haven't found any real detail on the L/R dependency in the manual or Wiki.

Any thoughts?
Thanks!
RR
 
Yes, diagrams in manual match this description with L/R inputs feeding voices 1/2 separately.

If it was 2 fully stereo shifters, that would really be 4 voices and would probably cause a CPU increase over mono input mode, which isn't the case.
 
Yeah - I saw the diagram in the manual, and agree it looked like each channel had it's own voice. I just didn't see where they were labeled - ie L = V1, R = V2. Just wanted to make sure it was intended...

Thanks!
RR
 
Follow on question guys. When I set the mix to 100% wet, do I only get the 'newly created voices', or is the original signal still in there as well? I know 100% wet means 'only the processed signal', but what does that mean when it comes to the detune effect? Does processed mean a mix of detuned and original signal? Or is it just the detuned signal? If it's just the detuned signal and I'm only running one voice, shouldn't I get no beats or chorusing?

Thanks for your help with this!
RR
 
100% mix will be detuned signal only. You might just be hearing the chorusing between detune signal and the guitar acoustically. A delay could be used to test this. Or looper, although delay is easier for a simple test: 50% mix, 0% feedback, time 3-4 seconds or whatever length of phrases you feel like playing.
 
Thanks! I did a little more testing, and you are right. I get ONLY the detuned single voice. That's exactly what I wanted! So far so good. This magic box has me mesmerized! :)

RR
 
another thing to try is to detune left -7, and delay around 50s to 100ms, and detune right +7 and delay that too by something similar but not the same.. mix to around 20% and the dry single un-panned so it's straight up the middle..
if you get the values right you get the width but with a little more subtlety..
 
Thanks Clarky - another great idea. I've found about 10 different ways now to mess with the stereo field using anything from detune to delay, to cabs, to the enhancer, etc. It's amazing how flexible this thing is. So far, I think I like the sound of a detuned spread more than just delay. I had read somewhere that the trick to the lush stereo chorus of my JC120 was sending the dry signal down one side and the chorused signal down the other - so I've always had good luck emulating that.

Thanks again for the help!
RR
 
personally I prefer to use two different amps panned hard into a stereo cab with the cabs panned hard too..
left: 5153Red -> 4x12 TV mix
right: Herbert ch3 -> 4x12 AX mix
no is needed delay for widening
it sounds big because the tones themselves are similar enough to be of the same family, but different enough to be distinct

my lead tone though is the 5153Red into the same stereo cab with a pitch shifter with my settings as mentioned earlier [but without the delay settings - because I need the tightness to prevent smearing quicker licks]
 
another thing to try is to detune left -7, and delay around 50s to 100ms, and detune right +7 and delay that too by something similar but not the same.. mix to around 20% and the dry single un-panned so it's straight up the middle..
if you get the values right you get the width but with a little more subtlety..
Hello Clarky!! I am also interested in the configuration--have you got a preset that you could share that I could use as a
tempate? Much thanks!! (BTW I am running an XL model at current FW) :)
 
Pitch Detune is AWESOME....have always loved this effect....especially how Van Halen sounded with it.

I prefer to have the Pitch Detune PARALLEL and of course with mix 100% , -11,4 / +11,4 panned hard left & right....i used to do this also with my huge racks (SPX90) , playing W/D/W....now it can be done within the Axe :)

Stil think the Eventide H3000 Micro Pitch has something special too it :rolleyes:
 
Follow on question guys. When I set the mix to 100% wet, do I only get the 'newly created voices', or is the original signal still in there as well?
The mix control behaviour was actually changed several firmwares ago. Before that, the "mix" control gradually crossfaded between dry and wet signal. But in the current firmwares it works like this:
0-50%: 100% dry signal + (mix*2)% wet signal.
50-100%: (100-mix*2)% dry signal + 100% wet signal.

So basicly this means that if you want 100% dry AND 100% wet signal in a block, you have to set the mix to 50%, not 100%. If you only want the wet signal, set it to 100%.


I don't really know why they changed that. Probably because it's more convenient with low mix values on reverbs and delays, as you don't have to compensate for the loss in dry level when putting the blocks in series.
 
Hello Clarky!! I am also interested in the configuration--have you got a preset that you could share that I could use as a
tempate? Much thanks!! (BTW I am running an XL model at current FW) :)
ahhh…. couple of things… lol…
one is that my Axe is a MkI and I didn't think that MkI and XL could share presets…
the other is that my presets are quite a handful.. and to get them working properly you need to set up the MFC right..
I wrote a hug thread a while back that goes through the details how I experimented with the Axe's capabilities to end up with the setup I have today…
this page onwards describes in detail where I ended up:
http://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/axe2-preset-building.50243/page-34
not a thread for the faint of heart… cos I kinda ramble on a bit.. lmao..
 
ahhh…. couple of things… lol…
one is that my Axe is a MkI and I didn't think that MkI and XL could share presets…
the other is that my presets are quite a handful.. and to get them working properly you need to set up the MFC right..
I wrote a hug thread a while back that goes through the details how I experimented with the Axe's capabilities to end up with the setup I have today…
this page onwards describes in detail where I ended up:
http://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/axe2-preset-building.50243/page-34
not a thread for the faint of heart… cos I kinda ramble on a bit.. lmao..
Thanks Clarky!! I dream of the day that we are all equal (platform anyway)lol!!! Happy new Year!!
 
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