Which FRFR Solution?

[paulmapp8306]

Well - here it is.

Ive used an Art SLA-1 with my VHT cab for 8 months since I got my axe.

i have a Wharfedale powered PA and have tried FRFR through this - yes I know its not great quality, but Id never been convinced FRFR was for me.

Well - I havent played in the band for 3 months (various reasons) and have been rehersing/practicing to backing tracks. I think the Axe sounds better through the PA here though there is always a fight to get it just right - which I havent managed yet (again those wharfedales) but when I switch back to the amp/cab I feel unfullfilled. theres a lack of Bass, and too many mids.

im putting this down to the fact that when everything goes through a PA (so backing tracks, fully micd band) FRFR sounds better because this is hoe im used to hearing other bands and cds et. Im yet to be convinced that FRFR is any good in an "unmicd" band situaltion as the band sounds different to a CD as well as me !!

I am however willing to be convinced, and for those times I need to play to a BT or am fully mi'd I want a decent FRFR solution.

Problem - In in Northern Ireland and theres a lack of available options to try. I can get an FBT Verve 12ma, QSC HPR 122i or K12 no problem - but cant try them !!!

i have however tried an RFC Art 312a and 522a.

I am now convinced that FRFR is a way to go - It felt great playing through the monitiors.

heres the thing though. The 312 was OK - but I wasnt "oh yes". The 522 on the other hand was instantly "ohhh myy".

i couldnt find a 322 either which may be the middle ground.

Problem is prices !!

312 is £600 (for a single) which is OK - but after hearing the 522 I think Id regrett getting it.
522 is £1000 (best part of) which is really above my budget - definately for now.

No idea how much the 322 is - im guessing somewhere between the two which may be an option.

The Verve 12ma is £700, the K12 £770 and the 122i £820.

The K12 and 522 are lightweight. The 122i is heavey, the 312 and 322 sit about in the middle.

So - questions:

1. has anyone compared the QSC K12 with either the 312 or 522? How do they compare
2. Has anyone compared the 322 with the 312 or 522?
3. How does the 122i compare to either the K12, 322 or 522?

Im tempted to either buy the K12 blind - or try and save for the 522. theres no garentee that Ill reach the goal though with a wife and 2 kids !! I have £600 now though that I could spend - and hopefully another £200 next month.

Any help here would be really helpfull - I know a lot is "personal" but I need som e direction.

 

[paulmapp8306]

OK - just spoke to a PA guy in the UK.

He sells RCF, QSC, FBT, HK, DAS, and others.

His thoughts are:

1. the bigger compression drivers are better for my application - because it allows the X-Over to be lowered putting more high mids through the driver. This gives more power for the main drivers for a better bass response and smooths the trebble making it less harsh.

2. The 522s are pretty much gone - with the 7 series taking its place, at the same price.

3. The 322s are OK, but the 712s are slightly better - despite the smaller driver. The 712s come in at £740, the 322s at £650.

4. His thoughts are that for my use (he knows about the Axe) the K12 are probably the best solution. you get the same features and quality - and small weight - that the 7 series RCFs have, but cheaper. The 1.75" compression driver makes it better than the similarly priced 712s with their 1". the 322s arnt quite as good - but are cheaper at £650.

if I could stretch to £950 - the RFC 722as would be the best option of all - but I cant go that high.

The FBT 12ma's are pretty good too. Being a monitor I wouldnt be able to "up scale" to a full PA (which I want to do at a later date). There are nowhere near as loud (123 db - 722s 130 db, K2 131 db) but are probably JUST better sound quality. thats because of the amp. Both the K12s and RCF 5 and 7 series are digital amps. This makes them a little "digital" sounding in the trebble - the FBTs arnt (apparently). HOWEVER, while this is a consideration for vocals, the frequencies we use as guitarists wont effect the sound at all.

The HPR 122i is good too. The amp is better - more natural sounding but its a lot heavier. the K12s for guitar use are JUST as good (the better sounding freqs being way above what we use). The RFC 722s are better sounding - more natural again - than the 122s.

The upshot is, If I dont need it REALLY LOUD, and am OK with a propper monitor rather than a PA top, the FBT 12mas are probably the choice. If I want to use it as backline, or as part of a PA later, the K12s are the way forward. IF however I could find the extra cash - the RFC 722s would be the ultimate (without spendig MUCH more).

So, unless I find some money Im not expecting in the next 6 weeks (Im off on holls !!) its the K12s for me I think.

 

[9-Pin]

I have a K-10 and I can see how you would be very happy if you go that direction. One thing that is nice is all of the different input/output options on the K-series.

granted, I haven't compared mine against any others.

Best of luck.

 

[Rocket Brother]

I´m interested in this subject as well, as I´m about to make a FRFR rig for myself.
I tried the QSC 122i with an iPod once when I didn´t have my Axe Fx with me and thought that it was the first FRFR I had tried apart from a very expensive Meyer Sounds that I thought had the sound quality needed to make my Ultra + FRFR an option against my normal rig. I´ve tried the FBT Maxx series 4a+2a and found them to be utterly lacking in sound quality.
I haven´t tried any of the options you mention with the Axe Fx yet, but from the numerous posts about this subject, I get the impression that many greatly preferre the sound and dispertion of the sweetspot from the Verve serie and that people get more than enough volume from a 12ma to keep up with a 4x12" stack even in loud rock bands. Do you need more volume than that?
best
RB

 

[Chad]

Hadn't heard of the RCF ART 722-A until I read this thread. As a 322-A user, I'm interested. I looked at the RCF website and it appears to be a winner, but from what I can tell pricing is rather high compared to other AxeFX FRFR solutions.