When scene switching isn’t fast enough…..

[dsouza]

If you’re recording to backing track and you have to go from scene 4 to 5 in a 1/4 second WHILE playing 4-5 notes into a lead solo what would you do?


My only guess is to scene switch a half second earlier but that throws off the sounds and effects.

Anyone take any supplements or legalized cognitive drugs that keep you 4-5 steps ahead at all times , with improved focus, memory, ability to multitask, deal with distractions etc?

And remember under the pressure of a gig there is all kinds of external stimuli distracting you further.

 

[chris]

what?

when recording, most will do separate tracks for each part. record the part up till the solo. then stop. then start a new track and record just the solo.

live, many stop playing just before the solo, change sounds, then go into the solo. or they don't stop playing, press the switch just before the tone change, and play the solo. it shouldn't be too complicated. change the sound before you need a different sound.

even analog rigs aren't instant. i've heard my guitar heroes with the best gear do exactly what i described.

 

[GlennO]

If it's too much to juggle that and your playing, do what everybody else does: automate your switching in a DAW.

 

[dsouza]

If it's too much to juggle that and your playing, do what everybody else does: automate your switching in a DAW.

You mean MIDI?

 

[GlennO]

I foresee some manual reading in your future .

 

[dsouza]

what?

when recording, most will do separate tracks for each part. record the part up till the solo. then stop. then start a new track and record just the solo.

live, many stop playing just before the solo, change sounds, then go into the solo. or they don't stop playing, press the switch just before the tone change, and play the solo. it shouldn't be too complicated. change the sound before you need a different sound.

even analog rigs aren't instant. i've heard my guitar heroes with the best gear do exactly what i described.

@chris
@GlennO

Yes your advice works playing with my AX8 live by itself (which is what I may have to settle for given my predicament).

But with a LIVE backing track in a gig venue or a live band you’re at their mercy to keep up.

I always wondered if the AX8 could be programmed by midi to scene switch automatically at given split second intervals for complex live songs?

In a live performance I may have 20-30 songs. If many have 5-8 scenes it gets complex to remember under pressure (like a gig), especially if the songs are being played at lightning speeds as your switching scenes manually. Slow songs are easy of course and your brain and reaction time don't have to be as fast.

You think The Edge from U2 stands on stage hitting switches on his floorboard? He has everything controlled by midi. It's probably the same reason why I brought it up. Scene switching many songs , especially fast ones, or complex ones becomes difficult to coordinate under pressure. Add a roaring crowd, dim lighting, distractions from the audience and you may miss your cue to scene change on time throwing the whole performance off.

 

[chris]

with a LIVE backing track in a gig venue or a live band you’re at their mercy to keep up.

practice?

In a live performance I may have 20-30 songs. If many have 5-8 scenes it gets complex to remember under pressure (like a gig), especially if the songs are being played at lightning speeds as your switching scenes manually. Slow songs are easy of course and your brain and reaction time don't have to be as fast.

i play 40+ songs a night out of 500+ songs in my list when i gig, sometimes more. thousands of people around the world do too. we all change our guitar sounds as needed. you aren't the first to have to do this.

You think The Edge from U2 stands on stage hitting switches on his floorboard?

before MIDI sequencers could change pedals for us? yes.

Scene switching many songs , especially fast ones, or complex ones becomes difficult to coordinate under pressure.

yes. it's why we practice. people have been changing tones live, on stage for decades.

Add a roaring crowd, dim lighting, distractions from the audience and you may miss your cue to scene change on time throwing the whole performance off.

practice.

 

[JoKeR III]

Not trying to be snarky, but if you can't find a place to switch scenes smoothly in a song you're probably overplaying. Any song I've played has had some point where there is space to switch scenes or engage/bypass a Control Switch going into different song sections. There's no special trick, just be familiar enough with the song to know where these points are.

Some songs may take a bit of practice to determine the best place to make the change, but there will always be one. If you're trying to cover multiple guitar parts of a recording with one guitar, adapt your playing to accommodate them. If you must have certain guitar parts overlap when using only one guitar live, using backing tracks is a necessity.

I always encourage my team to "own" the song. Practice to the point where you can go through the entire song in your head and play along with it, making no mistakes without any audio aid. This creates freedom in your playing when there is no real thought about the song format or what notes/chords to play. You are able to anticipate each section and progression to the point that it becomes instinct.

 

[Bakerman]

 

[Moke]

My band uses backing tracks in almost half of our set. In each one of the songs that uses tracks, I also have a midi track to change scenes for me throughout the song. It took a while to set it all up and get the timing of the changes just right, but I love it. I even have some expression pedal automation going on too.

If I were doing a one man show to backing tracks, I would have the whole show automated for sure. You could even sync up some video and lights if you wanted to. Automate effects and/or a harmonizer on your vocals. Automate a tablet to display lyrics in sync with each song, etc...

 

[chris]

Yo did the Edge just press a pedal just before the downbeat

 

[Moke]

@dsouza Since you mentioned an AX8. Did you know that if you are not using the 'X/Y' function on the switches, you can disable it in the global menus. Now your scenes will switch when you tap the switches, instead of when you release them. Much easier to time the scene changes.

 

[dsouza]

@dsouza Since you mentioned an AX8. Did you know that if you are not using the 'X/Y' function on the switches, you can disable it in the global menus. Now your scenes will switch when you tap the switches, instead of when you release them. Much easier to time the scene changes.

Thanks Moke. You're work is truly inspirational here on the forums as is your support.

Ideally I'd like to take full advantage of my equipment and if that includes automation why the hell not? Why wouldn't someone who plans to perform every week for years to come rely on manual labour constantly? It makes no sense.

If you have the ability to automate your tasks it's more efficient to do so, so your brain can concentrate on the big picture instead. Which is playing music that sounds great!

I know my friend Edo who does the U2 presets told me his concerts are all automated the way he talks to the crowd. He's got a plan of attack for everything instead of thinking from scratch each time he heads out. In between his setlists he conducts stories and speeches, thank you's etc. It's all part of the act.

While some may say automation is a cop out from real practice I don't believe it necessarily is a substitute for real practice it just makes real practice go smoother. The smoother the show the more demand for you , the more money you make, and the happier one would be.

Just my $0.02.

 

[dsouza]

Not trying to be snarky, but if you can't find a place to switch scenes smoothly in a song you're probably overplaying. Any song I've played has had some point where there is space to switch scenes or engage/bypass a Control Switch going into different song sections. There's no special trick, just be familiar enough with the song to know where these points are.

Some songs may take a bit of practice to determine the best place to make the change, but there will always be one. If you're trying to cover multiple guitar parts of a recording with one guitar, adapt your playing to accommodate them. If you must have certain guitar parts overlap when using only one guitar live, using backing tracks is a necessity.

I always encourage my team to "own" the song. Practice to the point where you can go through the entire song in your head and play along with it, making no mistakes without any audio aid. This creates freedom in your playing when there is no real thought about the song format or what notes/chords to play. You are able to anticipate each section and progression to the point that it becomes instinct.

This is true... I haven't technically mastered the song I'm playing as if I know it in my sleep from thousands of repetitions.

So I don't OWN it yet. To some extent I agree practice is the most important quality to success, but along the lineside of practicing until your consciously competent, the best player's use tricks up their sleeves to beat out the competition. If you think of the Edge he kept his delay pedal techniques a hidden secret during the 70's , 80's, and 90's when U2 blew up the scene. Only in the recent decade has most of his secrets come out.

I would say play until you can hear the whole song on guitar in your head and visualize every footswitch movement etc. Kinda like see yourself from a bird's eye view as if you're dreaming and can absorb it all.

If there's hesitation at any point you know you have a quirk you've got to iron out before you can be 100% confident.

Just curious do you think playing with backing tracks causes one to forget portions of the songs when they play alone w/o BT? The reason I say this is because with BT's you have some cue's at times... And you can tell by the rhythm if a section is continuing or coming to an end. Without a BT you have none of this and have to rely on muscle memory and your own ability to recall everything.

What are your views on using BT's during recording and live gigs?

 

[dsouza]

@dsouza Since you mentioned an AX8. Did you know that if you are not using the 'X/Y' function on the switches, you can disable it in the global menus. Now your scenes will switch when you tap the switches, instead of when you release them. Much easier to time the scene changes.

I have my X/Y switches set to on. Yeah I'm going to change them to off as I never use them and see if it buys me an extra half second.

 

[pauly]

Just record 2 tracks - One with sound 1, and one with sound 2. Then cut the tracks at the appropriate point, and delete the parts you dont want. Done.

If you’re recording to backing track and you have to go from scene 4 to 5 in a 1/4 second WHILE playing 4-5 notes into a lead solo what would you do?


My only guess is to scene switch a half second earlier but that throws off the sounds and effects.

Anyone take any supplements or legalized cognitive drugs that keep you 4-5 steps ahead at all times , with improved focus, memory, ability to multitask, deal with distractions etc?

And remember under the pressure of a gig there is all kinds of external stimuli distracting you further.

 

[chris]

What some may not think about is being good at the ability to play guitar with your hands while stepping on a switch with your foot. This is worth practicing even if the switch doesn’t do anything.

I’ve known people who have to stop their hands so they’re able to step on a switch, and can’t do them both at the same time. It’s a skill like any other physical skill in any industry and may take some practice.

 

[JoKeR III]

What are your views on using BT's during recording and live gigs?

We use them all of the time but as support for the band, not to replace instruments. If it's not on the stage, we don't have it in the backing tracks. I really don't pay much attention to them while playing, I'm more into the song and the moment.

If you're a solo act, there's probably a little more grace for using other instruments in the backing tracks. Depends upon the scenario and what you as an artist are trying to create for your audience. Any attempt to fool the audience wouldn't sit well with me personally, it's akin to lip-syncing.

 

[dsouza]

Any attempt to fool the audience wouldn't sit well with me personally, it's akin to lip-syncing.

At what point does a BT fool people, and when doesn't it?

 

[dsouza]

What some may not think about is being good at the ability to play guitar with your hands while stepping on a switch with your foot. This is worth practicing even if the switch doesn’t do anything.

I’ve known people who have to stop their hands so they’re able to step on a switch, and can’t do them both at the same time. It’s a skill like any other physical skill in any industry and may take some practice.

I have this problem right now. I pause playing for a split second , especially if it's complex like a lead instead of a chord ringing out, while I tap a switch. I think some people are better at multitasking than others. I guess that's something to actually practice as part of a daily routine!