Hi y'all, I am in the process of mixing my massive stash of OwnHammer IRs for my FM3's User Cab Bank. Before before I go all in and make 1,024 IRs, I want to make sure I'm understanding these two steps correctly, so that I don't have to repeat this process. Yes, I have read a ton on this already, but it seems that my specific concerns about methodology and when to apply certain steps haven't been sufficiently addressed.
I. Min Phase (MPT)
In Cab Lab, my current methodology is:
1) Create "Single Speaker + Aux" (SS+Aux) IR consisting of:
1a) (Raw/Non-MPT) OH1, OH1F, or OH2 (#'s 01,03,05,07,09) file @ 0.0 dB
1b) add (Raw/Non-MPT) Room & Mid each at @ -12.0 dB
1c) add (Raw/Non-MPT) Rear at @ -15.0dB
2) Export SS+Aux IR .SYX & .IR files
3) Create a "Speaker A + Speaker B" (A+B) mix of two SS+Aux IRs from the same OH cab pack.
3a) Speaker A @ 0.0 dB
3b) Speaker B @ 0.0 dB (occasionally @ -3.0 dB)
4) Export Speaker A+B Mix .SYX & .IR files.
5) Load SS+A IRs & A+B mix IRs into FM3.
Questions:
-When do I apply MPT? During Step #1? Step #2? Step #3? During Steps #1+#2? #2+#3? #1+#2+#3? etc..
-Is it possible to overapply MPT/Min Phase? Or would it just be redundant/cancel itself out if I did it during steps #1+#2+#3?
-When loading IRs into the FM3 Cab Bank, which have had MPT applied in Cab Lab, should I set the Cabinet Import IR Processing to "None" or "Min Phase"?
Should the work flow be:
6) "Min Phase->None->None"
a) Load Raw/Non-MPT in Cab Lab -> Processing Mode = "Min Phase" -> export SS+Aux IR
b) -> reload SS+Aux IR's -> Processing Mode = "None" -> export A+B IR
c) FM3 Cabinet Import Processing "None" -> Import new IRs
or
7) "None->Min Phase->None"
a) Load Raw/Non-MPT in Cab Lab -> Processing Mode = "None" -> export SS+Aux IR
b) -> reload SS+Aux IR's -> Processing Mode = "Min Phase" -> export A+B IR
c) FM3 Cabinet Import Processing "None" -> Import new IRs
or
8) "None->None->Min Phase"
a) Load Raw/Non-MPT in Cab Lab -> Processing Mode = "None" -> export SS+Aux IR
b) -> reload SS+Aux IR's -> Processing Mode = "None" -> export A+B IR
c) FM3 Cabinet Import Processing "Min Phase" -> Import new IRs
Side Question
I read another user speaking about mixing the Room IR, stating that since the Room IR isn't near-field, that it should be mixed in it's raw/non-MPT state with MPT versions of the near-field IRs. Is this true? If so, how/when would I apply MPT in this process?
II. HPF + LPF & Low Cut + Hi Cut
-Are the High Pass (HPF) and Low Pass (LPF) Filters equivalent to the Cab Blocks Low & High Cuts? If not, differences? What is the slope of the HPF & LPF?
-Is the main benefit of the HPF & LPF that you can "bake in" your Low & High Cuts into the IR, thus allowing the user to not have to use the Low & High Cuts and can keep them at the default values of 20Hz & 20kHz?
-Is it redundant, harmful, or beneficial to use the HPF & LPF and Low & High Cuts simultaneously?
-Or is this an "Either / Or" scenario?
---I've experimented with this some and there does seem to be slight differences:
ex) a) Apply HPF & LPF of 100Hz & 7.5Hz in Cab Lab -> Import to FM3 -> Load into Cab Block with Low & High Cuts of 20Hz & 20kHz
b) Take the same IR but with HPF & LPF of 20Hz & 20kHz -> load into Cab Block with Low & High Cuts of 100Hz & 7.5kHz.
Result: they sound slightly different.
-If one were to apply both HPF & LPF and Low & High Cuts, Should:
c) The HPF & LPF be "tighter" (ex. 100Hz & 7.5kHz) and the Low & High Cuts "looser" (ex. 50Hz & 15kHz)?
or
d) The HPF & LPF be "looser" (ex. 50Hz & 15kHz) and the Low & High Cuts "tighter" (ex. 10Hz & 7.5kHz)?
or
e) use either Cab Lab's HPF & LPF or the Cab Blocks Low & High Cuts, but not both?
---Of c) or d), I'm guessing that d) would be the better practice. Since (I'm assuming) the IR file (and it's contained HPF & LPF) is in the signal path before the Cab Blocks Low & High Cuts, it would have the primarily influence on shaping the tone. By keeping the HPF & LPF "looser" (ex. 50Hz & 15kHz), you're just doing some edge trimming rather than lawn mowing/tree removal. By going the "looser" route, it would still allow you to utilize the Cab Blocks Low & High Cuts more so than you could with the "tighter" approach. This is all assuming there are no negative consequences of layering differing or equal values for the HPF & LPF and Low & High Cuts...
Thanks for y'alls wisdom and guidance. Even after 5 months with the FM3, I'm still a total noob!
(Mods, if this needs to be transferred to Cab-Lab Products sub forum, so be it. I posted it in User Cabs & IRs as there is a LOT more traffic over here.)
I. Min Phase (MPT)
In Cab Lab, my current methodology is:
1) Create "Single Speaker + Aux" (SS+Aux) IR consisting of:
1a) (Raw/Non-MPT) OH1, OH1F, or OH2 (#'s 01,03,05,07,09) file @ 0.0 dB
1b) add (Raw/Non-MPT) Room & Mid each at @ -12.0 dB
1c) add (Raw/Non-MPT) Rear at @ -15.0dB
2) Export SS+Aux IR .SYX & .IR files
3) Create a "Speaker A + Speaker B" (A+B) mix of two SS+Aux IRs from the same OH cab pack.
3a) Speaker A @ 0.0 dB
3b) Speaker B @ 0.0 dB (occasionally @ -3.0 dB)
4) Export Speaker A+B Mix .SYX & .IR files.
5) Load SS+A IRs & A+B mix IRs into FM3.
Questions:
-When do I apply MPT? During Step #1? Step #2? Step #3? During Steps #1+#2? #2+#3? #1+#2+#3? etc..
-Is it possible to overapply MPT/Min Phase? Or would it just be redundant/cancel itself out if I did it during steps #1+#2+#3?
-When loading IRs into the FM3 Cab Bank, which have had MPT applied in Cab Lab, should I set the Cabinet Import IR Processing to "None" or "Min Phase"?
Should the work flow be:
6) "Min Phase->None->None"
a) Load Raw/Non-MPT in Cab Lab -> Processing Mode = "Min Phase" -> export SS+Aux IR
b) -> reload SS+Aux IR's -> Processing Mode = "None" -> export A+B IR
c) FM3 Cabinet Import Processing "None" -> Import new IRs
or
7) "None->Min Phase->None"
a) Load Raw/Non-MPT in Cab Lab -> Processing Mode = "None" -> export SS+Aux IR
b) -> reload SS+Aux IR's -> Processing Mode = "Min Phase" -> export A+B IR
c) FM3 Cabinet Import Processing "None" -> Import new IRs
or
8) "None->None->Min Phase"
a) Load Raw/Non-MPT in Cab Lab -> Processing Mode = "None" -> export SS+Aux IR
b) -> reload SS+Aux IR's -> Processing Mode = "None" -> export A+B IR
c) FM3 Cabinet Import Processing "Min Phase" -> Import new IRs
Side Question
I read another user speaking about mixing the Room IR, stating that since the Room IR isn't near-field, that it should be mixed in it's raw/non-MPT state with MPT versions of the near-field IRs. Is this true? If so, how/when would I apply MPT in this process?
II. HPF + LPF & Low Cut + Hi Cut
-Are the High Pass (HPF) and Low Pass (LPF) Filters equivalent to the Cab Blocks Low & High Cuts? If not, differences? What is the slope of the HPF & LPF?
-Is the main benefit of the HPF & LPF that you can "bake in" your Low & High Cuts into the IR, thus allowing the user to not have to use the Low & High Cuts and can keep them at the default values of 20Hz & 20kHz?
-Is it redundant, harmful, or beneficial to use the HPF & LPF and Low & High Cuts simultaneously?
-Or is this an "Either / Or" scenario?
---I've experimented with this some and there does seem to be slight differences:
ex) a) Apply HPF & LPF of 100Hz & 7.5Hz in Cab Lab -> Import to FM3 -> Load into Cab Block with Low & High Cuts of 20Hz & 20kHz
b) Take the same IR but with HPF & LPF of 20Hz & 20kHz -> load into Cab Block with Low & High Cuts of 100Hz & 7.5kHz.
Result: they sound slightly different.
-If one were to apply both HPF & LPF and Low & High Cuts, Should:
c) The HPF & LPF be "tighter" (ex. 100Hz & 7.5kHz) and the Low & High Cuts "looser" (ex. 50Hz & 15kHz)?
or
d) The HPF & LPF be "looser" (ex. 50Hz & 15kHz) and the Low & High Cuts "tighter" (ex. 10Hz & 7.5kHz)?
or
e) use either Cab Lab's HPF & LPF or the Cab Blocks Low & High Cuts, but not both?
---Of c) or d), I'm guessing that d) would be the better practice. Since (I'm assuming) the IR file (and it's contained HPF & LPF) is in the signal path before the Cab Blocks Low & High Cuts, it would have the primarily influence on shaping the tone. By keeping the HPF & LPF "looser" (ex. 50Hz & 15kHz), you're just doing some edge trimming rather than lawn mowing/tree removal. By going the "looser" route, it would still allow you to utilize the Cab Blocks Low & High Cuts more so than you could with the "tighter" approach. This is all assuming there are no negative consequences of layering differing or equal values for the HPF & LPF and Low & High Cuts...
Thanks for y'alls wisdom and guidance. Even after 5 months with the FM3, I'm still a total noob!
(Mods, if this needs to be transferred to Cab-Lab Products sub forum, so be it. I posted it in User Cabs & IRs as there is a LOT more traffic over here.)