What's out there?

gearjunkie

gearjunkie

Inspired
just curious as to what other bass modelling units are out there that are good? (or decent) I don't keep up with these things any more. I would go back to the BDDI or the Bass VT DI but I'd really prefer to have something with at least a decent bass compressor built in. I don't use effects on bass, I just look for a good core bass tone with a little gain control. I was just thinking last evening about this and started wondering what's available these days.
 
What's your budget? Are cabinet simulations necessary for full range applications?

edit: a simple exercise - just go to a major online vendor of music gear and do searches for "bass preamp pedal" and "bass compressor pedal". You'll find there is some overlap between the two, where some preamp pedals also feature compression, and where some compressor pedals also feature tone shaping and preamp capabilities.

IMHO, if you really know exactly what you want for tone, the you'll get a much better result with two discrete pedals: one for the preamp, one for the compressor. For bass, the ability to have a compressor with broad, bass-specific parameters such as wet/dry MIX, multi-band with crossover point, attack, release, meters, etc., are only going to be found in a discrete compressor pedal.

If you have a budget around $600 max, you should do very well for yourself in terms of preamp + comp. Really, very good quality pedals and tones to be had there.

OTOH, if you have the budget to step up to devices like the Fractal AX8 or Line 6 Helix, you really can't argue with the vast capabilities of these units, even if ONLY for preamp and compression. You really get a lot of function from these pedals, and likely, you'll never need to get much of anything else for all of your front end needs. Lots of this is subjective and depends on other considerations, so of course YMMV.
 
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G'day Junkie,

After trying for ages with our favourite guitar modeller, I gave up on it. So - I needed something for the bass. SO.. One day I bought an Aguillar, Sansamp, Eden, and Darrkglass unit, to compare them all for what I wanted with bass. I also bought a neve DI, so that with whatever unit I chose, I could also record a good dry channel at the same time. I spent the next week just mucking around with them - nothing scientific mind you - Just playing bass and enjoying the units.
For me (And I don't want any distortion or effects etc - Just a kicking bass sound), the Darkglass BK7 was a clear winner. I stress 'For Me'... for others it may be different but I found the Darkglass gave the closest thing to the Growling sound I was after (and basically unobtainable in the other units except perhaps the Sansamp Tech 21 to an extent), along with most other types of tone I could imagine myself wanting.
A very good unit.
So... I sold the others on ebay, and lost a stack of money which I put down to the cost of getting a bass solution.

Thanks
Pauly


gearjunkie said:
just curious as to what other bass modelling units are out there that are good? (or decent) I don't keep up with these things any more. I would go back to the BDDI or the Bass VT DI but I'd really prefer to have something with at least a decent bass compressor built in. I don't use effects on bass, I just look for a good core bass tone with a little gain control. I was just thinking last evening about this and started wondering what's available these days.
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Thanks for the replies guys. I've logged some long hours on YouTube over the last while. I know there are tons of issues with YouTube vids but I find at the least if I hear what I'm looking for then at least I know what units to try. I really wasn't looking to spend a boat load again. Not for bass anyway. I pretty much look for a specific bass tone and that's it. I just want to plug in direct and record. I was thinking max $200-$300. I checked out the Helix, pod X3, fly rig etc tons of stuff and while I'm sure it's probably in there I wasn't hearing it. I did consider a separate bass compressor with a preamp but I didn't look at that much at all. That would be the option if I went back to the sansamp. Now I've spent some time looking at vids for the dark glass last year and it seems like a decent unit but all you ever see it used for is the new "Grindy" metal bass tone and that's not my cup of tea. Sits great in a mix though. I've yet to hear its core bass tone without a ton of gain. There's just a certain punch that I've heard from the recorded bass tones I love and I got that type of powerful clean/slightly driven punch with the sansamp. It always had a clear defined low end balanced with a clear defined high end. I'd like to try the new VT bass DI because I was running into some limitations with the original (and I suspect the Spector bass I have was maybe a little too hot with the original BDDI) interestingly enough I watched one vid over and over and honestly I thought it sounded spectacular. It was of the original bass pod (the black kidney bean from line 6) not the newer versions (XL, XT, X3 etc) I had a pod back in the day lol I'm sure the feel isn't there but that bass tone sure was (even on YouTube...)
 
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And I hear you pauly I've had some alright sounds on "our favourite modeller" but something is missing. Something just isn't "right" I don't know what it is, and I'm no tweaking pro. If the experts can't get it, then I sure as hell won't!!!
 
it's cool to keep it simple, and use the gear that you know can give you what you want, and then just get on with your business. I will say that the compression aspect can be an important one for bass, and this is a whole topic unto itself.
 
Hey jimfist, what's your experience been with straight up bass compressors in the stomp box format? I've never tried one. I don't think I've ever used a decent compressor on bass. Mostly low end plugins and compressors for guitar. I've had a ton of gear over the years, with guitar I like a lot of options and variety but I'm pretty minimalist with bass I basically gravitate to an old school clean/slightly driven grunt that's basically a "workhorse" tone
 
gearjunkie said:
Now I've spent some time looking at vids for the dark glass last year and it seems like a decent unit but all you ever see it used for is the new "Grindy" metal bass tone and that's not my cup of tea. Sits great in a mix though. I've yet to hear its core bass tone without a ton of gain.
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I was looking at getting one of these two eventually, I felt like these demos covered a lot of ground - granted they aren't DIs but mic'd cabinets.

EDIT: This video appears to be DI.

 
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gearjunkie said:
... I'd really prefer to have something with at least a decent bass compressor built in.
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What's the difference between a bass compressor and other compressors? Compression is a pretty straightforward process. For instance, if you look at the Axe's Studio Compressor, there's nothing in there that makes it a guitar compressor. It's equally suitable to bass, piano, violin, drums...
 
gearjunkie said:
Hey jimfist, what's your experience been with straight up bass compressors in the stomp box format? I've never tried one. I don't think I've ever used a decent compressor on bass. Mostly low end plugins and compressors for guitar. I've had a ton of gear over the years, with guitar I like a lot of options and variety but I'm pretty minimalist with bass I basically gravitate to an old school clean/slightly driven grunt that's basically a "workhorse" tone
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There's an excellent web page that reviews almost every compressor rack or stomp unit known to mankind, and it's a good read if you have the time to wade through it: www.ovnilab.com You may want to start with their TOP PICKS: http://www.ovnilab.com/reviews/toppicks.shtml

Personally, I've mostly used rack units for bass compression:

dbx 160x
dbx 163x (one knob squeezer)
Empirical Labs EL8 Distressor (this compressor has spoiled me for almost anything else other than studio grade high end comps)

Currently, I have dabbled with the TC Electronic SpectraComp, which is IMHO a neat little $99 pedal, but a quirky beast for sure. Some bassists have had great luck with it by selecting a TonePrint they like and keeping it really simple via the one-knob operation. Others, like myself, have been fascinated by the fact that it's a true 3 band (lo/mid/hi) multi-band compressor, fully editable and programmable via software, with a TON of available parameters, 3 of which are assignable to the hardware knob on the device. Simple, yet very complex. Quirky.

If you're looking for a compressor to simply lop off some of the jagged edges of the bass sound (IOW, mild compression), then you probably can make most anything work, with a few exceptions, of course. Your style of playing and the even-ness of tone you produce on your instrument also has a lot to do with how much compression you really need.

Personally, my playing style and preferences are specific and perhaps demanding, looking for more than just simple broadband compression. As mentioned above, for years I used the EL8 Distressor, and chose to solve the problems I had by throwing money at it with a studio grade compressor, and yes, it worked GREAT for me. Loved it.

For bass in particular, I tend to favor a pedal compressor that has one or both of the following features:

- parallel blending (aka wet/dry mix, to help preserve low end and dynamics with higher levels of compression)
- multiband compression (literally, a separate compressor for each tone region, at minimum a low and a high band)

Hope this helps.
 
Rex said:
What's the difference between a bass compressor and other compressors? Compression is a pretty straightforward process. For instance, if you look at the Axe's Studio Compressor, there's nothing in there that makes it a guitar compressor. It's equally suitable to bass, piano, violin, drums...
Click to expand...

Compressor "flavors" and features, and ultimately the sounds produced from them, are every bit as picky and varied as there are guitars and guitar amps. This is not to say that the FAS compressor offerings are not worthy, but from where I'm standing, "suitable" is in the eyes - or EARS - of the beholder. Apologies.
 
Rex said:
What's the difference between a bass compressor and other compressors? Compression is a pretty straightforward process. For instance, if you look at the Axe's Studio Compressor, there's nothing in there that makes it a guitar compressor. It's equally suitable to bass, piano, violin, drums...
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Pretty much any compressor that is of good quality will generally work well with bass. Jimfist already touched on the finer points of it - which I think we can all agree are valid.

With that said, I've had a lot of issues with the Axe-Fx compressor when using it with any of my basses (Dingwalls, EBMMs, NS Design upright, acoustics with piezo and mic pickups, ESPs, G&L, and so on). I've even enlisted help from some serious smart folks to help and it's never been quite right.
 
I concur with this. ^^^^ Getting precisely what I'm after with bass compression in the AxeFx has been dodgy, close, in the ballpark, but same as with the bass amp & cab modeling, never fully nailed it. Got some very nice tones, though, even if not 100% what my mind's ear is wanting to hear,
 
I'm surprised more effort isn't put into bass units, both stand-alone and modelers. The market seems to be there, and it appears that (at the very least) bassists know what doesn't work for them. I like the guitar FlyRig, and would like to try the Bass version with my Stingray. I have the Bass VT Deluxe from Tech21, and it does a pretty decent job on old Ampeg sort of tones. No compressor, though. The Tech21 stuff has been great for <$300 gear.

I'm just a guitarist who likes to mess with the bass, but I do easily see the need for a lot more focus on bass modeling. I enjoy reading what all of you "real" bassists are using, and appreciate the insights on equipment and uses. It's great information for we who only occasionally venture into the bottom end of the sound spectrum.
 
jimfist said:
There's an excellent web page that reviews almost every compressor rack or stomp unit known to mankind, and it's a good read if you have the time to wade through it: www.ovnilab.com You may want to start with their TOP PICKS: http://www.ovnilab.com/reviews/toppicks.shtml

Personally, I've mostly used rack units for bass compression:

dbx 160x
dbx 163x (one knob squeezer)
Empirical Labs EL8 Distressor (this compressor has spoiled me for almost anything else other than studio grade high end comps)

Currently, I have dabbled with the TC Electronic SpectraComp, which is IMHO a neat little $99 pedal, but a quirky beast for sure. Some bassists have had great luck with it by selecting a TonePrint they like and keeping it really simple via the one-knob operation. Others, like myself, have been fascinated by the fact that it's a true 3 band (lo/mid/hi) multi-band compressor, fully editable and programmable via software, with a TON of available parameters, 3 of which are assignable to the hardware knob on the device. Simple, yet very complex. Quirky.

If you're looking for a compressor to simply lop off some of the jagged edges of the bass sound (IOW, mild compression), then you probably can make most anything work, with a few exceptions, of course. Your style of playing and the even-ness of tone you produce on your instrument also has a lot to do with how much compression you really need.

Personally, my playing style and preferences are specific and perhaps demanding, looking for more than just simple broadband compression. As mentioned above, for years I used the EL8 Distressor, and chose to solve the problems I had by throwing money at it with a studio grade compressor, and yes, it worked GREAT for me. Loved it.

For bass in particular, I tend to favor a pedal compressor that has one or both of the following features:

- parallel blending (aka wet/dry mix, to help preserve low end and dynamics with higher levels of compression)
- multiband compression (literally, a separate compressor for each tone region, at minimum a low and a high band)

Hope this helps.
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Thanks buddy, you're the man!
 
Rick said:
I'm surprised more effort isn't put into bass units, both stand-alone and modelers. The market seems to be there, and it appears that (at the very least) bassists know what doesn't work for them. I like the guitar FlyRig, and would like to try the Bass version with my Stingray. I have the Bass VT Deluxe from Tech21, and it does a pretty decent job on old Ampeg sort of tones. No compressor, though. The Tech21 stuff has been great for <$300 gear.

I'm just a guitarist who likes to mess with the bass, but I do easily see the need for a lot more focus on bass modeling. I enjoy reading what all of you "real" bassists are using, and appreciate the insights on equipment and uses. It's great information for we who only occasionally venture into the bottom end of the sound spectrum.
Click to expand...

I've been a pretty serious guitar player and "gear head" for just shy of 30 years. I've always kind of played bass as well. Mostly dabbling for recording my own stuff etc. I've owned a few fairly good basses as well over the years. But around 3-4 years ago I got pretty serious about bass. There is actually a lot to learn with bass gear and bass playing is quite different than guitar. It isn't just the black sheep. I actually find it harder to get a good bass tone than a guitar tone (probably more to do with lack of experience...) but I agree, there is not enough being done in this "awesome technical age" for bassists. It sure would seem like there is a huge market out there. But even line 6 stopped their bass gear lines and seem to be opting to throw some bass models in their guitar units. I find it odd actually. Either there's just not a large enough market out there or there's some reason it can't be done as effectively as guitar equipment on a tech level. Who knows.
 
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