Volume control question

S

stephenclark1

Experienced
This might've been covered before but I can't find it. Might be a question for people who use the FM3 live...I use an EV-1 dedicated to control volume so I don't have to get up adjust my Mission Gemini II. Down it's off and all the way up I like about 85dB...depends on who's home, etc.
My question is...is there a way to "globally" set all presets, whether factory, bought or downloaded, to the same volume so when I change presets I'm not riding the volume pedal? I can equalize volumes inside a preset to make them smooth, just would like to bring up or turn down to match over the whole list. As I type this I realize the volume of a preset depends on the levels going to the Output varies so maybe I can't.
 
stephenclark1 said:
Does this sound like an idea? Every time I go to a preset; go into Output, scene levels and adjust each one to be around 85dB on my meter when pedal is wide open. Good start you think?
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IMO this will get you in the ballpark for sure, but you may still have to tweak for taste (apparent volume is variable, different tones might need a little extra one way or the other to sit right in a mix)
 
Maybe we can ask for a whishlist entry: add "auto-leveling" feature. Like a device runs a sine wave internally and adjusts (each) preset in a way that peak volume is exactly 0db on the output meter. If this can be done totally silent and in the background, that would be incredible.
 
A lot of variables in play, depending on every blocks output. Like blocks that are set for a db boost when engaged. It might be tough to have an auto-level that users would like. ‘ Hey! The auto level F’d up my preset!’
 
stephenclark1 said:
As I type this I realize the volume of a preset depends on the levels going to the Output varies so maybe I can't.
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Correct. Presets, and even scenes, can vary depending on the amp model and how it's configured.

As for your setup, you didn't tell us a lot. How do you have your volume pedal configured? Is it a global volume pedal, or are you inserting VolPan blocks, or do you have it tied to the level of a specific block, maybe like whichever OUT block you're using for your speakers/monitoring?

The OUT block level should be at 0db if you've leveled your presets using the Amp block's Level parameter, and you can set the volume pedal to modify the OUT block's Level in each preset so it goes from -80db to 0db, or whatever range you want, by setting the Min and Max settings. Save the block to the Block Library, then you can easily insert it into other presets.

If you want to change that modifier range you'd still have to do it in each preset individually, but, rather than do that, leave it alone and simply adjust the OUT 1 or OUT 2 volume on the front panel.

There are pluses and minuses to using a volume pedal in the last block, but some people prefer to adjust the entire output, others, like me, want to adjust it going into the amp because that's how we'd do it with a traditional volume pedal and amplifier.


PS - Thinking about it further, I think it's a lot simpler than that. If you've leveled your presets, you can use the instructions on p. 11 in the manual to set up a global pre or post volume control without having to modify any blocks. The regular output controls on the front panel will adjust for those times you need to have less output or can get away with turning it up. Leveling the presets is the key.
 
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I have it on the output 1 to Gemini II and output 2 to Kali monitors…both outputs are all the way up and I use the EV-1 as sort of a master volume so I’m not having to turn those up and down all the time.
 
Greg Ferguson said:
Correct. Presets, and even scenes, can vary depending on the amp model and how it's configured.

As for your setup, you didn't tell us a lot. How do you have your volume pedal configured? Is it a global volume pedal, or are you inserting VolPan blocks, or do you have it tied to the level of a specific block, maybe like whichever OUT block you're using for your speakers/monitoring?

The OUT block level should be at 0db if you've leveled your presets using the Amp block's Level parameter, and you can set the volume pedal to modify the OUT block's Level in each preset so it goes from -80db to 0db, or whatever range you want, by setting the Min and Max settings. Save the block to the Block Library, then you can easily insert it into other presets.

If you want to change that modifier range you'd still have to do it in each preset individually, but, rather than do that, leave it alone and simply adjust the OUT 1 or OUT 2 volume on the front panel.

There are pluses and minuses to using a volume pedal in the last block, but some people prefer to adjust the entire output, others, like me, want to adjust it going into the amp because that's how we'd do it with a traditional volume pedal and amplifier.


PS - Thinking about it further, I think it's a lot simpler than that. If you've leveled your presets, you can use the instructions on p. 11 in the manual to set up a global pre or post volume control without having to modify any blocks. The regular output controls on the front panel will adjust for those times you need to have less output or can get away with turning it up. Leveling the presets is the key.
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Thanks, I may actually get the time to play around with it tomorrow. The presets I do myself usually get all that worked out in scene leveling and then open EV-1 all the way and start adjust the outputs at end chain till I get what I want.
Some presets I’ve downloaded you’ve almost got the Output in preset dimed. Which i assume is a combo of the blocks they used.
I’ll experiment tomorrow…I’m sure I’ll learn other stuff along the way.
 
stephenclark1 said:
Some presets I’ve downloaded you’ve almost got the Output in preset dimed. Which i assume is a combo of the blocks they used.
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I can't really address that because I don't know which ones you're talking about; Maybe if you tell us which presets you're talking about some of us can take a look at them and tell you what's wrong.

There are some incredible sources for presets, and some that are not so… "incredible". I see no reason a preset should have the output dimed, and to me, that's a smell that something inside the preset isn't right.
 
Update...went through all my presets (mine, Austin Buddy, Leon Todd, factory, one's I've saved in a file, etc.) started with the EV-1 wide open and then adjusted Output for all of them. A little tweaking on the Scenes here and there but not too much. Now all my presets maxed are in the 80-90 dB range (used my audiophile friend's meter) AND the main thing is that there is no more scrambling for the volume pedal because of big jumps or drops when I change presets. Perfect for my office space.
As usual with FAS, I learned more and more about my FM3 and a few cool things along the way. On a side note it seems like most of my Outputs are in the -22.00 to -25.00 range this while leaving my Mission Engineering Gemini II about 75% volume.
 
Chromatizm said:
Maybe we can ask for a whishlist entry: add "auto-leveling" feature. Like a device runs a sine wave internally and adjusts (each) preset in a way that peak volume is exactly 0db on the output meter. If this can be done totally silent and in the background, that would be incredible.
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A very distorted sound looses some distortion but keeps it's volume when you turn down the volume knob on the guitar. A clean sound looses volume instead when you turn down the knob.
You see the volume balance between the sounds depends on the strength of the input signal and the amount of gain.
What more to consider? What frequency gets meassured to tell the volume, is a preset with loud lows as loud as one with biting highs? What point of the ADSR- hull curve is relevant, the loudest peak or something weighted? Single notes vs. chords? Hard picking vs. soft? But you want some presets louder on purpose? You use different guitars? And that's just some initial thoughts, there are many more.
Plenty of reasons a software can't balance volumes that easily.
 
FWIW, what I do is level all my presets using the methods recommended in the manual, then I have a control switch in every preset that boosts the 'level' of the output block several dB (often used for solos, but also available where I otherwise determine I just need a bit 'more'), and finally I have a micro expression pedal controlling the 'output 1 volume' so I can tweak it up or down regardless of what's happen in a particular preset/scene/etc. - ideally I never move this expression control, but it's there if I need it (and it takes up very little room, unlike a full expression pedal - which I also use but for things where it's more needed like was and volume swells).
 
666was999 said:
You see the volume balance between the sounds depends on
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I agree with everything you have said: however, auto-leveling provides an excellent starting point, that's all. Peak or weighted, use amp block level or last block on the chain level, "hot" or 'vintage" level input - it all can be a couple of switches in settings page.
 
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