Very Frustrated With AXE FX II XL+

You don't need to buy anything. Do yourself a favor and run through the matrix into your 4x12; learn to dial this thing eliminating the frfr thing. FRFR is different and it can mess with you. By dialing into your real cab first, you will see that these ir's into a frfr are a different. You will see that they need addition eq. Also, the factory cabs are perfectly fine. The presets need only the same tweaks that any tube amp would need, using the same controls a tube amp comes with. There is beginning to be as much hype concerning ir's and presets as there is with "tubes". I have an old marshall and can get surprisingly close using my guitar cab. Through frfr, although its good, its different.

Agree with this post, but don't give up on FRFRs.

Try the Axe-Fx with your Matrix power amp into your guitar cab. This will help you convince yourself that the Axe-Fx is the real deal, it does amp modeling amazingly.

Then it can help you to move on to FRFR and be convinced that it's an accurate representation of how a guitar sounds miked up. It'll help you make the jump.

For a more realistic guitar-cab-like sound with an FRFR, try some far-field IRs. There's two from Jay Mitchell in the factory IRs, it should get you close to guitar cab feel through an FRFR.
 
Stop tweaking, its not you its the nature of the AxeFx2.

As said already, power amp and Cab is the solution you are looking for.

Good news for you is that you don't need to buy any more gear. Set your Axe output to 9 o'clock, plug the Matrix into your Marshall cab, bring up a new preset with just an amp block set at default everything. If it's not 90% close to what you are after then something else is going on.

Leave cab sim for front of house and monitors / IEM, Cab for you.
 
I'm brand new to Fractal, but have been using various modelers for decades. If you're new to modelling, the Axe's greatest strength can also be the greatest challenge, until you get the hang of it. Bottom line...There's a TON of stuff in those two rack spaces, and it's going to take time to learn it. Even if you're *not* new to modelling, there's a TON of stuff in those two rack spaces, and it's going to take time to learn it. You also have to remember, as has already been said several times, that listening to your Marshall/cab and listening to the Axe via FRFR is not a valid comparison. If you have the ability to record, try mic'ing and recording your Marshall and cab, and play that back through whatever FRFR's you're running the Axe through. That'll at least give you a little bit better benchmark for comparison. There's so much to the Axe, my suggestion for a starting point would be to go back to basics. Start with an empty patch, throw in an amp and a cab (or find a preset that you sort of like, and ditch everything but the amp and cab), and start tweaking. Don't focus on in-depth tweaking, go for the high-level stuff to start...EQ, gain, presence, the mic in the cab model, etc. See where it gets you. The other thing you could do, is setup a patch with just an amp (no cab), and run the output of the Axe into the Fx return of your Marshall, Marshall through your physical cabinet, and start tweaking the amp block or changing amps until you find something you like. Once you get something you like, then you've got the base sound. Go back to the Axe through your FRFR's, and start swapping/tweaking cab blocks. Trust me...You'll get there.
 
I wouldn’t suggest using a cab as I think it’s moving backwards. More and more these days the sound of guitar is heard, either by performers on stage with IEMs or wedges, the FOH via the PA system, or the end listener at home with a recording via speakers or headphones, all as the sound of a mic’d Guitar cabinet. I think the sooner one can get away from that “I need to hear amp in the room to be able to play” mentality the better.

Now don’t get me wrong, the sound of a cranked amp through a 4x12 is a beautiful thing to stand in front of (at least for short periods of time), but more and more, it’s not practical or feasible.

Want to always haul that cab to every gig ? What about when there just isn’t space on stage, what about fly gigs, what about venues that force you to turn it down to where your tone suffers, what about when you lay down tracks and find your recorded tone sounds nothing like what you heard in the room, what about when you blast the front row with a beamy ice pick tone on axis from a v30, while your other guitarist says they can’t hear you on stage, etc etc

There are a ton of reasons not to use a cab, and really only one to use it, the visceral enjoyment of your pant leg flapping in the breeze from each downstroke lol.

It’s odd to think there will be a generation that only grows up knowing the sound of mic’d guitar from modelers. Having a 4x12 in your bedroom was a teenage right of passage for me and my late 80s black tshirt wearing high school buddies.

On the flip side, one can’t really miss what they never knew. Younger guys these days can plug into the Axe and it sounds just like the tone on albums. Sounds just like the FOH tone of a big touring act. Essentially sounds “right” because it’s how they think guitar sounds.

Like it or not, for better or worse, that is the future we are moving towards and I think in like 10 years, seeing an amp on stage is going to be very unusual. They will still exist sure, studio tools, but for the typical gigs I think we will pull out axe-fx version ten out of our pocket, plug into a nice house system, and play, with an amazing modeled tone.

Could be wrong but I think the sooner we get on board with that, the more we can just enjoy making music and less time fighting the gear and things being different than we are used to
 
Seeing as how I wasn’t doing anything this morning I figured I’d make a patch & see if it’d help ya at all. I used the JVM OD2 Orange Model and actually dialed it in twice. Once on the X & once on the Y side of the Amp Block. Scenes 1-4 are X & Scenes 5-8 are Y. I used the Factory Cabs 39 & 41, both are 1960B cabs 39 uses the T75 and 41 V30’s, ya didn’t specify which speaker you preferred so I put them both in, (X is T75’s and is Scenes 1-4/ Y is the V30’s Scenes 5-8) but obviously feel free to change that up.
The patch is for FRFR, it’s by no means going to be perfect for ya, but maybe get you in the ballpark.
I didn’t tweak any parameter but what’s on the Basic page. BTW, that Bright Switch on this Amp is something else! Sheesh! I did leave it on though, just cause :cool:
The thing I did notice about this amp, is the Master Volume, turn it down & the Amp gets real thin, turn it up and it thickens up quite a bit..
Anyway give it a shot, hopefully it helps..

https://www.dropbox.com/s/gea1ob7i6ydzpl5/JVM ORANGE2 9.01.syx?dl=0
 
I wouldn’t suggest using a cab as I think it’s moving backwards. More and more these days the sound of guitar is heard, either by performers on stage with IEMs or wedges, the FOH via the PA system, or the end listener at home with a recording via speakers or headphones, all as the sound of a mic’d Guitar cabinet. I think the sooner one can get away from that “I need to hear amp in the room to be able to play” mentality the better.

Now don’t get me wrong, the sound of a cranked amp through a 4x12 is a beautiful thing to stand in front of (at least for short periods of time), but more and more, it’s not practical or feasible.

Want to always haul that cab to every gig ? What about when there just isn’t space on stage, what about fly gigs, what about venues that force you to turn it down to where your tone suffers, what about when you lay down tracks and find your recorded tone sounds nothing like what you heard in the room, what about when you blast the front row with a beamy ice pick tone on axis from a v30, while your other guitarist says they can’t hear you on stage, etc etc

There are a ton of reasons not to use a cab, and really only one to use it, the visceral enjoyment of your pant leg flapping in the breeze from each downstroke lol.

It’s odd to think there will be a generation that only grows up knowing the sound of mic’d guitar from modelers. Having a 4x12 in your bedroom was a teenage right of passage for me and my late 80s black tshirt wearing high school buddies.

On the flip side, one can’t really miss what they never knew. Younger guys these days can plug into the Axe and it sounds just like the tone on albums. Sounds just like the FOH tone of a big touring act. Essentially sounds “right” because it’s how they think guitar sounds.

Like it or not, for better or worse, that is the future we are moving towards and I think in like 10 years, seeing an amp on stage is going to be very unusual. They will still exist sure, studio tools, but for the typical gigs I think we will pull out axe-fx version ten out of our pocket, plug into a nice house system, and play, with an amazing modeled tone.

Could be wrong but I think the sooner we get on board with that, the more we can just enjoy making music and less time fighting the gear and things being different than we are used to

Pretty good post. I agree with most of that. In theory. Even Plini, during his No Guitar Is Safe interview (great podcast btw), said that he had only recently even played through a tube amp (Mark 5:25). So we are already starting to see that.

With that said, the feeling of playing in front of a real amp is so visceral I'm not entirely sure it'll ever completely go away.

Regardless, in this particular case I definitely feel like taking that intentional step "backward" by using a real cab (and actually an amp's power section as well) is a good idea. This is because these couple of folks are struggling with the Axe FX because their point of reference is a real guitar amp. This causes them to question whether the Axe can give them the sound they're looking for. The best way to get to that answer is to build it one step at a time.
 
If you have a real cab, it’s worth it to prove to yourself that the amplifier modeling is accurate. Visceral is good! There is nothing wrong with positive tactile feedback.

While I agree that using a real cab limits the capability of the Axe FX, it is a valid exercise which brings a big grin. It will prove definitely that the amp modeling is on par with the real thing. And that you have a marvelous collection in your rig.

In this scenario you should turn off cabinet modeling.

Then when you’ve proven to yourself the amplifier section is accurate, then play with cabinet choices and go FRFR, And open the world of impulse responses.
 
I've noticed most acts that come through using an Axefx seem to be using a power amp/cab setup. I've been running it with FRFR for about 5 years live with my band and it's definitely come a long way as has my understanding of how to use it but I must say I am tempted to try the cab setup for stage and send direct to the foh/mixer.
 
I too have been playing for quite a number of years and the biggest hurdle I had to get over was the feel of modeling vs amp & cab. The aha moment for me came when I started thinking of modeling as creating recorded guitar sounds, not replicating in-room guitar tone . I then started to listen closely to my favorite guitarist's recorded tone, then attempting to create those same sounds. I had much more success using this approach and am having much more fun.
 
I too have been playing for quite a number of years and the biggest hurdle I had to get over was the feel of modeling vs amp & cab. The aha moment for me came when I started thinking of modeling as creating recorded guitar sounds, not replicating in-room guitar tone . I then started to listen closely to my favorite guitarist's recorded tone, then attempting to create those same sounds. I had much more success using this approach and am having much more fun.
^^^THIS!

I had a very similar moment after some initial frustrations. I've been very happy since then!

Once you start to really think about this, you'll realize that the tone of your idols that you've been chasing forever is a recorded tone and NOT what the amp in the studio sounded like in the room.
 
My first Axe-Fx/FRFR year was a year of frustration. It was hard to pinpoint the cause of distortion, of bad tone, of getting lost in the mix etc.

Starting off with a neutral power amp and traditional guitar cab, is (in general) a sensible approach.
 
^^^THIS!

I had a very similar moment after some initial frustrations. I've been very happy since then!

Once you start to really think about this, you'll realize that the tone of your idols that you've been chasing forever is a recorded tone and NOT what the amp in the studio sounded like in the room.

To add to this, if you’ve never listened to solo tracks of guitar tracks of your favorite artist ... you should. Very enlightening about what sits in a mix versus what sounds good playing alone.
 
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