Using the FM3 as a DI box with acoustic guitar

Paultergeist

Inspired
Greetings,

I am seeking to better understand how the FM3 might be used as a Direct Input (DI) box for use with a piezo transducer-equipped acoustic guitar. I am just trying to grasp how the FM3 "sees" an acoustic signal, and what might be a good general strategy for such use. Specifically:

Is there a predominant thought or rationale regarding using an "Amp" block and/or "Cab" block in the Preset signal chain? This is really the main crux of my question: are amp and cab blocks within the Preset typically recommended for a good acoustic tone -- when using the FM3 as a DI?

Also, am I correct that an Input block and an Output block must be inserted at the start and end of ANY acoustic Preset -- even for use only as a DI?

Thanks for any help.
 
For any sound the FM3 must have an input and output block - no diff than another other pedal you would plug into.

A "DI Box" patch could have just that ... in -> out

A better sounding patch might have a compressor, tube preamp, and slight reverb.

No, you don't need any of those, but if you don't use anything the FM3 is a pretty expensive way to have a tuner and Di.

On my acoustic patches (on my III), I have a few more things...

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Compressor, looper (for fun), light chorus, and then either the IR Player or cab block where i have IRs of my Taylor (to make it sound a bit better).
The Filter block is just a null 5dB boost. Volume pedal into a plate reverb.
This worked best for my piezo acoustic.

I haven't played out since getting my FM3, but will prob do something similar if I ever do.
 
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use a test tone to establish 1 mV in = 1 mV out if you want to make a DI.
piezo pickups don't really need an amp or cab block, however you will have to add a volume block to center up the signal if you want R & L audio. Be aware that when you adjust the pan you will change your input level.
 
My acoustic patches are pretty simple. A light compressor to thicken up the tone a bit, the cab block with an IR of an acoustic guitar (I used one I shot myself for a long time, but I recently switched over to a 3Sigma Audio Gibson J45 IR). The cab block functions here like the Fishman Aura pedal, making your piezo tone sound less like a piezo and more like a mic. Then I have a PEQ and Graphic EQ block that I use to balance out trouble frequencies at gigs. A volume block attached to an expression pedal and some reverb and that's it!
 
Ill also put in a commercial for using an IR. I use the Compressor, Tube pre, IR combo then effects to taste. Marco Fanton has a nice patch on his site that is for sale if you want something to get you started.

I wold recommend the 3 sigma acoustic IR's or the Worship Tutorials acoustic Ir's they both work really well for me.
 
It's probably worth getting an FM3 just for the effects treatment for acoustic guitars. The superior quality of compressors, reverbs and enhancer in particular are really apparent with an acoustic instrument. And general treatments, such as using the a PEQ to pre EQ the signal will do wonders to getting the tonal balance just right, whether subsequent processing is used or not.

You can also use an IR for a miced feel, as suggested by Poparad, or actually mic the guitar and run that to a pre and into Input 2.

You may not want an amp and cabinet at all: but if so: Try a Fender Twin for a nice coloratation, although it has stepped halfway out of "acoustic". Another useful tip would be to use a Drive Block Preamp such as the Tube Drive 3-knob instead of an amp block for a fuller sound: Useful for not getting lost in a busy live mix, although not something one would probably often record with.

So, all in all, although the FM3 is electric guitar centric: it offers very comprehensive acoustic guitar treatments. I find the FM3 top drawer for bass as well.
 
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Colleagues,
Thank you all very much for your insightful guidance. For clarity sake, I do use my FM3 primarily for electric guitar, but as I also play some acoustic, I am trying to expand my utility of the FM3. It sounds like there is a lot of personal discretion regarding the use of amp and cab blocks for acoustic presets. Would: "Amp/cab blocks can be useful, but not absolutely required" (for acoustic presets) be an accurate way to look at the issue? I guess the rule is that there is no absolute rule!

Lots of good ideas were sharing in these responses...… I now have some things to try out, and I'll see how they sound for me.

Thanks everyone.
 
Would: "Amp/cab blocks can be useful, but not absolutely required" (for acoustic presets) be an accurate way to look at the issue? I guess the rule is that there is no absolute rule!

I'd say that's accurate. On the AxeFx II, I always used the Tube Pre model in the Amp Block, but on the FM3 I've found I actually like the sound better without the amp block at all. The only 'must' for me is the acoustic IR in the cab block (but I personally hate the sound of piezo pickups so I need to have something to improve that!). I could probably make a patch with just that and be OK with it.
 
I almost never use an amp block with acoustic guitar. A cab block with appropriate IR is usually beneficial. Generally, using the piezo flat (no boost or cut) from the guitar and doing all the EQ (I like the PEQ for this) in the FM3 gives me optimal results. Most piezos in recent production guitars I've used are pretty darn good, so it hasn't been difficult to get good sound.
 
The only 'must' for me is the acoustic IR in the cab block (but I personally hate the sound of piezo pickups so I need to have something to improve that!). I could probably make a patch with just that and be OK with it.
I’m in this camp, too. I’m amazed at how much I can do with just the cab block. Start with a good IR (ideally one you’ve made from your actual guitar), but there are all kinds of settings that work great on acoustic in the cab block, too. I can dial in some “room” in place of a reverb, select a preamp type and get a 3-band EQ for tone control, and even control the “mic spacing” to create a dynamic, wide, stereo sound. I’ve got an acoustic preset in which this is the only block, and when I plug in and put on headphones/IEM, it makes me smile every time!
 
I just bought the 3 Sigma Audio J45 IR. I read through this thread and noticed some are using a cab block with their acoustic IRs. Which cab model are you folks using with your IRs? I've got an inexpensive Breedlove acoustic electric that I want to make sound bigger and more acoustic at an upcoming gig. As always, appreciate all your knowledge and help.
 
I just bought the 3 Sigma Audio J45 IR. I read through this thread and noticed some are using a cab block with their acoustic IRs. Which cab model are you folks using with your IRs? I've got an inexpensive Breedlove acoustic electric that I want to make sound bigger and more acoustic at an upcoming gig. As always, appreciate all your knowledge and help.
The J45 IR is the cab model. You'll be using the cab block not as a cab block but as an IR loader.
 
I have written a Scilab script to compute IR's for acoustic instruments based on a recording of the same performance with a mic and pickup. It's what I use on my FM9 with my Taylor 816 and 514 guitars. Maybe not that user friendly yet, but more satisfying than using IR's of other guitars than the one you are playing ...

Check out the code on github by searching for 'Acoustic-IR-Generator '
 
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