Using Send and Return Blocks to extend effects blocks chain

trancegodz

Fractal Fanatic
I just noticed some things about using the send and return I’d never noticed before.

I started from a totally blank preset, and added an amp and a cab, with shunts all the way across. I dialed in the x and y amps and cabs to my liking, and set the volumes to 0 on the new utility VU meters. Then I saved the amp and cab to global blocks.

Here is where it gets strange. I have another preset which is a template for effects I have been using for some time. I dropped the global block amp that I’d just saved into my preset template and the volume was now way lower. About half what it was on the VU meter in the preset with just an amp and cab.

The amp placed in the template, didn’t sound quite as good sonically. It was the same sound but kind of like the difference between using Ultra Res cab and a normal cab. I was using the exact same amp and cab and settings in both presets. I’d saved them both to global blocks and inported them ito my effects template.

Now on my template preset I have two rows of effects in series with the levels set to 0, and bypass modes to Thru, except for the delay and reverb which is set to Mute FX In. At the end of the first row I have an effects send block. At the begininng of the second row I have an effects return block. I set the levels like it says in the Wiki. Send Level has to be at 100% and Output Level stays at zero. In the Return block Mix has to be at 100% and Return Level at 0.

To make the template as loud as the preset with just the amp and cab I have to set the send output level to at least 50%. But that is not what it says to do in the Wiki.

1. What is the correct way to extend your effects blocks chain using send and return blocks?

2. What are the correct settings for the send and return blocks?

3. Is it normal for the volume to be that much lower when using the send and return blocks to extend the effects chain?

Here’s what it says in the Axe FX Wiki it says:

Both the Send and Return blocks have parameters which need configuring. In most cases you'll want Send to feed the Return block only, not to pass signal to the next block. So Send Level has to be at 100% and Output Level stays at zero. In the Return block Mix has to be at 100% and Return Level at 0.0.

Here’s what it says in the manual:

Extending the Length of Effect Chains;
The 4x12 grid will suffice for the vast majority
of long, complex routings. However, certain “Axe-aholics” require a way to break this virtual sound barrier and exceed the number of columns available in the grid. The Feedback Send and Return can be used for just this purpose. Place a Send
block at the end of your first long chain and place the Return block at the beginning of another, setting the return MIX to “100%” and the level to 0 dB. Continue through other effects to the output.
 
check your amp advance parameters and make sure it is set to input left. I had an issue with one of my amps for months I was trouble shooting and sat found that my amp input was set to something other then left and it was messing with my levels
 
The send/return settings you described are correct. Keep the send block output level at 0%.

Your reverb block is lowering dry level with level control at 0 dB and a nonzero mix value. With any bypass mode other than thru it maintains the lower level when bypassed. Increase block level as needed to adjust for this. An easy method is reverb level +6 dB, mix 50%, then adjust reverb amount with input gain parameter.
 
The send/return settings you described are correct. Keep the send block output level at 0%.

Your reverb block is lowering dry level with level control at 0 dB and a nonzero mix value. With any bypass mode other than thru it maintains the lower level when bypassed. Increase block level as needed to adjust for this. An easy method is reverb level +6 dB, mix 50%, then adjust reverb amount with input gain parameter.

Thank you so much! That solved it!

How do you suggest setting the levels of the input mode, mix, input gain, and level, for delays in series?
I've been using Mute FX In for my delays so the delays trail when I turn the effect off.

THRU – When bypassed, the block is completely disengaged. None of its parameters have any effect on the sound; it behaves exactly as a shunt would in its place.

MUTE FX IN – When the block is bypassed, the inputs to its internal Effect Processor are disconnected. This allows effect “tails” to ring and leaves the dry unaffected when the block is bypassed. The Dry is completely unchanged—LEVEL and BALANCE settings remain in effect.

With BYPASS MODE settings of “MUTE FX IN” or “MUTE FX OUT,” the LEVEL and BALANCE controls will still affect the dry signal when a block is bypassed.
 
Thank you so much! That solved it!

How do you suggest setting the levels of the input mode, mix, input gain, and level, for delays in series?
I've been using Mute FX In for my delays so the delays trail when I turn the effect off.

In series, for delay, stick with Mute FX In for the bypass mode. Set the level to 0 dB. Set the input gain to 100%. Keep the mix < 50% and dial in the level of the effect you like. At a 50% mix you'll have exactly equal levels for dry and wet signal coming out of the block, at <50% it's only turning down the wet signal, the dry signal stays the same, at >50% the wet signal stays the same and you're turning down the dry signal.
 
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