using Eleven Rack and Axe Fx together

hoss

hoss

Inspired
Hi,

I am pretty new to the world of Axe-FX but have used hardware (and software) modellers and computer audio interfaces for about 8 years. My other background are classic tube amps, though.
My main interface now is the Digidesign Eleven Rack which I got in November 2009. It's price is very competitive considering it's coming with Pro Tools 8 LE and many routing features.
Eleven Rack also offers very good sounding guitar modeling (the True-Z input is amazing) but lacks features and flexibility in the effects chain (no stereo effects except reverb, no custom IRs, no rigs for Bass guitar,...)
I was looking at the Axe FX for some time but was held back by it's limits (no audio computer interface and no headphone jack). The raves about Axe FX and the great sounding audio files finally made me buy one two weeks ago.
I don't need to tell you how good it sounds, I just want to talk about setting it up with the Digidesign interface for recording and re-amping on a Digital Audio Workstation (a Mac or PC with DAW software like Pro Tools, Cubase, Logic,...).

Here is a mini how-to for a great setup using Eleven Rack (as the Interface) and Axe FX (as the modeling unit):

Plug your guitar into Eleven Rack and make sure the digital clock on Eleven Rack is set to the standard 48kHz (Axe FX only works at 48kHz).
On Eleven Rack I have a "neutral" rig that has every effect and amp bypassed but you can also hit the tuner button for the same effect. You can even leave the 11R tuner active all the time to check on your guitar while playing. All the modeling is done in the Axe FX alone.

This is a also a great way to compare the two racks. Select a rig on your Eleven Rack and press the BYPASS button on the Axe FX to listen to the sound from the Eleven Rack rig, select the TUNER mode on Eleven Rack and press BYPASS again on the Axe FX to listen to the sound from the Fractal unit.

Sounds cool?

Setting things up:

Two S/PDIF cables connect the Axe to 11R. I am also running two MIDI cables between the two racks and use the "External Midi" ports on the 11R to have Axe Edit control the Axe-FX through the Digidesign unit - no extra MIDI interface necessary.

On the Axe FX press I/O and set the "Input Source" to "DIGITAL".

To be able to listen to the modeled return signal from the Axe FX through the 11R (I have my studio monitors and headphones connected to 11R) you need to start a DAW (Pro Tools or Cubase in my case), create a stereo track that has it's input bus set to "Digital Input L/R" and either arm it for recording (Pro Tools, and make sure "Track->Input Only Monitoring" is selected) or press it's monitoring button (Cubase).

Re-amping is done the same way as with Eleven Rack alone. Just set your "Input" on Eleven Rack from Guitar to Re-Amp and play back a dry track in your DAW (output bus set to Re-Amp). Your "wet" track with it's input bus set to "Digital In" will receive the modeled Axe signal.

Works great!

ponderosa_10.jpg
 
Regarding the input - do you know what the input impedance is for the neutral amp you've selected on the 11R?
The input impedance on the AxeFx is 1MOhm, which is what most tube amps have and it seems to me that you
might be either missing out on the "true-z" feature of the 11R or that the impedance is going to be the same as
what is already there on the AxeFx and that the 11R isn't necessary. Maybe I'm missing something?

Anyway - sound wise - what is the difference in your opinion? Which one do you prefer? :)
 
I like the 1MOhm setting on the 11R True-Z the best. You can edit this setting and turn it off, too.
Eleven Rack feels authentic when you are playing through it and dynamics are great.

Comparing 11R and Axe:
I think the Axe FX sounds better, especially if you tweak it (IRs, effects) and has an incredible set of features. 11R does not even have a stereo delay...
Axe FX seems to be the only modeler on the market that truely simulates the power amp in a guitar amplifier. All others (11R, too) simulate preamps and cabs. The 11R however has a cool reproduction of the "ghost note" in old Marshall Plexi amps.

The Eleven Rack is way (WAY!) easier to dial in and if you are going for a couple of basic rigs you will get great sound out of it in minutes.
11R also costs about half, is a multi channel audio interface and comes with Pro Tools.

For me the two are a perfect team.
 
I have been fiddling a lot with the two units and I have found an analog routing solution using a connection from "Output to Amp" on Eleven Rack to "Secret Sauce Input" on Axe FX and the FX Loop and Line Input on Eleven Rack to receive the modelled signal from the Axe FX both for running stand alone or using a DAW for recording and reamping.

11r-axefx.jpg
 
What would the benefits be to doing this? I am getting an Axe FX Ultra in the future, but have been thinking of getting something else for the time being that is cheaper, yet still capable, which is why I have been considering the Eleven Rack first, then the Axe FX when funds are there (also need a new MBP at some point as my 13" white MB may not last too much longer with everything I throw at it :lol: ) So, I'm really wondering if there's a great benefit to having the 11R hooked up to the Axe, or if it'd be more worth it to just sell the 11R to help fund the Axe?
 
7stringerH307 said:
What would the benefits be to doing this?
Click to expand...
The 11R is a great audio interface (and comes bundled with Pro Tools). The Axe FX is no audio interface at all, it does not even have a headphone jack.
 
hoss said:
7stringerH307 said:
What would the benefits be to doing this?
Click to expand...
The 11R is a great audio interface (and comes bundled with Pro Tools). The Axe FX is no audio interface at all, it does not even have a headphone jack.
Click to expand...

I'm not too concerned about pro tools, since I just bought Logic 9 studio. It being an audio interface is nice, but seems a bit pricey to just use it for that. I have been considering getting the Apogee Duet for an audio interface.
 
7stringerH307 said:
I have been considering getting the Apogee Duet for an audio interface.
Click to expand...
Great choice.

I get many questions why I am "advertising" the use of Eleven Rack with Axe FX. I am NOT!

I simply wrote this post for people like myself who first got the Eleven Rack as their modeller and DAW recording interface and later got the Axe FX: How to get the most out of both units together.
 
AxeFX and 11R? Together?!?!? NEVER!!! SACRILEGE AND HERESY!!! DEMONS WILL ISSUE FORTH FROM THE SOUNDS OF SUCH AN UNHOLY UNION... Oh, wait, this is rock, that's a good thing.

:mrgreen:
 
Did I mention that my 11 Rack was a great "Backup" while I was waiting 3 months to get my new Ultra (sold my Standard in Sept.)
 
hoss said:
7stringerH307 said:
I have been considering getting the Apogee Duet for an audio interface.
Click to expand...
Great choice.

I get many questions why I am "advertising" the use of Eleven Rack with Axe FX. I am NOT!

I simply wrote this post for people like myself who first got the Eleven Rack as their modeller and DAW recording interface and later got the Axe FX: How to get the most out of both units together.
Click to expand...

Right on man.. I was just seeing if it was really worth it to have both, which I would say it would be pretty killer, but I think I'm just gonna save up for the Axe.. I'll probably be buying the duet after christmas, and hopefully the Axe early next year, I gotta sell some gear!.. For now, I'll just suck it up and keep using pod farm:/

Thanks for your help man!
 
I just got my Axe a day or so ago, and I have been having an absolute blast with it so far. I also have an 11R, and I ran across this thread yesterday. I thought I would give the hookup recommendations a try.

I followed the instructions regarding the hookups between the 11R and the Axe. The only sound I could get was the dry DI input. For whatever reason, I could not get any of the Axe Fx processed sound to come through the 11R. If I changed the "RIG INPUT" on the 11R to Line L, R or L+R, I got unwanted feedback. I tried to troubleshoot, but I was unsuccessful. The only ways I have been able to interface my 11R with my Axe so far are as follows:

1) Gtr > Axe Instrument then Axe outputs into 11R line inputs
2) Gtr > Axe Instrument then Axe SPDIF out into 11R SPDIF in

Can someone help me figure out why this might be happening?

The first thing I tried was the "Basic Setup" by setting Output 1 on the 11R to "Rig Input" which should send the 11R DI signal to the Axe. That seemed to work because I was getting the LEDs to light up on the Axe. I then set the Axe to "Analog Front" and set "Copy Out1 to Out 2" to "ON." I then ran unbalanced cables from the Axe Output 1 to 11R line inputs. I disabled all the 11R modules and set output volumes to 0 db.

I know remote troubleshooting is difficult. Here is some more information in case it might be helpful:

Axe Fx Standard
10.02 firmware
11R running 1.0.3 firmware

Thanks in advance for the help.
 
Hi Judge,

you not only need to do the Basic Setup but also one of the other two steps.

Have fun!
 
I'm an eleven rack user and I ordered my Ultra a few days ago
I wanted to sell the eleven rack for a new sound card to match with the fractal unit...
But now, with your help , I think to keep it as an audio interface
It is certainly good match
and allows me to have many sounds ... a good sound card
and the ability to use headphones with the ax fx.

Something new after all this time that you have used together?

Thnx again
 
countach said:
Something new after all this time that you have used together?
Thnx again
Click to expand...
Yeah, something new!

I sold the Eleven Rack, because we needed a new audio interface with more mic inputs for recording drums.
I got the M-Audio Fast Track Ultra 8R. Great! With the Pro Tools 9 upgrade the copy protection is done via an iLok, no need for the interface anymore.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom