Using a PEQ with a real cab

[Fatjac]

Hi all,

Page 38 of the AxeFX3 owners manual shows some example presets. I use example 4 for my set ups. I play live with a SLA 2 & an Orange PPC212 OB. I use output 2 for the amp & cab. Output 1 is used for the PA & headphones.

My question is that the PEQ in the routing to output 2 is presumably there to try to get the sound from the real cab to sound as much possible like the sound going to Output 1. With that in mind does anyone else use this set up & if so do you have any recommendations for typical eq settings that would work please?

I have tried to search for this as I expect that it has been asked before but cannot find the answers that I need.

Cheers

 

[DLC86]

With that in mind does anyone else use this set up & if so do you have any recommendations for typical eq settings that would work please?

There can't be "typical" eq settings because the result will vary greatly depending on the cab, IR and PA speakers you use.
Your best bet is to try and match them by ear. Or just tweak a patch to make it sound good thru the PA and then tweak the peq to make it sound good also thru the cab.

 

[Fatjac]

Thanks, yes I appreciate that it is such a variable feast but I wondered if there might be some basics so to speak? e.g. are there any high frequencies that a guitar cab will never reach? Are there some lows which definitely have to be taken out? Something to start with before specific tweaks?

 

[DLC86]

Thanks, yes I appreciate that it is such a variable feast but I wondered if there might be some basics so to speak? e.g. are there any high frequencies that a guitar cab will never reach? Are there some lows which definitely have to be taken out? Something to start with before specific tweaks?

Well, an IR shouldn't have much low or high frequencies the cab can't reproduce, since it also replicates the sound of a (mic'd) cab.
The major difference would be given by the fact that the IR was probably created with a close mic, that usually creates a more mid-scooped sound, so the first thing you might try is to cut the mids on the real cab (or boost them in the PA out).

Or, in alternative, try a far-field IR, those would give you a sound more similar to your real cab as a starting point.
You can find a bunch here and here

 

[Fatjac]

Sorry for the late reply, I've been busy beyond belief!

Further experimentation has lead me to purchase an IR set that is based on my own physical cab. Now I'm puzzled...I would have thought that using IR that is supposedly close to my actual cab & placing that in the output to the PA/ headphones would allow me to hear what is coming from the second output through the physical cab. However it is nothing what soever like it!

What I am trying to achieve is to be able to set up my presets so that the two outputs are close enough so that only minor tweaking is required for them to sound the same.

Any further input on this would be appreciated.

 

[unFILTERed]

You should maybe consider using FRFR speakers (like matrix or atomic ones) instead of traditional cab. And to suggestions above: If he uses farfied IRs or with tweaks makes the PA/Output 1/IR tone sound like his Cab...that will make it for the engineer harder to sit his guitars in the mix. The sound guy would try to reverse all what he did.

 

[Tommy Tempest]

Hi all,

Page 38 of the AxeFX3 owners manual shows some example presets. I use example 4 for my set ups. I play live with a SLA 2 & an Orange PPC212 OB. I use output 2 for the amp & cab. Output 1 is used for the PA & headphones.

My question is that the PEQ in the routing to output 2 is presumably there to try to get the sound from the real cab to sound as much possible like the sound going to Output 1. With that in mind does anyone else use this set up & if so do you have any recommendations for typical eq settings that would work please?

I have tried to search for this as I expect that it has been asked before but cannot find the answers that I need.

Cheers

There is no typical settings, as every guitar and PA cab reacts differently. However, I do have a starting point, that works for me. My stage cab is either a Mesa Boogie 2 x 12 or 4 x 12 Rectifier cab, depending on the venue. My setup uses 2 separate PEQ blocks, right before the out block 1 and 2. This allows me to shape the eq and get rid of unwanted lows and highs. My initial setup is cut everything below 80hz and everything above 8k. This immediately takes away the boominess and balances the frequencies when using a guitar cab. I start with the same settings for my FOH channel for thwe same reasons. Then, depending on the PA being used, I can separately adjust the PEQ, to shape my tone to sound better through FOH, and get rid of those booms through the subs and piercing highs that the HF drivers create through the PA tops.

 

[Tommy Tempest]

Thanks, yes I appreciate that it is such a variable feast but I wondered if there might be some basics so to speak? e.g. are there any high frequencies that a guitar cab will never reach? Are there some lows which definitely have to be taken out? Something to start with before specific tweaks?

To answer this question, look at the specs of your orange cab. If memory serves me well, my Orange cab use to spec out at 70-5000Hz, which is the Vintage 30 speaker specs. I find 80hz on the low side and 8000hz on the high side sounds more airy without the boom and shreeks.

 

[DLC86]

Did you try what I suggested here?

Well, an IR shouldn't have much low or high frequencies the cab can't reproduce, since it also replicates the sound of a (mic'd) cab.
The major difference would be given by the fact that the IR was probably created with a close mic, that usually creates a more mid-scooped sound, so the first thing you might try is to cut the mids on the real cab (or boost them in the PA out).

Or, in alternative, try a far-field IR, those would give you a sound more similar to your real cab as a starting point.
You can find a bunch here and here

 

[York Audio]

Hi all,

Page 38 of the AxeFX3 owners manual shows some example presets. I use example 4 for my set ups. I play live with a SLA 2 & an Orange PPC212 OB. I use output 2 for the amp & cab. Output 1 is used for the PA & headphones.

My question is that the PEQ in the routing to output 2 is presumably there to try to get the sound from the real cab to sound as much possible like the sound going to Output 1. With that in mind does anyone else use this set up & if so do you have any recommendations for typical eq settings that would work please?

I have tried to search for this as I expect that it has been asked before but cannot find the answers that I need.

Cheers

I do the same thing live. Just make sure that your live cab doesn’t have a Cab sim before it. And instead of using a PEQ Block, I’d recommend using the global Output 2 Graphic EQ so you don’t have to insert a PEQ block in every preset.

As far as settings go, I find that cutting some 2-4k takes out some ear-fatiguing frequencies when cranking the cab loud. Try using the looper and adjust your global EQ until it sounds good to you. If it’s too muddy, try cutting a little 125 and 250 to clean up the low-mids.

I hope this helps!