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U2 "Streets" Clip

zecure

Inspired
Axeman,

Just watched your video’s and they are SOOOO good. It makes me rethink how I should tweak a preset.

Tx for the inspiring material in it and i agree that a preset of someone else never sounds the same on your own gear. One small question maybe, could you give me an insight in the modulation part of the delay?
 

Axeman

Inspired
Good to know. I think the heavier gauges enhance the chime. Edge uses .11s quite a bit on his Strat. I used .11s on this clip. I think .09s are too small for use with a Herdim pick. The Herdim pick will wear a little over time and not catch as often.

I forget if I use the 2290. I think the 2290 model is just the digital delay model with some specific EQ settings. For the clip at the top of this thread I used the Ambient Stereo model to get that more full, spacial effect. It's still a modulated digital delay of course.
 

Freds55

Veteran
Yes, Class A 30W TB. Bright switch off believe it or not. It's too brittle with the Bright on. Turn bright off, the treble up, bass down and mid up some depending on your guitar.

Now, here is the trick for me anyway (same on the Axe II). I realize this means the model I'm using is no longer a "real" AC-30 but I can only get U2 stuff to work with the Negative Feedback ON. It increases the volume and what I describe as fullness of the tone. It gives me some mids and texture that works perfectly for U2 stuff.

Input drive should be between 4.5 and 5 depending on your guitar (mine is a Start with Kinman pups). Remember this song, like many of Edge's songs on a Strat, is in quack position (bridge and middle). You won't get this tone without a Strat in quack.

Adjust EQ to get your Strat closer to the tone. I boost 500 through 2000 hz. Don't add too much high pitch treble. You want mid to high chime, not ice picky highs. Edge's tone has a lot of mids. His old '64 didn't have that brittle high end that many new AC-30s seem to have.

Finally tweak tone with the cab selection. 2x12 Class-A of your liking. I think I blended four of them for this clip. Love the new cab block!

Keep in mind the chime is not just the Axe. There are two other important things to get the chime. First, like Edge, I used a Herdim pick on the side with the dimples hitting the strings. This gives it punch, attack and sharpness. Also, I have .11 gauge strings on my Strat (I believe Edge does the same on many songs). This adds to the chime IMHO. A .09 gauge is not going to chime like an 0.11.

Delay is digital and modulated. For this clip I used the Ambient Stereo for the first time, and love it!
Very nice thanks for sharing I’m going to have to try this...sounds great
 

edo

Forum Addict
core tone sounds very good indeed (maybe you only need a newer herdim pick lol), although it sounds like your placing the delay after the cab block (it sounds stereo) as opposed to before the amp block (mono), which would be the more edgesque way of doing it! ;)
 

Axeman

Inspired
This is a quick recording of my Axe III Streets preset with cab and reverb model off and then routed to Matrix GT1000FX power amp and Matrix NL212 cab. Keep in mind this was recorded with an iPhone X microphone using an app called "Voice Record." It would sound even better if done with a professional mic, which I'll eventually try to do. I'm getting awesome, "in-the-room" tone without making any adjustments to my amp model. The NL212 is a super flexible cab with a neutral response, so you can use it for all types of music and just adjust your amp model and EQ to get the tone you want. I don't use the cab model because this is not FRFR. I prefer this approach over FRFR because of the simplicity (no cab models to figure out and deal with - way too many options and parameters). When I do turn it on it muddles the tone. I highly recommend the Matrix GT1000FX power amp together with the NL212 (and don't use the cab models) for live use. Then you can come back to the studio, turn on the cab and reverb models and can use all the same presets in the studio. Pure tone bliss.

If you go back and compare this to the first clip at the top of this thread, you will note that this "real cab" version has a fuller, chimer tone to it. Same preset, but power amp and NL212 makes a huge difference. It's all relative, but now I think the original clip sounds too "thin" and it requires more volume to hear the similar tones. How do we make the studio preset sound like the in-the-room version?

[SOUNDCLOUD]
 
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Axeman

Inspired
record it with an iPhone! :D
LOL, ok smart---. :)

Seriously, if I listen to my Matrix set up in my office and then put on my headphones and listen to my preset with cab and reverb, the tone from the Matrix set up is so much better (doing my best to adjust for volume - in other words, I'm turning up the headphones quite a bit to be as loud). There is this special tone with the strings that is so crisp and seems to have more sustain. It's like I hear more "metal chime" - I can't explain it in words. And I spent MANY hours on my core preset and thought I had great "in-the-room" tone and now that I compared it to my Matrix set up, I think I have a long way to go.
 

ccroyalsenders

Fractal Fanatic
LOL, ok smart---. :)

Seriously, if I listen to my Matrix set up in my office and then put on my headphones and listen to my preset with cab and reverb, the tone from the Matrix set up is so much better (doing my best to adjust for volume - in other words, I'm turning up the headphones quite a bit to be as loud). There is this special tone with the strings that is so crisp and seems to have more sustain. It's like I hear more "metal chime" - I can't explain it in words. And I spent MANY hours on my core preset and thought I had great "in-the-room" tone and now that I compared it to my Matrix set up, I think I have a long way to go.
That "special tone" you're getting at is the result of natural feedback and interplay between the strings and the speaker.

When you're playing under headphones, there is zero sound reinforcement moving back into your guitar from the speakers. This has a *huge* impact on the feel of your tone and, probably not surprisingly, the energy of the tone at various EQ levels. You can tweak around this of course, but to be honest, IMO, it's a bit of a losing battle chasing headphones perfection if your direct comparison is a standard guitar cab right there next to you. Not having any sound waves at all interacting with the strings takes a whole lot of energy out of a tone that isn't really "dial-in-able" or at the very least is damn tough to perfectly recreate. Even a "bedroom volume" speaker in the room with your guitar is going to yield fuller feeling tones than headphones. Hence speakers (either full range or standard cab) being used in control rooms and sometimes on direct stages when using IEMs (though a good FOH will introduce enough volume to get things going without additional onstage reinforcement).

FWIW, your direct "Streets" clip sounds fucking awesome. Wouldn't change a thing.
 

Axeman

Inspired
core tone sounds very good indeed (maybe you only need a newer herdim pick lol), although it sounds like your placing the delay after the cab block (it sounds stereo) as opposed to before the amp block (mono), which would be the more edgesque way of doing it! ;)
Hi Edo. Long time since we've connected. Hope all is well. I've always placed the delays after the cab to maintain the stereo. I used the new Ambient Stereo delay for the first clip posted above because I liked the stereo feel and separation. But I used the 2290 w/ Mod for the second Matrix clip I posted later.

A while back I A/B tested the delay block in front of the amp and after cab and couldn't hear any difference. And I believe Cliff mentioned years ago that there shouldn't be a difference (I don't recall why). So I don't like losing the stereo effect in case i want to use it.
 
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edo

Forum Addict
Hi Edo. Long time since we've connected. Hope all is well. I've always placed the delays after the cab to maintain the stereo. I used the new Ambient Stereo delay for the first clip posted above because I liked the stereo feel and separation. But I used the 2290 w/ Mod for the second Matrix clip I posted later.

A while back I A/B tested the delay block in front of the amp and after cab and couldn't hear any difference. And I believe Cliff mentioned years ago that there shouldn't be a difference (I don't recall why). So I don't like losing the stereo effect in case i want to use it.
Well, I suppose it depends on the delay model. If you use the ambient stereo before the amp block, left and right sum to mono and you hear them both panned center, if you place it after, left and right are respectively panned left and right and it sounds stereo. Not saying it’s bad, actually stereo delay is cool, just saying that the edge’s signal path has the delay before the amp, except a few patches where the whole fx chain comes from one of his af’s, in which case the delay might be at the end of the chain (although I still believe his af’s except the shimmer one are connected in mono, so stereo delay still sounds mono even if it’s at the end of the chain).
 

Axeman

Inspired
Well, I suppose it depends on the delay model. If you use the ambient stereo before the amp block, left and right sum to mono and you hear them both panned center, if you place it after, left and right are respectively panned left and right and it sounds stereo. Not saying it’s bad, actually stereo delay is cool, just saying that the edge’s signal path has the delay before the amp, except a few patches where the whole fx chain comes from one of his af’s, in which case the delay might be at the end of the chain (although I still believe his af’s except the shimmer one are connected in mono, so stereo delay still sounds mono even if it’s at the end of the chain).
Oh, I'm certain you're right. I've heard the same. Many say the delay hitting the amp input impacts the tone. I just don't notice it in the Axe, but I could be wrong.
 
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