Treble bleed caps - arghhh!

maxdown

maxdown

Fractal Fanatic
So ... I'm modding up a cheap but very playable Jackson Adrian Smith SDX (Indonesian made) to do the odd 80's FR whammy bar extremism. The Floyd Rose special trem is holding up so far - but I know someday a decent Schaller FR will likely find a home there.

The guitar's electrics as expected with cheap imports were poo. Flimsy feeling import style 5 way and pots with rubbish tapers. I've replaced the Vol pot with a good CTS 500K Audio pot and also I've replaced the pickups - SD Custom Custom trembucker, Dimarzio Areas (single size humbuckers) in middle and neck (and learning on the way that you have to reverse the recomended wiring for the SD to stay in phase with the DiMarzio in position 2!).

While the CTS pot is great - there's just a little too much treble roll off at low volume so I want to stick a treble bleed in there.

The thing is I have another guitar with the SD custom custom as it's bridge pickup and I have a 220 cap with a resistor in parallel (I think 130K) over the vol pot (unsure of make as it's now plastered with solder blobs but tapers nice) and it works great - but when I use the same value cap/resistor combo with the Jackson vol pot it just seems to a) do nothing to the treble and b) kills the pot taper.

I'm going to solder 2 wires over the pot and have them hanging out to try different caps without needing to unstring and take scratchplate off every time

Any good suggestions for caps/resistors combos that retain a small bit of treble and doesn't kill the taper too much? Resistors in parallel or resistor in series? No resistor?

If you've a SD Custom Custom pickup I'd be especially interested to hear what you've used.
 
^^^ I do what Cliff does. I can't stand a humbucker guitar without a treble bleed cap now. I find my PRS much more versatile with the cap installed. 470 pF in both of them. I had a Custom Custom in the Standard 24 but that was pre-bleed cap. I have custom wound PAFs in there now from http://www.tonefordays.com/
 
My Suhr came stock with a 150k Resistor and a 680p Cap (parallel) on a 500k pot running a Suhr PAF style humbucker. I later rewired it adding a blender and some options on the 5-way. I experimented a bit with the bleed values but came back to the stock values.
 
maxdown said:
I'm going to solder 2 wires over the pot and have them hanging out to try different caps without needing to unstring and take scratchplate off every time
Click to expand...

This is ingenious! I'm about to fit a Cap to my Tele and have been putting it off as I cannot commit to which Cap to use, but having the 2 wires is a brilliant idea! Thank you!
 
Thanks for replies - I've ordered in a bag of assorted caps and also resistors - let battle begin.

@chucma I got the tip from the Seymour Duncan forum ...... I'll have a couple of wires squeezing out under scratchplate connected to a solderless 4x2 mini breadboard connector - the legs of the caps will just push in from the top without needing to solder anything as I test.

Probably would be fine just wrapping the loose ends round the cap legs but figured I could keep the mini connector and tails as a bit of re-usable kit for other guitars in the future.
 
Putting a resistor in parallel certainly changes the pot taper.

I use a cap (typically around 0.001uF, ie 1000nF) in SERIES with a resistor typically around 150K to 180K. This works well in maintaining a similar treble response over the pot range.

Using just a cap with no resistor is good for "boosting" highs at lower volume settings.
 
^--- great explanatory video, albeit with several factual errors.

Nevertheless, if you experiment with the methods and values to find something you like, then that's what right for you.
 
unix-guy said:
I use a sort of "generic" version of this:

http://www.stewmac.com/Pickups_and_...esistors/Golden_Age_Treble_Bleed_Circuit.html

I bought a few on eBay that use a mini pot so you can fine tune the resistor.

I've installed them on 3 guitars so far with the pot set about 150k. Works great for me.
Click to expand...

I've been using the Stew-Mac treble bleed kits lately too.
I've always used similar spec'd components from an electronics surplus store when I made these myself too but was never sure if I was using 1/4 watt resistors or not.
Probably irrelevant.
But at least I know for sure when I use the SM product.
I've also tried many of the variants, like the Kinman version with the resistor in series.

But because these circuits with the resistors screw up the pot taper, I always have my treble bleed circuits on a switch.
I just kick it in for the rare times I need more highs at lower vol pot settings.
Most of the time I just use the pots w/o the tb circuit.
 
I've had an itch for the Jackson AS SDX lately. I've been looking for a HSS guitar with the traditional fender headstock and floyd equipped. I wish Charvel would make the HSS or a HS with a floyd to go with their $700 range strat types. I really wish they would do so in a paint color that's not so flashy. The Wild Card No. 5 is close. The Warren D's would be perfect if the paint job wasn't Warren's. I'd find myself playing Ratt songs all day long. If I could get close to Warren D's skill that might not be so bad.

The $350 plus or minus price tag on the SDX makes it enticing and affordable to modify. I'll be following this thread.
 
I've tried all incarnations and found using a capacitor only works the best for what I want to hear. My ideal result is the guitar's tone with the volume set at 3 sounding the same as at 10. The only way I've been able to achieve this is to is experiment with different values per guitar and the values in my guitars range from 80pf to 330pf. Higher values can work if you stay above 5 on the control. If I have to make a choice between two values, I tend to choose the one with more bass than treble at the lower volume. More treble equates to harsh tones in my experience. BTW, I've seen no definitive correlation between single-coils or humbuckers and the value used.
 
Sonofiam said:
I've tried all incarnations and found using a capacitor only works the best for what I want to hear. My ideal result is the guitar's tone with the volume set at 3 sounding the same as at 10. The only way I've been able to achieve this is to is experiment with different values per guitar and the values in my guitars range from 80pf to 330pf. Higher values can work if you stay above 5 on the control. If I have to make a choice between two values, I tend to choose the one with more bass than treble at the lower volume. More treble equates to harsh tones in my experience. BTW, I've seen no definitive correlation between single-coils or humbuckers and the value used.
Click to expand...
Have you tried Suhrs take on a treble bleed with a cap and two resistors?
 
guitarnerdswe said:
Suhrs version of a treble bleed is a cap and resistor in parallel, and then both of those in series with another resistor. A bit different and kind of unique.
Click to expand...
That's why I'm asking.
I've never heard of this circuit with *2* resistors.
I've searched with Google but can't find any info on this.
What I did find was that some Suhr guitars come pre-equipped with a treble bleed circuit and a discussion at thegearpage stated that the components were a 680pf cap with a 150k 1/4 watt resistor probably in parallel but possibly in series like the Kinman circuit.

What can you tell me about this 2 resistor circuit please?
 
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