ToneX is blowing my mind…!

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I don’t see the point to capture your AF3 amps… I use ToneX to capture my own amps and cabs, to get something I can‘t exactly get with my AF3 (or spending hours dialing the tone…) and also because I can’t use my amps all the time. Also I found that using ToneX in 96kHz projects are a very pleasing experience… I would love Axefx to offer 96KHz for my projects and using it as the digital interface…
I have hundreds of ready to go patches on the AF3, no need to have a copy of them.
 
Stainless Steel Frets said:
I don’t see the point to capture your AF3 amps… I use ToneX to capture my own amps and cabs, to get something I can‘t exactly get with my AF3 (or spending hours dialing the tone…) and also because I can’t use my amps all the time. Also I found that using ToneX in 96kHz projects are a very pleasing experience… I would love Axefx to offer 96KHz for my projects and using it as the digital interface…
I have hundreds of ready to go patches on the AF3, no need to have a copy of them.
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I'd see the value of capturing a AF3 amp if you wanted to keep your AF3 packed away for gigging, but wanted to bring your favorite Fractal preset onto your computer so you can practice/record at any time.
 
Stainless Steel Frets said:
Of course IK multimedia is working on X-Gear pedal ToneX. It should work in « player » only version to keep the huge DSP need for computers.
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This I think is brilliant and would be exactly what I want.
Give me something small that holds my favorite/gigging presets.
If I need to edit, I'll pull out the computer. But for performance, I just want a box with buttons.
 
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Stainless Steel Frets said:
I don’t see the point to capture your AF3 amps… I use ToneX to capture my own amps and cabs, to get something I can‘t exactly get with my AF3 (or spending hours dialing the tone…) and also because I can’t use my amps all the time. Also I found that using ToneX in 96kHz projects are a very pleasing experience… I would love Axefx to offer 96KHz for my projects and using it as the digital interface…
I have hundreds of ready to go patches on the AF3, no need to have a copy of them.
Click to expand...
Point is to compare the black-box (sorry, you inverted the tence of those terms) capture to the model. I haven't looked at the capture technique but I assume they capture a few settings of the knobs and interpolate between them. That's fine, but can you go in and change the capacitance of the bleed cap, inductance of the output transformer? Maybe you don't care, but as I've postulated in a previous post, the discrete component modeling path leads to more deterministic improvements. The AI approach, while valid, is a crap shoot and depends upon on orders of magnitude leaps in processing power.
 
Maybe a "crossover" move for Fractal would be to create and market a preset pack that explicitly highlighted each amp model. Show a clean, crunch, lead tone for each amp. Drown users in excellently produced options and the "profiler" pack will die like flies.
 
fractalz said:
Point is to compare the black-box (sorry, you inverted the tence of those terms) capture to the model. I haven't looked at the capture technique but I assume they capture a few settings of the knobs and interpolate between them. That's fine, but can you go in and change the capacitance of the bleed cap, inductance of the output transformer? Maybe you don't care, but as I've postulated in a previous post, the discrete component modeling path leads to more deterministic improvements. The AI approach, while valid, is a crap shoot and depends upon on orders of magnitude leaps in processing power.
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That’s been my contention with profiling vs. modeling, profiling is static, modeling is dynamic.

AI isn’t going to change that unless they capture every permutation of every knob and their interactions, along with every reaction of the amplifier to the guitar’s pickups, and the amp’s reaction to all different speaker’s impedances at volume at all frequencies.

Maybe someday, but that’s a ways out.
 
Greg Ferguson said:
That’s been my contention with profiling vs. modeling, profiling is static, modeling is dynamic.

AI isn’t going to change that unless they capture every permutation of every knob and their interactions, along with every reaction of the amplifier to the guitar’s pickups, and the amp’s reaction to all different speaker’s impedances at volume at all frequencies.

Maybe someday, but that’s a ways out.
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You don't actually have to capture every permutation. The AI model receives inputs for each variable. Give it a decent sample of different values and it will interpolate between them.

The problem in my experience is that you can't look at a trained AI system/model and discern what it is doing. So, for example, if you wanted to improve how the amp interacts with the speaker, you really don't have a nexus of code/data to optimize. No more than you can tell me how your brain recalled some long ago event. It "just happens". So, make the AI model larger and it can learn more nuances, but it is hard to predict what it will concentrate on (optimize) other than analyzing your input data.

I love All/ML and was doing research projects with it back in the late 80s (when we called them neural-nets). The technique simply has it's own pros and cons.
 
I think a Kemper/QC/ToneX style "Clone" type block would be unbelievably awesome and you'd get the best of both worlds! It would make all those other implementations obsolete (at least to Fractal users).
 
what do you want with software like tonex ????????? how do you switch presets when you stand on a stage . i push my buttons and have everything i need .even if you can play around with ir's and stuff. there are plenty of cab sims in my fm9 for an instant use.
 
humpfrey said:
what do you want with software like tonex ????????? how do you switch presets when you stand on a stage . i push my buttons and have everything i need .even if you can play around with ir's and stuff. there are plenty of cab sims in my fm9 for an instant use.
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You setup the computer and get someone to click a mouse. Just don’t install any windows updates prior to the gig.

Ever hear of home recording before?
 
of course my boy , i loaded tonex , tried it out and erased it . i used guitar rig 5, thu overloud , ik multimedia everything i could get and am glad of beeing landed in the arms of fractal finally for playing live !!! and i use cubase, wavelab and pro tools a long time now.
 
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