To Tube or Not to Tube With an FX8...

Jalevinemd

Jalevinemd

Inspired
I have never owned anything but tube amps. I currently have:

2 Fender Twin Reverb Reissues
Fender Hot Rod DeVille
50W Hiwatt combo
Vintage Hiwatt DR103 and 4x12 cab
PRS Original Sewell and two 4x12 cabs

I'm considering a new amp - at least for taking to practice and possibly gigging as well. While I love my tube amps for their tone, they are heavy as shit. Considering the fact that I am getting everything from my FX8 including all overdrive and distortion, do I really need a tube amp? Their obvious advantage is the warm, natural overdrive...but I don't use them for that. So...if I rely on my amp solely as a clean platform from which to let the FX8 work its tonal magic, would I be happy with solid state? Curious to know anyone's experience with the FX8 and non-tune amps.
 
Admin M@ said:
Have you ruled out an Axe-Fx or AX8?
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I'm using the FX8 purely as the most amazing pedalboard ever created. Having read a lot of the posts, I was under the impression that for those of us using the FX8 in that way with an amp, the AX8 was not the best choice.
 
The AX8 and FX8 make an amazing duo. We actually designed some of the MIDI features of the AX8 specifically with this in mind. Mark Day played through this setup in the office for a few weeks and we all really loved it. Joe and I still call it "the killer app"

Since the AX8 and FX8 offer the same effect block types, there are three ways to set it up:

FX8 as PRE FX with AX8 as Amp/Cab + Post FX
FX8 in 4CM with AX8 as the "amp"
FX8 as POST FX with AX8 as pre-FX + Amp/Cab

I prefer the third option. 4CM introduces a small bit of extra latency and I find that the AX8 has more than enough juice to handle all of your pre FX as well as amp+cab.

If you like the FX8 as a "pedalboard" then the first option would also be great for you. You'll be able to run Amp, Cab, plus a HIGH quality stereo reverb and still find the AX8 only at about 50% CPU utilization.

Or, you could skip the CAB block, run into a power amp, and use one of your favorite 4x12 speakers.
 
Wow! Talk about the ultimate rig. :sunglasses:

Still left, though, with the issue of how the FX8 or AX8 would sound with a solid state amp as opposed to a tube. Given my current practice and gigging situation, I will have to use an amp...and for ease of portability, that amp is going to be a combo.
 
Jalevinemd said:
I have never owned anything but tube amps. I currently have:

2 Fender Twin Reverb Reissues
Fender Hot Rod DeVille
50W Hiwatt combo
Vintage Hiwatt DR103 and 4x12 cab
PRS Original Sewell and two 4x12 cabs

I'm considering a new amp - at least for taking to practice and possibly gigging as well. While I love my tube amps for their tone, they are heavy as shit. Considering the fact that I am getting everything from my FX8 including all overdrive and distortion, do I really need a tube amp? Their obvious advantage is the warm, natural overdrive...but I don't use them for that. So...if I rely on my amp solely as a clean platform from which to let the FX8 work its tonal magic, would I be happy with solid state? Curious to know anyone's experience with the FX8 and non-tune amps.
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Specific to your original question, I think most guitarists will suggest you'd be less happy with solid state. Even and especially when used as a clean platform. Solid state amplifiers are sterile, without any of the natural compression or harmonic overtones that vacuum tubes produce. Not just for overdriven tones but for clean tones as well. Look at it this way: there's a reason that the most advanced amp modeler in the world has only one solid state model.

More specifically: overdrive and distortion pedals sound like buzzy terribleness when feeding into a solid state amp. No one uses a JC-120 as a clean platform for the pedalboards.

If you are definitely going the small combo route, a modded Blues Jr can sound amazing. A Deluxe Reverb is also an option -a lot less heavy than those Twins.

If you had an AX8, you could consider a small solid state amp, use the amp sims but ditch the cab sims. Or you could get a lightweight FRFR like the CLR Neo.
 
philipacamaniac said:
If you had an AX8, you could consider a small solid state amp, use the amp sims but ditch the cab sims. Or you could get a lightweight FRFR like the CLR Neo.
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I've been considering one of the Quilter Tone Blocks and a 1x12. The AX8 with something like the CLR Neo could work as well. Of course, it involves buying an AX8. Something to think about. :rolleyes:
 
Jalevinemd said:
I've been considering one of the Quilter Tone Blocks and a 1x12. The AX8 with something like the CLR Neo could work as well. Of course, it involves buying an AX8. Something to think about. :rolleyes:
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From what I've seen, a power amp like quilter, matrix etc... work great as a platform for an amp modeler like the AX8 but lack as standalone amplifier with an effects processor like the FX8.
 
I feel your pain. At 62 years old...My Super Reverb was killing my arm.

I need a tube amp on stage to get my mojo.

Solution: Egnater Rebel 20 head through a single speaker cab....With an SM58 on it

It's loud enough to get me in trouble with everyone on the stage. :)

and... easy to carry as it's a light 20 watt head and separate speaker design.

This works for me!

BTW...This is a single channel amp...Get the Rebel 30 if you need channel switching

Here it is set about 90 percent clean.

 
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Admin M@ said:
The AX8 and FX8 make an amazing duo. We actually designed some of the MIDI features of the AX8 specifically with this in mind. Mark Day played through this setup in the office for a few weeks and we all really loved it. Joe and I still call it "the killer app"

Since the AX8 and FX8 offer the same effect block types, there are three ways to set it up:

FX8 as PRE FX with AX8 as Amp/Cab + Post FX
FX8 in 4CM with AX8 as the "amp"
FX8 as POST FX with AX8 as pre-FX + Amp/Cab

I prefer the third option. 4CM introduces a small bit of extra latency and I find that the AX8 has more than enough juice to handle all of your pre FX as well as amp+cab.

If you like the FX8 as a "pedalboard" then the first option would also be great for you. You'll be able to run Amp, Cab, plus a HIGH quality stereo reverb and still find the AX8 only at about 50% CPU utilization.

Or, you could skip the CAB block, run into a power amp, and use one of your favorite 4x12 speakers.
Click to expand...
I'm so close to doing this myself
 
MMike said:
I feel your pain. At 62 years old...My Super Reverb was killing my arm.

I need a tube amp on stage to get my mojo.

Solution: Egnater Rebel 20 head through a single speaker cab....With an SM58 on it

It's loud enough to get me in trouble with everyone on the stage. :)

and... easy to carry as it's a light 20 watt head and separate speaker design.

This works for me!

BTW...This is a single channel amp...Get the Rebel 30 if you need channel switching

Here it is set about 90 percent clean.

Click to expand...


I agree that solid state just ain't the thing--at least for me. For a bit more (arguably too much) the Friedman Mini Dirty Shirley is a KILLER tiny amp. 20 watts but it's got major balls! Tone and feel for days. Zero loss fx loop so FX8 in 4cm is awesome. That, with a 1-12 would kill and be very small n light. I have one that I'm using mostly as my "desk amp" into a Torpedo Live, mixer, headphones...however I've used it in rehearsals and it is pretty loud. That said, I'd expect to need it fed to my wedge to really pull it off live.
 
Well...I picked up a Quilter 101 Mini Head. It weighs 2 lbs. I A/B'd it with my Hiwatt 50W combo amp and I have to say that this thing sounds very tube-like. I think the same way that Fractal has redefined amp, cab and effect modeling, so have other companies done the same with solid state amps. They really have come a long way over the years and probably don't all deserved the shitty reputation that they've been labeled with. I am truly blown away by this product!

It has five separate amp voicings, including Tweed and Jazz (for super clean tones). The one I prefer is modeled after EL 34 and 84 British Tube amps. It is scalable from 2 watts to greater that 50W. It has clean headroom for days and sounds amazing with the FX8. There's also a built in effects loop. Now I'll just need to find a nice 1x12 cab to go with it and then I'm fairly certain that I've got an incredibly light weight and portable alternative. I'll see how it does in a live setting in the next week or two, once I've settled on a cab, but so far I couldn't be happier. If you guys want to give your backs a rest...give one of these things a try. :sunglasses:
 
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Sonofiam said:
From what I've seen, a power amp like quilter, matrix etc... work great as a platform for an amp modeler like the AX8 but lack as standalone amplifier with an effects processor like the FX8.
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I just picked up one of the Quilter 101 Mini Heads. They aren't pure power amps. They have modeled tones in them and they sound amazing with the FX8. See my above post. :D
 
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There's at least one really cool fx8/quilter demo on YouTube. If I wasn't happy with my amps I'd definitely consider one!
 
Jalevinemd said:
I have never owned anything but tube amps. I currently have:

2 Fender Twin Reverb Reissues
Fender Hot Rod DeVille
50W Hiwatt combo
Vintage Hiwatt DR103 and 4x12 cab
PRS Original Sewell and two 4x12 cabs

I'm considering a new amp - at least for taking to practice and possibly gigging as well. While I love my tube amps for their tone, they are heavy as shit. Considering the fact that I am getting everything from my FX8 including all overdrive and distortion, do I really need a tube amp? Their obvious advantage is the warm, natural overdrive...but I don't use them for that. So...if I rely on my amp solely as a clean platform from which to let the FX8 work its tonal magic, would I be happy with solid state? Curious to know anyone's experience with the FX8 and non-tune amps.
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Hi, I think that all Fractal products are amazing, it's like Garden of Eden for every guitar player,
For small gigs, maybe you try the Mesa Boogie V-25, it's a great small tube head, that have a build in Cab clone,
So you connect the Fx8 with 4CM,
And if you can have a monitor from the PA system dedicated for you, you don't need your Cabinet, only Fx8 & Mesa V-25 tube head, and you're in heaven
 
philipacamaniac said:
If you are definitely going the small combo route, a modded Blues Jr can sound amazing. A Deluxe Reverb is also an option -a lot less heavy than those Twins.
.
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Hey Philipacamaniac, I have a new FX8 and 2 blues juniors, but they don't have fx loops, and when I test the FX8 with the 4cm method on amps that DO have fx loops, they sound much, much better. Are you aware of a mod to them that would allow an fx loop? If not - which mods do you find worthwhile for them?

Thank you in advance!
 
I'm going into a clean Peavey ValveKing II 50-watt tube combo with my FX8 and love it! Great clean platform without breaking the bank.
 
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