Tips for filling out tones in a rock trio?

[App12]

Add some backing tracks.

 

[unix-guy]

3. I don't think this has been mentioned, but dirty up the bass as needed. If you take a solo, that's a prime time for the bass to kick it in second gear and to help fill that midrange freq space that will be lacking, some dirt can help here. There isn't any place to hide in a power trio and the bass, which normally is just felt, will be more noticeable.

I was just going to post that part of the job should fall to the bassist.

This tip above is good for the solo sections.

Also, the bassist can fill out by using diads or partial chords in certain parts.

 

[fcs101]

Add some backing tracks.

There's a whole list of pros and cons that go with that. One thing that is related to a backing track is the use of a pad. You can roll it in subtly so that the audience may not even notice; it sort of partially fills that gap of not having keys.

 

[aflynt]

I tended to use more delay when I was doing similar tunes 3 piece. 500ms or so, dark (used a Carbon Copy at the time) and just a couple repeats. I‘d usually kick that in for solos. For rhythm it wasn’t so much of an issue since I’d just play busier rhythm parts. Some SRV style solos are fine dryish too. It’s just the single note kind of stuff where you really need to fill things out I found.

-Aaron

 

[Bodde]

I was just going to post that part of the job should fall to the bassist.

Also, the bassist can fill out by using diads or partial chords in certain parts.

That’s why I love to play in trios when I play bass. I need that space to be able to do my thing. I hate to play in bands with two guitars. Sometimes I even prefer to have no guitar at all....
Especially when you have a rock player with too much lows in his sound.

 

[unix-guy]

That’s why I love to play in trios when I play bass. I need that space to be able to do my thing. I hate to play in bands with two guitars. Sometimes I even prefer to have no guitar at all....
Especially when you have a rock player with too much lows in his sound.

Well... I think you're also an exceptional bassist, so that helps

 

[USMC_Trev]

I'm surprised n one has yet to mention adding a synth block to thicken the sound.

 

[unix-guy]

I'm surprised n one has yet to mention adding a synth block to thicken the sound.

The Synth block is monophonic so this would not likely work in most cases.

 

[USMC_Trev]

The Synth block is monophonic so this would not likely work in most cases.

Add enhancer block for the stereoizer
Enhancer block
Or, just use the enhancer block for what it does. It does tend to thicken all on its own. Folks seem to think of it as a relic of the FX/Ultra/II days, but it’s still relevant.

 

[Bodde]

Well... I think you're also an exceptional bassist, so that helps

Well thanks!

 

[Bodde]

I'm surprised n one has yet to mention adding a synth block to thicken the sound.

It's quite a risk to use the synth block live. False triggering is on the lookout.

 

[Exocet]

Are you playing through a PA or is your MF10 doing all of the hard work?
If you are using a single MF10 (backline sound only) then as suggested earlier, adding a 2nd MF10 slave cab and working in stereo will fill things out.
I play with MF10 and one thing I'm conscious of is that my "go to" amp would be an open backed Fender combo. To my ears, you can't replicate the sound dispersion (room filling sound) of an open backed combo with a single closed back FRFR cab - when the FRFR is the only sound source for your guitar.

I'm thinking of moving to a Barefaced Reality 1 x12 Cab which is designed to give a better sound dispersion pattern. If that works, I'll go back to working with only one cab on stage.

 

[USMC_Trev]

It's quite a risk to use the synth block live. False triggering is on the lookout.

Bury it in the preset mix. It's not supposed to stand out at all, just add a little flour to the pan sauce.

 

[macfly]

I've just started a band and am the sole guitar, but we have keys. I still think stereo guitar will really help fatten the band up so I've created my first stereo presets, using two amps/cabs. I have a main amp/cab that occupies both channels (but panned slightly to my side) and then add a second amp/cab panned hard to the opposite side from me, thinking it will sound like a second guitar...I settled on 20ms delay on the second guitar...just trying to mimic the differences in attack of two different players. I'm also finding that certain amps work well, and often having the second amp a little cleaner and brighter seems to help. There are some situations where I'm using dual delays near the end of the chain for U2 and Police type stuff, or for solos, but most of the time I just have the 20ms delay on, which is only on the second amp. Mind you I've not tried this in a PA yet, but it sounds amazing in my IEMs, and with sparing use of stereo chorus, flange, etc. its even better. Does this sound like a reasonable approach? Anything I'm missing to make it even better?

PS I also tried having a modifier randomly change the delay on the second guitar from like 20 to 70ms, but the shifting delay was weird.

 

[Will Chen]

I played in a trio for a long time and really I think the best "trick" is to dial in a sound that fits the group, nothing more nothing less. If you sound thin you need more mids. No amount of delay or modulation is going to fix that.

 

[macfly]

I played in a trio for a long time and really I think the best "trick" is to dial in a sound that fits the group, nothing more nothing less. If you sound thin you need more mids. No amount of delay or modulation is going to fix that.

Not trying to fix a bad guitar tone. What I’m doing is the same thing you hear on most studio recordings. Doubling guitars, vocals, snare drums etc is about creating subtle differences in the stereo field that make things bigger. It depends on what you’re going for…probably don’t wanna double guitar on an SRV thing, but definitely do for a lot of other things. Example: ACDC You Shook Me starts with one guitar that is far from thin and halfway into the first verse the second comes in…its bigger.

Also, I’m just curious to see how it will translate in the PA in a club. I have all of this potential in the AF3, and I’m interested to see what it’ll do. It may be negligible or it may muddy up the mix, and if the latter, I’ll go back to mono. But it may be great!!!

 

[Will Chen]

Not trying to fix a bad guitar tone. What I’m doing is the same thing you hear on most studio recordings. Doubling guitars, vocals, snare drums etc is about creating subtle differences in the stereo field that make things bigger. It depends on what you’re going for…probably don’t wanna double guitar on an SRV thing, but definitely do for a lot of other things. Example: ACDC You Shook Me starts with one guitar that is far from thin and halfway into the first verse the second comes in…its bigger.

Also, I’m just curious to see how it will translate in the PA in a club. I have all of this potential in the AF3, and I’m interested to see what it’ll do. It may be negligible or it may muddy up the mix, and if the latter, I’ll go back to mono. But it may be great!!!

I was actually replying to the op not specifically to you. I understand all the studio tricks in terms of widening the stereo field, I'm just not a fan of doing that stuff in a live setting as stereo really needs a proper listening position for it to work as intended.

 

[Master of Nothing]

I play in a trio also. On all my presets, I have one scene that thickens my sound…..using the Pitch Detune +8/-8.

 

[macfly]

I was actually replying to the op not specifically to you. I understand all the studio tricks in terms of widening the stereo field, I'm just not a fan of doing that stuff in a live setting as stereo really needs a proper listening position for it to work as intended.

Fair point!

 

[warlockII]

Stereo works live. I don't get these people that claim it only works in one position...do they only run their home stereos in mono since otherwise it would only sound good in one seat?